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Electric guitar wormhole?
Posted on 6/23/16 at 9:34 am
Posted on 6/23/16 at 9:34 am
Say you buy a guitar and work yourself to an intermediate player? How much equipment is needed and how much money to get the sound or a facsimile of the sounds that you wanted?
Meaning, how many pedals, boxes, and amplifiers are needed? To either sound just like or reasonably emulate most popular rock and blues guitar?
Removing guys like The Edge and Johnny Marr, how much gear does one need?
Or better yet is there a piece of gear that can get you there mostly?
For discussion sake, you're playing a Stratocaster.
Meaning, how many pedals, boxes, and amplifiers are needed? To either sound just like or reasonably emulate most popular rock and blues guitar?
Removing guys like The Edge and Johnny Marr, how much gear does one need?
Or better yet is there a piece of gear that can get you there mostly?
For discussion sake, you're playing a Stratocaster.
Posted on 6/23/16 at 9:57 am to LSU alum wannabe
Well that depends a lot on what sound you're looking for.
If you're just a hobbyist you can most likely get by with a small modelling amp or some modelling software and a tablet or laptop. The amp I use for most of my practicing is a Fender G-DEC 30. It can emulate just about any amp and effect you can think of. There are a lot of similar ones on the market for reasonable prices.
If you want to go to the next step, then get a tube amp and a handful of analog pedals. At minimum you'll probably need one or two distortion pedals plus whatever other effects you might want to use like chorus, echo, phase shifter, etc. You may need a reverb pedal if your amp doesn't have a reverb tank. I'd also recommend an EQ pedal and a tuner. My effects chain is:
Volume -> Wah -> EQ -> Compressor -> Distortion -> Chorus -> Volume -> Amp
|-> Tuner
The first volume pedal has two outputs so one of those goes to a tuner and the other goes to the rest of the pedals.
If you're just a hobbyist you can most likely get by with a small modelling amp or some modelling software and a tablet or laptop. The amp I use for most of my practicing is a Fender G-DEC 30. It can emulate just about any amp and effect you can think of. There are a lot of similar ones on the market for reasonable prices.
If you want to go to the next step, then get a tube amp and a handful of analog pedals. At minimum you'll probably need one or two distortion pedals plus whatever other effects you might want to use like chorus, echo, phase shifter, etc. You may need a reverb pedal if your amp doesn't have a reverb tank. I'd also recommend an EQ pedal and a tuner. My effects chain is:
Volume -> Wah -> EQ -> Compressor -> Distortion -> Chorus -> Volume -> Amp
|-> Tuner
The first volume pedal has two outputs so one of those goes to a tuner and the other goes to the rest of the pedals.
This post was edited on 6/23/16 at 10:14 am
Posted on 6/23/16 at 10:02 am to MountainTiger
quote:
MountainTiger
Thank you. You steered me away for a few years. That shite sounds exhausting. And sounds like many trips to guitar center where I am at the mercy of either an honest dude or some dipshit trying to sell me shite I have no business with.
Posted on 6/23/16 at 10:10 am to LSU alum wannabe
It's a deep rabbit hole but it's fun. :)
I got most of my stuff from eBay or Craigslist and I tend to avoid Guitar Center like it's radioactive. But with an iPad and a good modelling program, you don't even need an amp. Then one day if you do decide you want to invest in some pedals you'll know which ones you want from having played around with them on your iPad already.
I got most of my stuff from eBay or Craigslist and I tend to avoid Guitar Center like it's radioactive. But with an iPad and a good modelling program, you don't even need an amp. Then one day if you do decide you want to invest in some pedals you'll know which ones you want from having played around with them on your iPad already.
Posted on 6/23/16 at 11:01 am to LSU alum wannabe
I'm mostly a "bedroom" guitar player, but have been playing for over 10 years. I have a Fender Blues Jr. coupled with a tube screamer, compressor pedal, Dunlop cry baby wah, q-tron envelope filter and a loop station.
3/4 of the time I'm plugging straight into the amp with no pedals at all. Tube amps react to the way you play, so a lot of your tone and sound will come from your own playing.
At most I think the only pedal truly necessary for your purposes is an overdrive pedal to get that extra boost and saturation in your tone. IMO you become a better player by initially learning how to play with the bare minimum.
3/4 of the time I'm plugging straight into the amp with no pedals at all. Tube amps react to the way you play, so a lot of your tone and sound will come from your own playing.
At most I think the only pedal truly necessary for your purposes is an overdrive pedal to get that extra boost and saturation in your tone. IMO you become a better player by initially learning how to play with the bare minimum.
Posted on 6/23/16 at 5:23 pm to LSU alum wannabe
quote:
Or better yet is there a piece of gear that can get you there mostly?
AxeFX will do everything that you described. It is pricey but definitely cheaper than buying all the pedals and amps you could want. A cheaper option is the Line6 Pod HD Pro.
Posted on 6/23/16 at 7:37 pm to LSU alum wannabe
Cheap starter amp with effects
VOX 15 II
this may works fine for someone that want more than a basic amp as the learn the craft.
VOX 15 about $230
This is the one I have (Vox 15) but my is older but almost identical except for the style/look of the amp.
VOX 15 II
this may works fine for someone that want more than a basic amp as the learn the craft.
VOX 15 about $230
This is the one I have (Vox 15) but my is older but almost identical except for the style/look of the amp.
This post was edited on 6/23/16 at 7:45 pm
Posted on 6/23/16 at 9:38 pm to LSU alum wannabe
I practice thru a little fender champ with an 8 inch speaker. when performing I use a fender hot rod deluxe tube amp. my pedals in order are tuner, distortion, blues driver, and delay. if I need some reverb I just use the amp reverb.
Posted on 6/24/16 at 7:02 am to LSU alum wannabe
It is about 3% gear, 30% innate musical talent (ear, timing, rhythm, feel) and 67% practice.
Play what you have, rather than accumulate more gear has always been my recommendation (and I would not consider myself a true intermediate. I can play a few bars of dozens of songs - so take it FWIW.)
Play what you have, rather than accumulate more gear has always been my recommendation (and I would not consider myself a true intermediate. I can play a few bars of dozens of songs - so take it FWIW.)
Posted on 6/24/16 at 8:17 am to LSU alum wannabe
quote:
How much equipment is needed and how much money to get the sound or a facsimile of the sounds that you wanted?
That is mostly in the hands and in the mind man. You have got to put SO MUCH WORK IN to get to sounding and emulating tones of the greats that you hear. I have been obsessed with SRV since I was about 7-8 years old and have worked a lot to get to where I can sound like him (his style, not sound like him necessarily), but the majority of it came from me putting the time in and knowing where to put the passion into playing. A bend sounds different when you put your heart into it than just looking up a tab and playing the lick. Look at the opening lick in "The Sky Is Crying" for example. That can take years to master, and a lot may never even get there no matter how much they practice. You have to have talent.
As you progress, gear then begins to matter more so that you can get the most out of your talent level, which you will only truly know where that line is after putting in a ton of time. A great player can make a $150 Squier Strat through a $100 Marshall MG Combo shite on itself, and a crappy player can make a $5k Les Paul R9 through a $3k Bogner Ecstasy sound like shite. You swap the two scenarios and the great player will still sound great and the beginning player will sound like shite.
To answer your question directly, I think $1k can get you a solid setup that would allow you to get in the ballpark of whatever tones you are shooting for IF you put the work and time into to becoming a really good player.
Example gear list if you're a very good player and are playing in a top 40's band -
Fender Standard Mexi Fat Strat on ebay - $400
Fender Blues Junior 15w 1x12 combo on ebay - $375
Fulltone Fulldrive 2 pedal - $115
Dunlop Crybaby Mini Wah - $99
This would be versatile enough to cover almost anything.
Let's say you have a $1500 budget. I used to be of the belief that you should spend more on the amp and skimp on the guitar but recently some incredible sounds bargain priced tube amps have come out that will blow you away.
Fender Bassbreaker 15w 1x12 combo - $650 (holy shite, this little guy)
Orange OR15 Head - $700
Victory Red Dwarf - $900 (more of a boutique company, but this head is amazing. I have one)
I would then spend the rest on the same Fat Strat as above and buy more pedals like a nice Delay/Reverb and some modulation Chorus/Flange and a Compressor.
My current rig that I bring on stage -
Victory Red Dwarf Head
Avatar 2x12 Speaker Cab with Splawn Small Block Speakers
'07 Gibson Les Paul Standard
'05 Warmoth/Fender Deluxe Tele coiltapped
'05 Fender Standard Mexi Strat w/Fat 50's
Budda Wah
Analogman Prince of Tone
Fulltone 2b booster (w/compression)
Boss Tuner
Effects Loop on amp has -
Earthquaker Devices Organ Emulator
Fulltone Mini Dejavibe
Dunlop Carbon Copy Delay
Digitech Hardwire Reverb
That can cover anything from Hendrix, Alice In Chains, Freebird, Uptown Funk, Let's Get It On and everything in between. That's about a $7k setup (I cant believe that, I've never really added it up) but could I do a gig on less? Absolutely. This has just been acquired over 15-20 years and I feel maximizes my playing. (and I like gear and I don't have kids so I can be selfish right now )
All of that was said to get to the point that you can reasonably emulate whatever sound youre looking for on a very modest $1k rig or even less.
Practice > Talent > Quality of gear
Posted on 6/24/16 at 8:17 am to Ace Midnight
quote:
It is about 3% gear, 30% innate musical talent (ear, timing, rhythm, feel) and 67% practice.
Well shite, you said it better than me in about 1300% less words
Posted on 6/24/16 at 8:27 am to dnm3305
quote:
Well shite, you said it better than me in about 1300% less words
The main thing I would add to that - and I used to be of a mind like you suggested, spend more on the amp because you ask the amp to do more different things, and don't want to be limited. Obviously, this being a gear thread, it is more oriented to electric players - I end up playing acoustic 90% of the time, but I spend more on electric stuff - go figure, right?
But, definitely get a guitar you will enjoy playing - if that costs a little more, so be it. Because if you enjoy playing, you will get better - because you will play more. So, that is the caveat - if your heart is set on a Telecaster, find a freakin' Mexi or used one that you will enjoy playing, rather than settling for a Chinese starter guitar that you struggle with keeping in tune, don't like the fret board, has sketchy electronics, etc.
With that caveat - play what you have and, perhaps, take advantage of the Golden age of modeling and use your computer to get a specific tone - I mean how many amps and pedals can you comfortably store in your house? With a USB interface and a good bit of free or cheap software, you can chase any tone you want.
Posted on 6/24/16 at 8:59 am to Ace Midnight
Thanks for all the input.
Currently I have gone only acoustic. Don't even have an amp. What I do need not be amplified. Sometimes the pick is too much amplification.
One day I intend to get a Dean Markley soundhole pickup. They are cheap and are good enough for John Prine, so who the f--- do I think I am to differ.
I just know that I walk into any guitar shops (GC mainly) and feel lost walking through the electrics. One day I may have a couple beers with lunch and decide to plug one in, and God help all who shop that day.
Currently I have gone only acoustic. Don't even have an amp. What I do need not be amplified. Sometimes the pick is too much amplification.
One day I intend to get a Dean Markley soundhole pickup. They are cheap and are good enough for John Prine, so who the f--- do I think I am to differ.
I just know that I walk into any guitar shops (GC mainly) and feel lost walking through the electrics. One day I may have a couple beers with lunch and decide to plug one in, and God help all who shop that day.
Posted on 6/24/16 at 9:13 am to LSU alum wannabe
quote:
I just know that I walk into any guitar shops (GC mainly) and feel lost walking through the electrics
If you are just looking to get your foot in the door, I would do what Ace said and go the modeling amp route. The Marshall Code Series just released sounds pretty damn good and is $200. That's an incredible bargain for what youre getting. This could be a good cheap option for you.
Posted on 6/24/16 at 10:06 am to dnm3305
quote:
Fulltone Mini Dejavibe
I just got one of these and love it. Great swirly phase shifter/chorus Robin Trower effects. In fact I'm a big fan of Fulltone pedals in general. Pricey but worth it, especially if you can find used ones.
Posted on 6/24/16 at 10:19 am to MountainTiger
quote:
I just got one of these and love it. Great swirly phase shifter/chorus Robin Trower effects.
It's pretty great isn't it. Trower is who I think of as well every time I turn it on. It nails that "Machine Gun" Hendrix sound as well.
quote:
In fact I'm a big fan of Fulltone pedals in general.
Me too. The quality of his pedals are 2nd to none.
Posted on 6/24/16 at 10:23 am to LSU alum wannabe
I have a Boss tuner and a Big Muff Pi and those are my only 2 pedals. Oh wait, I'm only a bass player. frick
Posted on 6/24/16 at 10:27 am to dnm3305
quote:
It's pretty great isn't it. Trower is who I think of as well every time I turn it on. It nails that "Machine Gun" Hendrix sound as well.
It does some good SRV stuff too. Thinking "Cold Shot" for example.
I think Trower used the original Univibe and he works very closely with Mike Fuller. So it's no surprise that this pedal nails that Leslie sound better than any of the others over the years.
This post was edited on 6/24/16 at 12:22 pm
Posted on 6/24/16 at 10:43 am to Broke
quote:
Oh wait, I'm only a bass player. frick
Gotta admit, this drew a chuckle.
Posted on 6/24/16 at 11:13 am to LSU alum wannabe
Let's assume you play on a Mexican Strat. Those run between $400 and $600.
I use a fender reverb amp which costs $600-800. It provides that great tube overdrive sound I desire to play most hard rock, but it lacks the crunch for metal.
A really good Wah pedal is around $120.
Metal core pedal runs around $80.
Tuner pedal goes for around 40.
Chorus pedal is around $80.
Power supply is around $30/ pedal=$120
Decent chords will run approxinately $20 for each of the two long ones and about $6 each for the ones between each pedal, $80 total.
Add it all up and that's
$400-600 for the guitar
$600-800 for the amp
$520 for the pedals and effects.
Personally, I don't use any pedals or effects except the settings on my amp, which I got used for $400. Plugging a $100 squire strat into that would be a cheap way to get a great classic rock sound.
I use a fender reverb amp which costs $600-800. It provides that great tube overdrive sound I desire to play most hard rock, but it lacks the crunch for metal.
A really good Wah pedal is around $120.
Metal core pedal runs around $80.
Tuner pedal goes for around 40.
Chorus pedal is around $80.
Power supply is around $30/ pedal=$120
Decent chords will run approxinately $20 for each of the two long ones and about $6 each for the ones between each pedal, $80 total.
Add it all up and that's
$400-600 for the guitar
$600-800 for the amp
$520 for the pedals and effects.
Personally, I don't use any pedals or effects except the settings on my amp, which I got used for $400. Plugging a $100 squire strat into that would be a cheap way to get a great classic rock sound.
This post was edited on 6/24/16 at 11:21 am
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