re: List the college basketball Blue Blood Programs

???

Michigan football has won, what? .5 MNCs in football since the 1940s?

1997 - .5 MNC, only since the 1940s.

Kansas basketball has 1988, 2008, plus nothing resembling Michigan football low points in that time.

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Agree on Louisville

Kansas really milks the Naismith angle...if he didn't coach there...Kansas wouldn't be put on a pedestal with Kentucky, North Carolina and UCLA.

Kansas would be more "Louisville". In football terms, Kansas is more Michigan and less...Oklahoma, Notre Dame, USC and Alabama.

And Indiana plays up the angle that they invented basketball as well as a state.

And by proxy IU has to be up there with Kansas as the epi-centers of basketball, so we're told. I don't care how many kids hit jump shots off barn doors in Indiana...it's what the team has actually done that matters...the school...and I don't care if KU has the original rules of basketball in their athletic center.

Blueblood is about success. Not Hoosiers movies and mythology. Sure those two states might be mad about basketball and might be the best basketball states...

States don't win titles...Universities do.

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I'll give Kansas this: they've been on quite a run of winning during the Williams/Self era, but I don't see it as all that much different than what Louisville has done during the Pitino time frame (since 2001).

1 national title each
4 FFs for Kansas vs. 3 for Louisville
a couple of #1 overalls for both
To their credit, KU hasn't missed the tournament at all while UL missed it twice during that period due to poor play (and another time because of self-imposed sanctions)

Indiana hasn't even been close. I would say they're in danger of becoming Nebraska football, but they're in too good of a location with too good of a brand name. I mean, shite, if they could simply keep kids in state, they'd be something else. They'd have Caleb Swanigan, Trevon Blueitt, Bryant McIntosh, Blackmon (who is already there), Jaquan Lyle, and Zak Irvin on the roster.

How is Top Ten in Final 4 Appearances by school misleading??? As a program, Arkansas is tied for tenth in Final Four appearances.

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Michigan football -

(1901, 1902, 1903, 1904, 1918, 1923, 1932, 1933, 1947, 1948, 1997)

Kansas Basketball - 1952, 1988, 2008

So Michigan won two during Kansas' big title.

And Kansas won two during Michigan's recent title.

Same difference.

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If you're gonna count all of Michigan's claimed titles (6 of which were retroactive) then you have to count KU's Helms titles in basketball.

I think it's a different story.

Basketball got a tourney in 1939. Football never did.

Michigan was the power in college football during the beginning of the 20th century. The absolute power. Nobody really believes their pre-poll titles are folderol. But the AP didn't start until 1936. But unlike the NCAA tournament it was still mythical.

So we can't even quantify Michigan...much less any program even to this day.

But Kansas basketball can be somewhat quantified since they didn't win their first tournament title until 15 years after the tournament was created...then didn't win another one until 1988.

Very similar to Michigan - but with football its all just votes...so you're right...you can't compare.

I just think they have very similar arcs...and Michigan has a better argument for being a better program in their respective sport.

But no one says that Michigan is Top 5 all-time like they do Kansas. Kansas seems to get a pass. And a lot of that seems to have to do with Naismith.

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I think it's a different story.

Basketball got a tourney in 1939. Football never did.

Michigan was the power in college football during the beginning of the 20th century. The absolute power. Nobody really believes their pre-poll titles are folderol. But the AP didn't start until 1936. But unlike the NCAA tournament it was still mythical.

So we can't even quantify Michigan...much less any program even to this day.

But Kansas basketball can be somewhat quantified since they didn't win their first tournament title until 15 years after the tournament was created...then didn't win another one until 1988.

Very similar to Michigan - but with football its all just votes...so you're right...you can't compare.

I just think they have very similar arcs...and Michigan has a better argument for being a better program in their respective sport.

But no one says that Michigan is Top 5 all-time like they do Kansas. Kansas seems to get a pass. And a lot of that seems to have to do with Naismith.

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There's a big difference from a major poll like the AP that's always picked during the present day and retroactively claiming titles based on minor polls that didn't exist until decades later. Michigan has 4 titles from early in the 20th century based on minor polls that didn't even exist until the 1980s.

Edit: And football might not have a proper tournament but there's been a system in place since 98 that everyone agreed to play under with a trophy they all agreed to play for.

And to think, Mizzou was supposed to make the SEC better in basketball because they're a "basketball" school.

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I'm not sure Nova or Georgetown belong.

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Last I heard, there were 47 D-1 head coaches who went to high school or college in Philadelphia. Villanova is in the heart of urban hoops.
They belong. They won the championship in three different decades and currently they are tier 1.
Its not like they fell apart. They lost by 3 to a nice Wisconsin team, which only lost by one point to Florida.

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I think it is more now Tier 1A Carolina, Duke, Kentucky
Then Tier IB UCLA Kansas Michigan St

Michigan St has replaced Indiana as the basketball power from the BIG

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Again, Louisville is more of a power by almost every metric imaginable vis a vis Michigan State. If anyone has replaced IU, it is Louisville, not Michigan State.