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Posted on 1/8/14 at 6:06 pm to Keys Open Doors
Take it how you want to.
Biggio finished top 10 in MVP voting 2 times in 20 years. His career OPS+ of 112 ranks 600th all time behind greats like Milton Bradley and Corey Koskie. His career OPS of .796 is 470th all time behind greats like Dan Uggla and Chet Lemon.
The ultimate complier.
Biggio finished top 10 in MVP voting 2 times in 20 years. His career OPS+ of 112 ranks 600th all time behind greats like Milton Bradley and Corey Koskie. His career OPS of .796 is 470th all time behind greats like Dan Uggla and Chet Lemon.
The ultimate complier.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 6:08 pm to Keys Open Doors
quote:
Frank Thomas and Bagwell have comparable numbers. Thomas got in because he is one of a handful of guys, alongside Maddux, Glavine, Larkin, Griffey Jr., and maybe Biggio who are considered clean by the vast majority of the baseball writers.
It is what it is... Not sure if Bags juiced, [unlike bonds]. But IMO Thomas was an overall better player.. I like Bagwell his '94 season [COULD] have been an epic one.....
Posted on 1/8/14 at 6:14 pm to Smokedawg
I used to love watching Big Frank on WGN as a kid. That man hit some colossal home runs.
I don't know how well-known this is, but Frank played football at Auburn. He had 3 catches for 45 yards in 1986 as a TE. I think Auburn mostly used him as a blocker.
I don't know how well-known this is, but Frank played football at Auburn. He had 3 catches for 45 yards in 1986 as a TE. I think Auburn mostly used him as a blocker.
This post was edited on 1/8/14 at 7:42 pm
Posted on 1/8/14 at 6:44 pm to craigbiggio
quote:
Frank was always a big dude.
Yeah, Frank was naturally a big guy. He entered the league at probably 240-250. Then just progressively got bigger over the years, but never had a roided look.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 6:56 pm to inadaze
The difference is one played in Chicago and one played in Houston. This answers your question. It's the "market".
Posted on 1/8/14 at 8:59 pm to Nativebullet
Bagwell looks like a guy that took PEDs. Thomas is clean. I think that's about it.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 9:15 pm to Nativebullet
That explains why Sosa barely gets any votes.
The shroud of roids is the reason. And Caminiti tragedy set the idea that that clubhouse had roid issues.
Thomas was the better hitter anyway, as the stats show. He should have had 3 MVPs..lost one due to the Boston effect.
The shroud of roids is the reason. And Caminiti tragedy set the idea that that clubhouse had roid issues.
Thomas was the better hitter anyway, as the stats show. He should have had 3 MVPs..lost one due to the Boston effect.
This post was edited on 1/8/14 at 9:17 pm
Posted on 1/8/14 at 9:18 pm to EvrybodysAllAmerican
quote:
This is why the Hall of fame gets more watered down every year. People want to compare stats of a non-HOFer to a low end HOFer and rationalize getting more borderline guys in. The old saying is true. If you have to ask if a guy belongs in the Hall of Fame, he doesnt. Can't anybody just be a very good player without everyone wanting him to be a Hall of famer?
Eventually we'll have to have a "Hall of Fame" for the Hall of Fame to separate the great players from the pretty good ones.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 9:40 pm to Eighteen
Frank Thomas was a super star in a larger market and on a team that was constantly shown nationwide on WGN. Bags has the steroid association and was on a team that wasn't shown on TV much. The Astros didn't get much national attention, even when they were good. It's a popularity contest and Frank Thomas destroys Jeff Bagwell in that sense.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 9:58 pm to Smokedawg
Big Hurt
Posted on 1/8/14 at 11:11 pm to Keys Open Doors
quote:
Raines are also considered clean
While he might not have taken steroids, Raines was not clean. He slid into the bases head first so not to break his vial.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 11:19 pm to TigerintheNO
The big hurt was awesome. Bagwell was a meathead
Posted on 1/9/14 at 12:20 am to MikeD
Was working out at a gym in Houston when Bags was there. He was an active player for the Astros at the time, and was much more muscular in person than he appears in his photos. Anyway, he did take PED's. No way he could get that big with the workout I saw him do that day. I saw all I needed to see; however, he was a great player and deserves all the accolades he is getting. If you take performance enhancing drugs, you will not be as good as Bags, because you must have the talent to enhance. He was a great player.
Posted on 1/9/14 at 12:38 am to Tiger F@g
Maybe it was a light day.
Posted on 1/9/14 at 7:04 am to PrimeTime Money
Not as much doubt on Thomas as his best years were prior to the late 90s early 00s when the juice was really going. He like Griffey Jr seemed to be guys that looked to decline in that era compared to Bonds, Sosa & company.
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