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Small Business Valuation Question
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:39 pm
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:39 pm
This is a complex issue but wanted to get some opinions. Say you want to buy a business who's yearly gross income has been: 900k, 1M, 1.1M since you have started. Would a selling price of 1.3M be out of line?
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:41 pm to LSUSUPERSTAR
Need way more information.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:41 pm to LSUSUPERSTAR
You'd likely want to compare valuations, but 1.3mm seems very low. For an established company, I couldn't imagine making back your entire investment in a year... That would make very little sense to sell.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:44 pm to SouthOfSouth
Unless it's a tech business, it'll more likely be valued based on a multiple of Profit or EBITDA rather than revenue. From the info you provided, we don't even know if the business makes a net profit.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:45 pm to Coach Guidry
This is a small veterinarian clinic. These aren't the actual numbers just a representation of them. I thought the owner coming asking more than he has ever made was too high. These increases in income were due to my wife improving the business.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:46 pm to rlanders23
quote:
we don't even know if the business makes a net profit.
This.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:46 pm to LSUSUPERSTAR
quote:Are those figures for gross income, or revenue?
gross income has been: 900k, 1M, 1.1M
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:48 pm to LSUSUPERSTAR
Yes, it'd be way too low.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:49 pm to LSUSUPERSTAR
what's ebitda?
what kind of assets are involved?
what kind of assets are involved?
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:54 pm to yellowfin
Not sure on ebitda yet. We will get someone in to do a valuation. As potential first time and new business owners, trying to understand what goes it the selling price. Assets are building, some equipment is owned, other equipment is leased.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:56 pm to LSUSUPERSTAR
quote:Not at all. I think you need to clarify whether you meant revenue or profit when you said "gross income". If revenue, price seems in the right ballpark. If profit, price is ridiculously low.
I thought the owner coming asking more than he has ever made was too high.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 2:58 pm to yellowfin
EBITDA is net income with interest, taxes, depreciation, and amortization added back to it, for the most part, or income before those expenses are taken out.
People like it as a comparison basis because it removes the effects of financing and accounting. It's a more raw evaluation.
People like it as a comparison basis because it removes the effects of financing and accounting. It's a more raw evaluation.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 3:00 pm to TigerFanatic99
I know what it is, I was asking what it was on this company
the revenue numbers are useless
Posted on 10/8/14 at 3:07 pm to yellowfin
On a vet clinic you'd also be buying a customer list. It is an asset, and it is depreciable.
Generally on this type of purchase you want to look up fair market values of X times both top and bottom lines, and X times EBITA. These figures might, or might not include tangible assets, but many times in professional businesses they do, predicated on total hard assets. Obviously if there is a $1MM building involved, this also adds to the equation.
It goes without saying that if possible you'd want to purchase assets, but not liabilities. Now if you worked there for years, and this was a stock buy in, you might not need to worry as much about this part. Presumably by virtue of working there, or being a junior partner, you'd have done some degree of due diligence, or at least be aware of long tailed liabilities left hanging. Presumably.
Generally on this type of purchase you want to look up fair market values of X times both top and bottom lines, and X times EBITA. These figures might, or might not include tangible assets, but many times in professional businesses they do, predicated on total hard assets. Obviously if there is a $1MM building involved, this also adds to the equation.
It goes without saying that if possible you'd want to purchase assets, but not liabilities. Now if you worked there for years, and this was a stock buy in, you might not need to worry as much about this part. Presumably by virtue of working there, or being a junior partner, you'd have done some degree of due diligence, or at least be aware of long tailed liabilities left hanging. Presumably.
This post was edited on 10/8/14 at 3:11 pm
Posted on 10/8/14 at 3:20 pm to Iowa Golfer
I know the building is assessed at $190K based on the county appraisal district. That sell price includes the land and building which he owns. Checking on the income numbers.
This post was edited on 10/8/14 at 3:22 pm
Posted on 10/8/14 at 3:20 pm to Iowa Golfer
quick and dirty
assets /liabilities + 150% of yearly net
assets /liabilities + 150% of yearly net
Posted on 10/8/14 at 3:23 pm to Tigerpaw123
Or call your banker. A commercial lender would have an in house valuation methodology for small businesses you would hope.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 3:46 pm to LSUSUPERSTAR
So basically you are buying the building/land (easy enough to value), inventory (very easy to value), fixed assets (a little bit harder to value), with the big part of the business being the client list and work of the employees.
I've seen some professional practices sell at 1X revenues, plus net hard asset value, plus carrying cost of inventory (prob not much)
Needless to say, before you buy anything, you need to have a building appraisal, a busieness appraisal, hire a CPA to do a foresnic review of the books, and hire an attorney to look at the legal stuff. Also, you generally want to buy the assets, not the business. Let the current owner keep the A/R, the debt, and the cash.
I've seen some professional practices sell at 1X revenues, plus net hard asset value, plus carrying cost of inventory (prob not much)
Needless to say, before you buy anything, you need to have a building appraisal, a busieness appraisal, hire a CPA to do a foresnic review of the books, and hire an attorney to look at the legal stuff. Also, you generally want to buy the assets, not the business. Let the current owner keep the A/R, the debt, and the cash.
This post was edited on 10/8/14 at 3:47 pm
Posted on 10/8/14 at 7:34 pm to LSUSUPERSTAR
I did M and A for many years. You really do need more information
Are you buying? A/R; buildings, inventory, customer base- are employees involved? How many customers? Cost of acquiring customers- customer retention etc
There are many questions to answer and you need a seasoned attorney with experience in this area
the price can run from 50% of revenue to 2.5 times revenue-
Are you buying? A/R; buildings, inventory, customer base- are employees involved? How many customers? Cost of acquiring customers- customer retention etc
There are many questions to answer and you need a seasoned attorney with experience in this area
the price can run from 50% of revenue to 2.5 times revenue-
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