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Message
My annual plea to parents of kids starting to think about college
Posted on 5/13/17 at 1:21 pm
Posted on 5/13/17 at 1:21 pm
I attended another college graduation today. My daughter used to like my "funny hat" that I wear and ask what the colors of my regalia meant. Today she asked if I could stop and pick something up for her on my way home.
A subtle reminder that I'm getting older and closer to having to heed this advice myself, but for parents that have kids closer to college, here is a plea from a professor that has seen a lot in my years in higher education.
1. This is not just your child's decision. This is likely one of the biggest decisions they will ever make. Be involved.
2. Explore all of your options. Don't look at a tuition price and automatically not consider. Often the scholarship process is many times more generous at smaller colleges and the net price comes out the same. And check out dual degree options. At Millsaps, there are dual degree programs with Columbia and Vanderbilt, among others.
3. Ask a lot of questions. College has changed since you went.
4. A college's first scholarship offer is no different than a car dealer's. "That's not good enough." are powerful words. An extra $2000, $3000 or even $5000 annually is normally available.
5. Be honest about your child's abilities. This is a big one. The number of kids that come in pre-med with 24 ACT scores is mind boggling. Its not impossible, but it is unlikely.
6. Speaking of majors - look at the return on investment. Accounting, Engineering, Nursing, Computer Related Majors - all worth it. If you are going to major in social work or education, 2 years need to be at a junior college close to home.
7. Set on being a doctor? Consider PA or Nurse Practitioner School. In half the time, you'll be making 70% of the average salary. It will take 29 years to break even, more with student loans.
8. Apply for every $100, $250 and $500 scholarship you can find. The competition is normally not too bad. I know of a student that got 70 of these small scholarships. The Scholly app is a good place to start.
9. A requirement of your child going to college away from home if you are paying for it should be a FERPA waiver.
10. A bachelor's degree is 120-132 hours. That can be done in eight semesters (or less). Don't let your child bullshite you into 6 years of undergrad.
11. Tell your child you will allow for them to change their major one time. Major changes are encouraged by colleges because they mean $$$$.
12. There's nothing wrong with a little discomfort in their living arrangements. I'm not talking about letting them go hungry, but luxury apartments and $50 bar tabs are not your responsibility. That's another hidden expense of big state universities - lots of peer pressure to live in expensive apartments. At smaller colleges, this doesn't exist as much.
13. Encourage a study abroad semester if it will not delay graduation. A student can pick up 12 hours at Oxford or in the rainforests of Costa Rica and have it paid for by their scholarship.
A subtle reminder that I'm getting older and closer to having to heed this advice myself, but for parents that have kids closer to college, here is a plea from a professor that has seen a lot in my years in higher education.
1. This is not just your child's decision. This is likely one of the biggest decisions they will ever make. Be involved.
2. Explore all of your options. Don't look at a tuition price and automatically not consider. Often the scholarship process is many times more generous at smaller colleges and the net price comes out the same. And check out dual degree options. At Millsaps, there are dual degree programs with Columbia and Vanderbilt, among others.
3. Ask a lot of questions. College has changed since you went.
4. A college's first scholarship offer is no different than a car dealer's. "That's not good enough." are powerful words. An extra $2000, $3000 or even $5000 annually is normally available.
5. Be honest about your child's abilities. This is a big one. The number of kids that come in pre-med with 24 ACT scores is mind boggling. Its not impossible, but it is unlikely.
6. Speaking of majors - look at the return on investment. Accounting, Engineering, Nursing, Computer Related Majors - all worth it. If you are going to major in social work or education, 2 years need to be at a junior college close to home.
7. Set on being a doctor? Consider PA or Nurse Practitioner School. In half the time, you'll be making 70% of the average salary. It will take 29 years to break even, more with student loans.
8. Apply for every $100, $250 and $500 scholarship you can find. The competition is normally not too bad. I know of a student that got 70 of these small scholarships. The Scholly app is a good place to start.
9. A requirement of your child going to college away from home if you are paying for it should be a FERPA waiver.
10. A bachelor's degree is 120-132 hours. That can be done in eight semesters (or less). Don't let your child bullshite you into 6 years of undergrad.
11. Tell your child you will allow for them to change their major one time. Major changes are encouraged by colleges because they mean $$$$.
12. There's nothing wrong with a little discomfort in their living arrangements. I'm not talking about letting them go hungry, but luxury apartments and $50 bar tabs are not your responsibility. That's another hidden expense of big state universities - lots of peer pressure to live in expensive apartments. At smaller colleges, this doesn't exist as much.
13. Encourage a study abroad semester if it will not delay graduation. A student can pick up 12 hours at Oxford or in the rainforests of Costa Rica and have it paid for by their scholarship.
This post was edited on 5/13/17 at 1:43 pm
15
Posted on 5/13/17 at 1:44 pm to anc
how much would you estimate it takes to raise a child, ages 0-22?
Posted on 5/13/17 at 2:09 pm to anc
Just spent 1 1/2 on this process with my daughter who is graduating. She was accepted into every school she applied to both small private and large public schools. Berry College, Maryville College, Birmingham Southern, Emory University, UGA, and Georgia Tech.
In the end and after many visits and careful consideration we got down to two. BSC and GT. BSC offered her the Presidential Scholarship at $27,500 per year but total cost of attendance was $48k. At GT, she was covered for full cost of tuition under Zell Miller Scholarship and we found a few other scholarships that will help cover the $16k balance of room and board, meal plan, and fees. We as her parents would be on the hook for about 8k a year at GT.
We decided on GT College of Sciences where she will pursue a major in Bio-Chem or Biology. I hope she is up to the challenge and I have told her that she might discover that she might change her mind after a year of that program. We will see.
If she switches to an engineering degree at some point, the value of graduating from GT at a cost of 8k a year to her mom and I vs. $20k at BSC is the wiser approach. Plus, I work in the Midtown area daily and can be there for when/if she needs something. Just a better decision for everyone.
I am a UGA Alum and lived in Athens for 3 more years after I graduated. She had little interest in going there and I never pushed it on her because I know UGA does not fit her personality. She is a bookworm and has never had a sip of Alchohol in her life. I was an outgoing party animal who partied a lot. She would have been way out of her element there.
I have to start this process again in a year and a half for my rising sophomore. Two more after that. Oh Lord!
In the end and after many visits and careful consideration we got down to two. BSC and GT. BSC offered her the Presidential Scholarship at $27,500 per year but total cost of attendance was $48k. At GT, she was covered for full cost of tuition under Zell Miller Scholarship and we found a few other scholarships that will help cover the $16k balance of room and board, meal plan, and fees. We as her parents would be on the hook for about 8k a year at GT.
We decided on GT College of Sciences where she will pursue a major in Bio-Chem or Biology. I hope she is up to the challenge and I have told her that she might discover that she might change her mind after a year of that program. We will see.
If she switches to an engineering degree at some point, the value of graduating from GT at a cost of 8k a year to her mom and I vs. $20k at BSC is the wiser approach. Plus, I work in the Midtown area daily and can be there for when/if she needs something. Just a better decision for everyone.
I am a UGA Alum and lived in Athens for 3 more years after I graduated. She had little interest in going there and I never pushed it on her because I know UGA does not fit her personality. She is a bookworm and has never had a sip of Alchohol in her life. I was an outgoing party animal who partied a lot. She would have been way out of her element there.
I have to start this process again in a year and a half for my rising sophomore. Two more after that. Oh Lord!
Posted on 5/13/17 at 2:09 pm to anc
quote:
10. A bachelor's degree is 120-132 hours. That can be done in eight semesters (or less). Don't let your child bullshite you into 6 years of undergrad.
Boo. You suck.
Posted on 5/13/17 at 2:27 pm to rocket31
About $210k to provide a healthy diet, quality clothing, average medical expenses, activities(sports, etc.). That is not including the cost of a vehicle and college. Roughly 5k a year to cover the basics at a non poor level.
Posted on 5/13/17 at 2:35 pm to Dick Leverage
Ya Google says it's about $260k without college
Seemed high.
Still, it's crazy to think about
Seemed high.
Still, it's crazy to think about
Posted on 5/13/17 at 2:47 pm to rocket31
Man, I have 4 under 18. It is real even when you are concious of your expenditures. Freaking something all the time. Money for field trips. Money for a new bat or glove. Money for dance costumes. Etc.. It adds up over a year.
Posted on 5/13/17 at 2:59 pm to anc
I agree with all except #6. The quality of education at a junior college is significantly lower than a university. I speak as someone who is currently an instructor at a junior college.
Treating college as a stepping stone to employment (and investment returns) is nullifying the purpose of going to college. Networking, critical thinking, and exposure to multiple perspectives are some of the most important components of a college education. An accountant isn't inherently more deserving of having a better all-around education than a social worker or teacher simply because he or she is going to make more money later.
Treating college as a stepping stone to employment (and investment returns) is nullifying the purpose of going to college. Networking, critical thinking, and exposure to multiple perspectives are some of the most important components of a college education. An accountant isn't inherently more deserving of having a better all-around education than a social worker or teacher simply because he or she is going to make more money later.
This post was edited on 5/13/17 at 3:00 pm
Posted on 5/13/17 at 3:02 pm to anc
quote:
6. Speaking of majors - look at the return on investment. Accounting, Engineering, Nursing, Computer Related Majors - all worth it. If you are going to major in social work or education, 2 years need to be at a junior college close to home.
One caveat:
High dollar majors will draw more people to that major and in the long run reduce salaries. So you'll want to be at the front of the herd.
Posted on 5/13/17 at 3:07 pm to StringedInstruments
My point about junior college (and I abhor junior college) is that for majors like social work and education, it literally does not matter to your salary if your degree is from Harvard or SUNO in 97 percent of the circumstances. So for the best return on investment, go cheap.
This post was edited on 5/13/17 at 3:28 pm
Posted on 5/13/17 at 3:10 pm to Dick Leverage
quote:
We decided on GT College of Sciences where she will pursue a major in Bio-Chem or Biology. I hope she is up to the challenge and I have told her that she might discover that she might change her mind after a year of that program. We will see.
I would reccomend staying away from Biology as a major. I would maybe even say BioChem. I would recommend doing Chemistry if you were leaning towards Biology. Most people end up in Biology because they do pre-med which oversaturates the degree. You also have to go to a professional or graduate program after obtaining those degrees.
IMO your best bet would be Biological Engineering, Chemical Engineering, or Biochemical Engineering depending on what is offered. I am sure GT offers some version of BioEngineering. This will expand options, allow for any path that Biology/BioChem will offer, and offer an out for a job with her BS if she chooses not to go any further in education.
Posted on 5/13/17 at 3:13 pm to Bestbank Tiger
I would say typically these high dollar majors weed out enough people to protect their earning power. Many of the fields also seem to not be close to reaching a max capacity or you still end up in a better place then other options.
The one field I would disagree on is Petroleum Engineering.
The one field I would disagree on is Petroleum Engineering.
Posted on 5/13/17 at 3:21 pm to anc
quote:
9. A requirement of your child going to college away from home if you are paying for it should be a FERPA waiver.
Great advice.
Posted on 5/13/17 at 3:53 pm to TigerGrl73
My son graduated from Old Dominion University last Saturday and my daughter will get her Masters from George Mason next Friday.
I'm done with college and they both have jobs!!!!
I'm done with college and they both have jobs!!!!
Posted on 5/14/17 at 2:21 am to anc
14. Visit an advisor with your kid and set out a plan. Stick to the plan.
15. Take as many summer classes thru a local JUCO or online JUCO as possible. You end up with a very light senior year. More time for travel as you mentioned or job interviews.
15. Take as many summer classes thru a local JUCO or online JUCO as possible. You end up with a very light senior year. More time for travel as you mentioned or job interviews.
This post was edited on 5/14/17 at 2:24 am
Posted on 5/14/17 at 2:58 am to anc
quote:
A bachelor's degree is 120-132 hours. That can be done in eight semesters (or less). Don't let your child bullshite you into 6 years of undergrad.
Only advice I disagree with, not in principle, but because it ignores two very big variables:
1) Curriculum structure: A great many curriculum are loaded with bottlenecks of required courses that may not be available in a section compatible with the student's schedule that particular semester, as well has coursework being sequential in nature. This is never a brick wall, but it is certainly an impediment to completing a degree "on time." You can easily miss graduating in 8 semesters due to this in spite of excelling in all of your classes, and capable and willing of a higher course load if you literally can't take the additional class.
A problem which is compounded with:
2) Any major change is going to set the student back if he doesn't do it his freshmen year. Impact will obviously vary based on ratio of major coursework vs gen requirements taken, but in general if you change in your sophomore year or later, you are going to get pretty close to that 10 semester mark for graduation, if not the 12 semester.
This post was edited on 5/14/17 at 6:22 pm
Posted on 5/14/17 at 3:01 am to Colonel Flagg
quote:
I would reccomend staying away from Biology as a major. I would maybe even say BioChem. I would recommend doing Chemistry if you were leaning towards Biology. Most people end up in Biology because they do pre-med which oversaturates the degree. You also have to go to a professional or graduate program after obtaining those degrees.
Agree with everything except adding Biochem with it. I would even argue microbiology degree seperates from the mold.
But yes, a generic biology degree is essentially worthless repository of failed premeds.
Posted on 5/14/17 at 7:44 am to Volvagia
Points about curriculum structure and major changes are valid....one way to hedge against these & have more flexibility/freedom in college is to earn college credit before leaving high school. Many HS now have dual-enrollment courses; you can earn college credit in biology, English, or applied classes right in the high school setting. Or, if your college-bound child is capable, apply for early enrollment at the local junior college & take similar coursework that will transfer to the general education requirements of most degree programs. Sitting for the AP exams is a PITA, but collecting 3 credits for a decent score in history or English will make the exploratory semesters of college less stressful. Everyone needs to drop a class from time to time, or decides that a major just isn't right.
Encourage your college kids to take a second major (or do two minors) in fields unrelated to the primary major: this expands their thinking as well as their job prospects. That aforementioned social work degree plus a minor in accounting is a great combination for someone looking to work in nonprofit administration; ditto for education and management.
Encourage your college kids to take a second major (or do two minors) in fields unrelated to the primary major: this expands their thinking as well as their job prospects. That aforementioned social work degree plus a minor in accounting is a great combination for someone looking to work in nonprofit administration; ditto for education and management.
Posted on 5/14/17 at 11:31 am to StringedInstruments
quote:
I agree with all except #6. The quality of education at a junior college is significantly lower than a university. I speak as someone who is currently an instructor at a junior college.
Too broad a statement, IMO. The level of variation is going to depend on the junior college and the university.
Posted on 5/14/17 at 11:47 am to hungryone
quote:
Encourage your college kids to take a second major (or do two minors) in fields unrelated to the primary major: this expands their thinking as well as their job prospects.
In theory this is a good idea, but there is almost no practical way to do it in 8 semesters.
quote:
Many HS now have dual-enrollment courses; you can earn college credit in biology, English, or applied classes right in the high school setting.
While this is a good thing to do and I had some dual enrollment hours when I started college (12 hours), it sometimes goes overboard with kids in high school now. Some have 30+ hours when they get to college and are starting in much harder classes. Looking back now my freshman classes were still by far the easiest and that was benficial for me coming from a really small high school to LSU and adjusting to living on my own. Now kids are trying to start in Calculus and Physics II all while trying to adjust to being out of their parents house.
Also on this point, my buddies little brother started with about 30 hours and still won't be able to graduate early because of the bottlenecks and his engineering senior design. Point being is it is good to start ahead because it gives you some cushion, but don't kill your kid to try to get every credit they can before starting college.
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