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Are there any 'good' non-market retirement vehicles?
Posted on 12/22/15 at 9:34 am
Posted on 12/22/15 at 9:34 am
I max out my 401k and Roth IRA, and have a brokerage account where I dabble with other investments. But I'm curious about any other good retirement vehicles that are not tied to the market. Is this where annuities come in? Whole life insurance? Admittedly, I dont know too much about either. Any other good suggestions that I should research?
This post was edited on 12/22/15 at 9:35 am
Posted on 12/22/15 at 9:39 am to jimbeam
Dont you invest HSA amounts into funds?
Posted on 12/22/15 at 9:51 am to Htown Tiger
If you are eligible for an HSA because you have a high deductible plan, it's a place you can stash money. You can invest it in securities or leave it in cash.
When you say "market" I assume you mean stock market?
Other places to put money:
Real estate (either direct single ownership, direct ownership of an investment partnership, or a REIT type investment)
Annuities (most are based on stock market investments or provide a fixed return)
Tax lien sales (I think a couple of guys on here dabble in these)
Whole life (it's a good place for tax-deferred growth once you tap out other buckets like you have, however, it's still either market based or a fixed rate of return)
Angel investing (investing in small companies, either directly or through an investment partnership)
When you say "market" I assume you mean stock market?
Other places to put money:
Real estate (either direct single ownership, direct ownership of an investment partnership, or a REIT type investment)
Annuities (most are based on stock market investments or provide a fixed return)
Tax lien sales (I think a couple of guys on here dabble in these)
Whole life (it's a good place for tax-deferred growth once you tap out other buckets like you have, however, it's still either market based or a fixed rate of return)
Angel investing (investing in small companies, either directly or through an investment partnership)
Posted on 12/22/15 at 9:58 am to LSUFanHouston
quote:Good stuff, thanks. Yeah, I was thinking along the lines of something that is a fixed rate of return that has some sort of 'guaranteed' payout amounts, but that wasnt tied to stock market risk. I just dont know how good any of these things are.
LSUFanHouston
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:03 am to Htown Tiger
Market-linked CD's
Muni bonds/funds
MLP's (Master Limited Partnerships)
REITs
UITs
Muni bonds/funds
MLP's (Master Limited Partnerships)
REITs
UITs
Posted on 12/22/15 at 10:11 am to Htown Tiger
Most things require a market risk in order to get a decent return. Especially in light of low interest rates.
Now, you can play in a different market than the stock market (for example, real estate).
Someone mentioned MLPs. They have market risk on price, but they do throw off a decent cash return. They can also be tax headaches, they will make your tax return expand a bit in complexity and they can sometimes not be friendly to tax-deferred accounts like IRAs.
Now, you can play in a different market than the stock market (for example, real estate).
Someone mentioned MLPs. They have market risk on price, but they do throw off a decent cash return. They can also be tax headaches, they will make your tax return expand a bit in complexity and they can sometimes not be friendly to tax-deferred accounts like IRAs.
Posted on 12/22/15 at 11:30 am to Htown Tiger
Yes but you don't have to. Just another place to save advantaged money.
Posted on 12/22/15 at 12:21 pm to LSUFanHouston
A lot of MLPs have taken an absolute arse whipping with the oil downturn. Also, as mentioned K-1s are a pain in the arse and sometimes don't even come out until June or so.
Posted on 12/22/15 at 3:24 pm to Htown Tiger
1) dinars
2) bitcoin
3) hookers and blow
2) bitcoin
3) hookers and blow
Posted on 12/22/15 at 3:41 pm to Htown Tiger
seriously though
REAL ESTATE........in many forms
rentals
tax liens
private lending secured by RE
REAL ESTATE........in many forms
rentals
tax liens
private lending secured by RE
Posted on 12/22/15 at 4:08 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
and they can sometimes not be friendly to tax-deferred accounts like IRAs
curious on this, can you explain please?
Posted on 12/22/15 at 4:43 pm to Zilla
An MLP is taxed like a partnership, not like a corporation. Whereas most investments in a retirement account pay dividends (which are after corporate tax allocations of cash), partnerships allocate income as well as distributions of cash.
That's a problem, because as you are aware, IRAs and the like don't normally pay current income taxes.
Because of this, if an IRA is allocated income from a partnership investment, called unrelated business taxable income, then it has to file Form 990-T and pay tax on that income allocated to it. This prevents the income from the partnership from avoiding taxation.
The vast majority of MLPs throw off losses each year (due to accelerated depreciation deductions which are the reason MLPs form as partnerships in the first place) so for most MLP investments, this isn't an issue. However, there are a few that do throw off income, and if you have enough units, you could have an issue.
The filing threshhold is $1,000 of UBTI.
That's why I say "can sometimes not be friendly".
That's a problem, because as you are aware, IRAs and the like don't normally pay current income taxes.
Because of this, if an IRA is allocated income from a partnership investment, called unrelated business taxable income, then it has to file Form 990-T and pay tax on that income allocated to it. This prevents the income from the partnership from avoiding taxation.
The vast majority of MLPs throw off losses each year (due to accelerated depreciation deductions which are the reason MLPs form as partnerships in the first place) so for most MLP investments, this isn't an issue. However, there are a few that do throw off income, and if you have enough units, you could have an issue.
The filing threshhold is $1,000 of UBTI.
That's why I say "can sometimes not be friendly".
Posted on 12/22/15 at 8:15 pm to LSUFanHouston
I think everyone here has it covered. Other "non-market" vehicles:
-Precious metals
-Art
-collectibles (guns, coins, cars, etc)
-Precious metals
-Art
-collectibles (guns, coins, cars, etc)
Posted on 12/22/15 at 9:52 pm to Htown Tiger
Real estate and land. Look for good deals. You should consider that your nest egg is paper. I'd start considering tangible assets that can be sold for profit in the future.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:31 am to Rhino5
I am not one to gamble and i have been thinking seriously about buying land as an investment. I figure i could buy a couple hundred acres of timberland hunt it for several years then either sell the timber or sell bot the timber and land later in life.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:42 am to Htown Tiger
Not Whole Life insurance. If you need insurance, buy term. Also, shoot to have a paid for residence in a good area by the time you retire. A few around here instead of that are in a bad area and have had to sell low and buy into better areas with new expensive mortgages in retirement.
whole life discussion to consider
Some other possible non-market lifestyle retirement vehicles
1) drive cheap to maintain reliable cars, according to true-cost-to-own websites this can free up 5k a year which invested over 30 years can add up to $600,000.
2) do not outsource your food, learn to prepare the basics, this will return priceless dividends of both wealth and health. Eat out only when sick of own cooking for a break.
whole life discussion to consider
Some other possible non-market lifestyle retirement vehicles
1) drive cheap to maintain reliable cars, according to true-cost-to-own websites this can free up 5k a year which invested over 30 years can add up to $600,000.
2) do not outsource your food, learn to prepare the basics, this will return priceless dividends of both wealth and health. Eat out only when sick of own cooking for a break.
This post was edited on 12/23/15 at 9:23 am
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