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re: The BCS MANIPULATION

Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:18 am to
Posted by TideWarrior
Asheville/Chapel Hill NC
Member since Sep 2009
11834 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:18 am to
Also according to your arguement Mich State got screwed when they had to play Wisc a team they already beat once but lost the 2nd time and now they do not go to a BCS game. What is the difference.

Also What if there was a playoff. And LSU had to play UA again in the CG. Does UA not deserve that rematch then or not because the 2 best teams played already?
Posted by TideWarrior
Asheville/Chapel Hill NC
Member since Sep 2009
11834 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:22 am to
I would say you use the current bowls as your placement for the 8 teams. The winners go on to a semi final and from there final. Let the semi and final rotate between the 4 bowls. The problem is first get rid of the bowl alignments to specific conferences.

The real issue would be picking the best 8. If based on the BCS how many voters would manipulate the rankings to get teams in. I could only imagine if the SEC got 4 of those spots like they would be close this year.
Posted by TideWarrior
Asheville/Chapel Hill NC
Member since Sep 2009
11834 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:24 am to
I would also eliminate the conference championship games to drop 1 extra game to replace with the playoffs. Right now teams like LSU have to play 14 teams. Drop the CCG and the 2 final teams would only have to play 15 games max. Maybe even shorten the season by 1 game like before.
Posted by Harpua
Member since Dec 2011
16 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:27 am to
quote:


I'm all for a 4 or 8 team playoff, but they also need to dump the polls and computers and put together a selection committee


Isn't a "selection committee" just another kinda of poll?
Posted by sabanisarustedspoke
Member since Jan 2007
4947 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:29 am to
I have a tough time understanding why any LSU fan would continue to bitch about Bama being in this game. We beat them by 3 in overtime Nov 5th in Tuscaloosa in a game that to me was obviously very even matched talent wise. It was an awesome game defensively on both sides of the field and did require some incredible defensive and special teams plays to get that win on the road. I don't buy the "Bama just needs to make field goals" spin that the media put on that game, because the field goals they missed were all out of their kickers range. I know Bama is the second best team in the country and the National championship game is supposed to be the top two teams in the country. I can't accept any suggestion that we went into overtime, got out-gained offensively, and needed a play of the year from Eric Reid just to beat the 3rd best team in the country.
Posted by Pistol...2K4
25 foot assassin
Member since Jun 2004
6918 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:33 am to
quote:

sabanisarustedspoke


well said , but the fact remains LSU must beat Bama twice and Bama just need win once to claim NC....patently unfair to LSU IMO , but I don't see anyone beating our team this year.
Posted by sabanisarustedspoke
Member since Jan 2007
4947 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:36 am to
quote:

Pistol...2K4
[quote]sabanisarustedspoke


well said , but the fact remains LSU must beat Bama twice and Bama just need win once to claim NC....patently unfair to LSU IMO , but I don't see anyone beating our team this year.



I agree with the entire post. It's going to be tough, but I would rather play a team that I've beaten this year than play one I've lost to at home this year. We will still win Jan9
Posted by wahoocs
Lafayette, LA
Member since Nov 2004
22299 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 12:52 am to
quote:

I have a tough time understanding why any LSU fan would continue to bitch about Bama being in this game


As a fan of college football, we will all be treated to the rematch.

As a player, coach, or supporter of LSU football, if you don't feel like you are being forced to push all of your chips in against someone with a free card, then you're just plain stupid.

The parameters were set before the season began. But, what ultimately has transpired is that two teams vying for the same prize, were put to unfair and unequal tasks. LSU must go 2-0 versus Bama, playing an extra game, risking injury, and one week less preparation time, while Bama can go 1-1.

Now, if your contention is that Bama is playing for a share of the title, then let's play ball. But, we both know that's not the case. All of your details about a fictional game taking place on Nov. 5th, are just that, fictional. For all intents and purposes, that game never took place.

If anything, all it did was reward the losing team. All previous rematches sharing this scenario have resulted in the losing team winning the rematch. The advantages on the field that were taken in the previous matchup are now null and void. They are being used as teaching tools for improvement. And every advantage not taken by the losing side, will be pounced on. I'm not even going to discuss the psychological advantages.

Everyone is quick to point out the rematches that occur in playoffs, but they are obviously talking about something foreign to this sport. When both sides know the parameters set forth, such as divisional play, conference championship games, and home and away, there exists an equal playing field.

What has occured here is an injustice to the LSU football family, and the only way to make it right, is to go out there and win again. I don't doubt these guys at all, I'm just disappointed to have this system let them down like this. Don't get me wrong, it's not as bad as what happened to Auburn in '04, but the desire of the almighty dollar has been placed before what is right and equitable for the blood, sweat, and tears these guys have had to endure this year.
Posted by L-S-U-L-S-U
Member since Dec 2004
344 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 1:19 am to
quote:

What is the mulligan. If you are referring to not playing the extra game I do not see the issue. OSU played only 12 games like UA. They did not have to play a CCG like LSU did. Their last game was a regular season game. The big whatever they are gets 2 bye weeks now during their season.


Not even close to addressing the issue I raised. But I wouldn't expect any Bama fan to try to make sense of their losing the 1 vs. 2 match, act like it never happened, then arbitrarily call a second-chance game a NC game.

Posted by Meaux Bettah
Tiger Nation
Member since Nov 2011
2591 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 1:52 am to
Same thing going to happen next year .
Posted by tiger1014
Member since Jan 2011
12511 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 1:55 am to
quote:

As a fan of college football, we will all be treated to the rematch.

As a player, coach, or supporter of LSU football, if you don't feel like you are being forced to push all of your chips in against someone with a free card, then you're just plain stupid.

The parameters were set before the season began. But, what ultimately has transpired is that two teams vying for the same prize, were put to unfair and unequal tasks. LSU must go 2-0 versus Bama, playing an extra game, risking injury, and one week less preparation time, while Bama can go 1-1.

Now, if your contention is that Bama is playing for a share of the title, then let's play ball. But, we both know that's not the case. All of your details about a fictional game taking place on Nov. 5th, are just that, fictional. For all intents and purposes, that game never took place.

If anything, all it did was reward the losing team. All previous rematches sharing this scenario have resulted in the losing team winning the rematch. The advantages on the field that were taken in the previous matchup are now null and void. They are being used as teaching tools for improvement. And every advantage not taken by the losing side, will be pounced on. I'm not even going to discuss the psychological advantages.

Everyone is quick to point out the rematches that occur in playoffs, but they are obviously talking about something foreign to this sport. When both sides know the parameters set forth, such as divisional play, conference championship games, and home and away, there exists an equal playing field.

What has occured here is an injustice to the LSU football family, and the only way to make it right, is to go out there and win again. I don't doubt these guys at all, I'm just disappointed to have this system let them down like this. Don't get me wrong, it's not as bad as what happened to Auburn in '04, but the desire of the almighty dollar has been placed before what is right and equitable for the blood, sweat, and tears these guys have had to endure this year.


I feel like your opinion changed about 4 times in this little diatribe.
Posted by wahoocs
Lafayette, LA
Member since Nov 2004
22299 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 2:08 am to
quote:

I feel like your opinion changed about 4 times in this little diatribe


Then maybe you need some sleep or better comprehension skills.

Where did my opinion change.

The game will be great viewing for the public, but not a fair and equal way to determine an outright national champion for the 2011 season.
Posted by TigerPaul2
Member since Oct 2008
300 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 2:09 am to
The BCS is a good system for LSU. With some suggested tweaks, the BCS would still be the best system.

1. Thecomputers must reveal their programs and must be proven predictors or they are dropped.

2.The critical change is all finalists must come from deserving conferences. This would be done by reviewing a conferences’ record against the teams that finished in the top 5, 10, 15, and 20 ranked colleges for a selected—2, 3, or 4—previous years. A simple computer program gives the results. Independent’s would be put in a theoretical conference pool. If it leaves during the 2, 3, or 4 year period, they must start over again in their new conference.


3.Only the coach’s poll would count, and a coach could not vote for his own team.

4.All conferences must have the same number conference members +1 or - 1.

5.All conferences must play at least 80% of games inside their conferences.

6.The regular season games are reduced to 11 games. (Of course if two teams have no bowl they want, they can opt out and play anyone that will play them.)


7.Conference playoffs are eliminated, and a fair across-the-board tiebreaker would be required for each conference.

8. The top four teams play in the traditional bowl games against one another.

9. The other teams play in the other traditional bowls.

10. The two out of the select four winners play in the BCS championship game.

11. The BCS winner could not appear with the AP winner in a co-championship ceremony.

Some traditions would be lost, but the BCS system has already started the destruction.
Posted by Volvagia
Fort Worth
Member since Mar 2006
51900 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 2:16 am to
quote:

I think this is ESPN creating as much controversy as they can because they will now use this to push for a 4 team playoff.


I think this too.
Posted by wahoocs
Lafayette, LA
Member since Nov 2004
22299 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 2:17 am to
Boy, not asking for much there, huh?

You can't possibly create an ideal system for the number of programs involved.

The system used could determine a true national champion, just like it does for the same sport already.

There are multitudes of variations for all sports to determine champions on the field. Div I-AA has a 16 team playoff. Baseball and basketball a field of 64+.

It could easily be done, but would require many with control of monies to relinquish that power. There could even be way more monies generated, without playing extra games. The only problem is distribution would be affected.
Posted by Volvagia
Fort Worth
Member since Mar 2006
51900 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 2:18 am to
quote:

. Thecomputers must reveal their programs


To whom? The public?

That will never happen, and should never happen.


Do we have any evidence that the programs aren't released to the BCS committee?
Posted by EZE Tiger Fan
Member since Jul 2004
50269 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 7:53 am to
quote:

I have seen now in 2 straight days of Andy Staples and just now Brad edwards trying to blame or justify what they did.


Brad Edwards was the worst. I have him on twitter. To see his spin was disgusting.

Then, after the fact, he admits Bama's resume was the worst resume in BCSNCG history.

Easy to do once you got what you wanted.

What a joke. We are slowly slipping back to the days where the "traditional powers" will once again run college football.
Posted by EZE Tiger Fan
Member since Jul 2004
50269 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 7:56 am to
quote:

No offense but any fan that follows the game can see either team had just as much right to be there. If you think that every voter who put OSU at #2 did it because they think OSU is the 2nd best team in the country you are kidding yourself.


Repeat after me:

YOU have the WEAKEST resume in BCSNCG HISTORY. It is not even close. You got there because you are an entitled/media darling. That is the ONLY reason. Never forget this.

Well, at least you made history.
Posted by EZE Tiger Fan
Member since Jul 2004
50269 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 7:57 am to
quote:

Also according to your arguement Mich State got screwed when they had to play Wisc a team they already beat once but lost the 2nd time and now they do not go to a BCS game. What is the difference.


No. Not the same at all.

Good lord you Gumps are hilarious. You really are.

Spin, spin spin

2011 MSU/Wisc = 2003 LSU/Uga
Posted by TideWarrior
Asheville/Chapel Hill NC
Member since Sep 2009
11834 posts
Posted on 12/7/11 at 8:08 am to
As the other posted Wisc got a mulligan. Their first game against MSU did not coumt. They did exactly what yhet needed to while other teams failed to do what they needed to to prevent Wisc from go on to a rematch in their ccg against MSU. No different from what happened here. UA did what they needed to after the loss to LSU and teams like OSU fail to do what they needed to. Sorry if that is not clear I apologize you can not understand that concept.
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