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Started By
Message
O being coordinator dependent may not be a bad thing.
Posted on 11/29/16 at 1:29 am
Posted on 11/29/16 at 1:29 am
Hear me out.
Yes, we went cheap with O, BUT...this means that we can get the best coordinators because we have that extra money to spend, assuming Alleva opens up the checkbook. We can offer that much more to the coaches and O's pitch to them is easy - I can get the players you need and I won't meddle. And there's always going to be established coordinators and good coordinators looking to move up. LSU is a coaching hotspot just because of the type players that grow in our backyard and our brand so we should never have a problem pulling top notch coaches to work with O.
Yes, we went cheap with O, BUT...this means that we can get the best coordinators because we have that extra money to spend, assuming Alleva opens up the checkbook. We can offer that much more to the coaches and O's pitch to them is easy - I can get the players you need and I won't meddle. And there's always going to be established coordinators and good coordinators looking to move up. LSU is a coaching hotspot just because of the type players that grow in our backyard and our brand so we should never have a problem pulling top notch coaches to work with O.
7
Posted on 11/29/16 at 1:32 am to LSUTil_iDie
If O actually is successful do you think he'll continue to accept a lower salary? We'll also have to depend a guy who has no past history of successful coordinator and coaching hires
Posted on 11/29/16 at 1:37 am to LSUTil_iDie
There's a thread on first page about this. I commented in there why I don't agree. LINK
quote:I'll believe it when I see it.
assuming Alleva opens up the checkbook
Posted on 11/29/16 at 1:39 am to Javzz
quote:
coaching hires
Well he brought Hugh Freeze and Frank Wilson up from the high school ranks sooo....
Posted on 11/29/16 at 2:04 am to LSUTil_iDie
It also means O has a built-in excuse for staying after a bad season. He's just going to say "we're going to go out and get the best [offensive or defensive] coordinator and fix this problem." And everyone will be so pumped like kids at Christmas dreaming of who the new coordinator might be.
But it's never going to be his job being talked about since he's hands off and the program is coordinator dependent.
It's a built-in ploy to keep your job after bad seasons.
But it's never going to be his job being talked about since he's hands off and the program is coordinator dependent.
It's a built-in ploy to keep your job after bad seasons.
This post was edited on 11/29/16 at 2:06 am
Posted on 11/29/16 at 2:24 am to apfour21
quote:quote:
assuming Alleva opens up the checkbook
I'll believe it when I see it.
well, Alleva has actually paid assistants pretty well. we had the highest paid staff, and guys like Cam, Chavis, and Aranda were among the highest paid coordinators in CFB.
Posted on 11/29/16 at 5:01 am to LSUTil_iDie
Two things:
1. I haven't spent time looking, but have seen many references to the low salary $$$ CEO is being paid now. Has this been made public? And if so, where? I'm curious, is all.
2. For all the moaning about CEO being dependent on assistants, what has happened to change ranters from all the moaning because CLM would not let his assistants do their jobs coaching, without meddling and mucking things up? It seems like strong coordinators and assistants would make for a better coached team.
1. I haven't spent time looking, but have seen many references to the low salary $$$ CEO is being paid now. Has this been made public? And if so, where? I'm curious, is all.
2. For all the moaning about CEO being dependent on assistants, what has happened to change ranters from all the moaning because CLM would not let his assistants do their jobs coaching, without meddling and mucking things up? It seems like strong coordinators and assistants would make for a better coached team.
Posted on 11/29/16 at 5:39 am to LSUTil_iDie
"Coordinator dependent" really means shitty HC
Posted on 11/29/16 at 7:39 am to UncleRuckus
I'd love to know what coordinator dependent means tbh. Which successful head coach has shitty coordinators?
Posted on 11/29/16 at 7:48 am to BallChamp00
Have you ever noticed that Saban's defense doesn't really ever drop off. Regardless of who his DC is?
Or Meyer's offense.
Good or bad, they basically are teaching their DCs their systems.
Or Meyer's offense.
Good or bad, they basically are teaching their DCs their systems.
Posted on 11/29/16 at 8:02 am to LSUTil_iDie
Ive posted this in several other threads before CEO was hired but basically the problem with a HC hire like CEO is that they dont lock-down one side of the ball like was mentioned in the above post about Saban and Meyer.
Most HCs are running either their offensive or defensive systems at their respective schools depending on which side of the ball they came up coaching on. This means they only have to consistently make a good hire on one side of the ball. In Orgerons case he has to consistently make good hires on BOTH sides of the ball. This can lead to wildly inconsistent teams year-to-year.
Good coordinators dont stick around for long. They prove themselves as coordinators and then get their own HC jobs. When you have, say a Dave Aranda as HC, at least you never have to worry about the defensive side of the ball.
Im not saying CEO cant have success Ive just been arguing that its a really big gamble and not a smart approach to building a consistent winner.
Most HCs are running either their offensive or defensive systems at their respective schools depending on which side of the ball they came up coaching on. This means they only have to consistently make a good hire on one side of the ball. In Orgerons case he has to consistently make good hires on BOTH sides of the ball. This can lead to wildly inconsistent teams year-to-year.
Good coordinators dont stick around for long. They prove themselves as coordinators and then get their own HC jobs. When you have, say a Dave Aranda as HC, at least you never have to worry about the defensive side of the ball.
Im not saying CEO cant have success Ive just been arguing that its a really big gamble and not a smart approach to building a consistent winner.
This post was edited on 11/29/16 at 8:04 am
Posted on 11/29/16 at 9:24 am to SammyTiger
So Dan Mullen to Addazio.
Then Herman to Beck.
Yea they are garbage OC's.
3 are head coaches and 1 will be.
Then Herman to Beck.
Yea they are garbage OC's.
3 are head coaches and 1 will be.
Posted on 11/29/16 at 9:25 am to BallChamp00
Seems like Meyer surrounds himself with great coordinators. Is he coordinator dependent?
Posted on 11/29/16 at 9:48 am to JawjaTigah
I've been making the following point for the past two weeks:
We have had an offensive-minded HC for what, 12 years?
Wasn't the biggest criticism of Miles that the offense was stagnant and predictable because he wouldn't allow his OC out from under his thumb?
Now, over the course of the coaching search, do we really want the same situation, even if Jimbo and Herman are considered top offensive minds at present?
I, for one, actually want a CEO/principal style HC. Offenses and defenses change over time. What's effective today won't always be as effective. Take the option, for instance—it was unstoppable when it first came on the scene, but it's mostly been figured out. Likewise, the read option has been many teams' kryptonite, but defenses have evolved to compensate and mitigate its effectiveness.
With a CEO, the offenses and defenses can change with trends. If a style no longer works, then the coordinator who's married to it either has to keep up with the times by changing or the team will move on.
This is why I am happy about O, but I would have preferred a CEO type of coach over a play-caller if we had that option with any other prospective coach.
We have had an offensive-minded HC for what, 12 years?
Wasn't the biggest criticism of Miles that the offense was stagnant and predictable because he wouldn't allow his OC out from under his thumb?
Now, over the course of the coaching search, do we really want the same situation, even if Jimbo and Herman are considered top offensive minds at present?
I, for one, actually want a CEO/principal style HC. Offenses and defenses change over time. What's effective today won't always be as effective. Take the option, for instance—it was unstoppable when it first came on the scene, but it's mostly been figured out. Likewise, the read option has been many teams' kryptonite, but defenses have evolved to compensate and mitigate its effectiveness.
With a CEO, the offenses and defenses can change with trends. If a style no longer works, then the coordinator who's married to it either has to keep up with the times by changing or the team will move on.
This is why I am happy about O, but I would have preferred a CEO type of coach over a play-caller if we had that option with any other prospective coach.
Posted on 11/29/16 at 9:50 am to LSUTil_iDie
The problem is successful Coordinators are just as likely to take a HC job somewhere as an upward Coordinator job.
We aren't just competitive with other P5 school for Coordinators we are competitive with non-P5 school who are offering HC jobs
We aren't just competitive with other P5 school for Coordinators we are competitive with non-P5 school who are offering HC jobs
Posted on 11/29/16 at 9:56 am to SammyTiger
quote:
SammyTiger
Aranda.
Checkmate.
Posted on 11/29/16 at 10:34 am to DontCare
That's not a checkmate. That's 1 win. If O is going to have long term success here he is going to have to Keep winning these battles. Go look at the top offenses. A lot of theme aren't a young smart OC. They are a young smart HC who used to be an OC.
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