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Started By
Message
Completely messed up a gumbo by having the roux break. Need help
Posted on 12/12/16 at 11:54 am
Posted on 12/12/16 at 11:54 am
So let me start by saying that I love this community and nowhere else can you get such great information about South Louisiana cooking. I'm from New Orleans, I cook a bunch, love to cook, and love the science behind why you do things. I'm generally above average at cooking almost everything I attempt and have made plenty of gumbos in the past with no issues.
That being said, I completely screwed up the gumbo due to my roux breaking and I'm trying to figure out what I did wrong so it doesn't happen again.
I was making a turkey and andouille gumbo using John Folse's Recipe but doubling the recipe.
Took the carcass from a smoked turkey and made an awesome stock the day before. It was like jelly from the bones and smelled incredible. There were 2 quarts of that and I supplemented the other 4 quarts with better than bouillon stock that was heated in another pot.
Since I was doubling the recipe, I used 3 cups of flour and 2 cups of oil. Spent a little over an hour making it... Here's the progression of the roux.
I got it a little darker and then threw in the onions. The roux was extremely hot and a lot of steam came off the onions initially. When the onions went in, the roux turned even darker than it was previously.
Let those sautee for 3-4 minutes and then tossed in the green onions, celery, and bell pepper, and sauteed for another 4-5 minutes before throwing in the garlic for another 2 minutes.
At this point, everything seemed like it was going according to plan. The vegetables were still sizzling in the pot and probably still had a little water left to give in them. The roux was still together.
The homemade stock had been out of the fridge for about 2 hours and wasn't cold but wasn't quite up to room temperature. The better than bouillon stock was hot on the stove.
Then I added a ladle of the homemade stock and stirred to thoroughly incorporate before adding each additional ladle. I think I had put all but 1 or 2 ladles of the homemade stock in when it started seeming like something wasn't right.
After looking back, I'm guessing this was when the roux broke but I couldn't tell at the time that's what it was. I finished adding the rest of the homemade stock and continued adding the better than bouillon stock. At this point, it really separated and I could tell the roux had broken and there were little globs of roux all over that wouldn't incorporate.
I tried everything I could find to fix it, brought it up to a hard boil, tried xanthan gum, there was just no saving it.
It was extremely frustrating. I had family coming over for dinner and ended up having to order pizza for everyone.
I'm looking for help on figuring out why exactly the roux broke. After looking stuff up about this, I've heard contradicting things about the temperature of the stock vs roux. Some sites have said both hot, some have said, one has to be hot and the other cooler. I'm at a loss and wasted an awesome stock.
I have family coming over for Christmas next weekend and I'm planning on making gumbo again (there was supposed to be enough from this to have for next weekend too...) and I want to make sure I don't make the same mistake. Luckily I made 2 separate good stocks from 2 turkeys so at least I have another one to work with next time. Any advice would be extremely helpful! Thanks everyone.
That being said, I completely screwed up the gumbo due to my roux breaking and I'm trying to figure out what I did wrong so it doesn't happen again.
I was making a turkey and andouille gumbo using John Folse's Recipe but doubling the recipe.
Took the carcass from a smoked turkey and made an awesome stock the day before. It was like jelly from the bones and smelled incredible. There were 2 quarts of that and I supplemented the other 4 quarts with better than bouillon stock that was heated in another pot.
Since I was doubling the recipe, I used 3 cups of flour and 2 cups of oil. Spent a little over an hour making it... Here's the progression of the roux.
I got it a little darker and then threw in the onions. The roux was extremely hot and a lot of steam came off the onions initially. When the onions went in, the roux turned even darker than it was previously.
Let those sautee for 3-4 minutes and then tossed in the green onions, celery, and bell pepper, and sauteed for another 4-5 minutes before throwing in the garlic for another 2 minutes.
At this point, everything seemed like it was going according to plan. The vegetables were still sizzling in the pot and probably still had a little water left to give in them. The roux was still together.
The homemade stock had been out of the fridge for about 2 hours and wasn't cold but wasn't quite up to room temperature. The better than bouillon stock was hot on the stove.
Then I added a ladle of the homemade stock and stirred to thoroughly incorporate before adding each additional ladle. I think I had put all but 1 or 2 ladles of the homemade stock in when it started seeming like something wasn't right.
After looking back, I'm guessing this was when the roux broke but I couldn't tell at the time that's what it was. I finished adding the rest of the homemade stock and continued adding the better than bouillon stock. At this point, it really separated and I could tell the roux had broken and there were little globs of roux all over that wouldn't incorporate.
I tried everything I could find to fix it, brought it up to a hard boil, tried xanthan gum, there was just no saving it.
It was extremely frustrating. I had family coming over for dinner and ended up having to order pizza for everyone.
I'm looking for help on figuring out why exactly the roux broke. After looking stuff up about this, I've heard contradicting things about the temperature of the stock vs roux. Some sites have said both hot, some have said, one has to be hot and the other cooler. I'm at a loss and wasted an awesome stock.
I have family coming over for Christmas next weekend and I'm planning on making gumbo again (there was supposed to be enough from this to have for next weekend too...) and I want to make sure I don't make the same mistake. Luckily I made 2 separate good stocks from 2 turkeys so at least I have another one to work with next time. Any advice would be extremely helpful! Thanks everyone.
This post was edited on 12/12/16 at 12:03 pm
12
Posted on 12/12/16 at 11:57 am to NDA13112
I've made probably 40 gumbos and have never had a roux break. I always use room temp stock to hot roux.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:00 pm to NDA13112
i always use warm to hot stock. i have made 100's of rouxs and never had one break. just warm your stock up before you add it.
Eta: just clicked the link to that recipe and saw 24 button mushrooms. hmmm
Eta: just clicked the link to that recipe and saw 24 button mushrooms. hmmm
This post was edited on 12/12/16 at 12:02 pm
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:02 pm to NDA13112
it was the difference in temp
but you could of saved it, just get it hot and almost boiling and whisk like hell and it will go back to normal
ETA. pics look great
but you could of saved it, just get it hot and almost boiling and whisk like hell and it will go back to normal
ETA. pics look great
This post was edited on 12/12/16 at 12:04 pm
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:03 pm to NDA13112
Pretty sure it was something in homemade stock, i use swansons chicken broth in my gumbo
This post was edited on 12/12/16 at 12:05 pm
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:04 pm to Tigerpaw123
I tried boiling and whisking like hell, even putting a small amount in another bowl and tried using an immersion blender to see if it would incorporate before trying the whole pot and that wouldn't work either.
This post was edited on 12/12/16 at 12:08 pm
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:07 pm to Lake Vegas Tiger
The homemade stock was just turkey carcass, onions, carrots, garlic, bay leaf, peppercorns, thyme, and parsley. I make it every once in a while for special occasion dinners and haven't ever had an issue. I honestly don't recall whether I heated it up in the past but I'm lazy so I probably just had it sitting out for a little while just like this time.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:09 pm to Honky Lips
Yeah, I don't find that the mushrooms really make a difference one way other the other. My wife loves mushrooms so sometimes I throw them in and sometimes not.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:10 pm to NDA13112
I suspect the homemade stock wasn't warm enough. I always add roux to simmering stock, though it can be done either way. That's just my procedure because I'm usually making more gumbo than will fit into the pot in which I make the roux. Roux is always warm to hot as I add it as soon as I finish cooking the trinity in the roux. I turn off the heat and then start adding roux by spoonfuls, stirring or whisking as I add to incorporate.
We had another thread on breaking roux not too long ago. I think most folks believed the stock in that case wasn't warm enough, also, if I'm remembering correctly.
We had another thread on breaking roux not too long ago. I think most folks believed the stock in that case wasn't warm enough, also, if I'm remembering correctly.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:11 pm to NDA13112
quote:
I honestly don't recall whether I heated it up in the past but I'm lazy so I probably just had it sitting out for a little while just like this time.
well there you go. just nuke it real quick next time.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:15 pm to Gris Gris
That was kind of my plan. I was making the roux in that pot and the gumbo in a large stock pot. My thought process was to incorporate half of the stock into the roux in the le crusset pot before adding that to the stock pot but I didn't get a chance.
That make sense because the roux was extremely hot and I would guess the stock was on the cooler side.
I assumed that I should add the stock to the roux like when I'm making the base for my chicken pot pie but maybe next time, I'll just turn off the heat once the vegetables go in the roux and spoon the roux into the stock like you said.
That make sense because the roux was extremely hot and I would guess the stock was on the cooler side.
I assumed that I should add the stock to the roux like when I'm making the base for my chicken pot pie but maybe next time, I'll just turn off the heat once the vegetables go in the roux and spoon the roux into the stock like you said.
This post was edited on 12/12/16 at 12:21 pm
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:29 pm to NDA13112
I'm certainly no gumbo expert but I've always used warm stock (probably from reading this board) and have never had it break
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:50 pm to Coater
yea i agree with others... most likely the difference in temp between roux, stock, and bouillon.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 12:58 pm to NDA13112
Any chance you used too much oil? That seems to be the most common culprit when I googled. They suggested measuring the flour by weight vs volume, but damn, that seems fussy.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 1:04 pm to NDA13112
I had this exact problem the last two times I made gumbo. It is heart-breaking.
I finally gave it another shot this past Friday and got it to work perfectly. Your mistake is in having the stock cold or even at room temp.
Put the stock into a big pot and put it on medium on the stove. Then ladle it into your roux a little at a time, stirring well and making sure it doesn't burn while you ladle more in. It worked perfectly for me. The stock needs to be warm, at a minimum.
Edit: I also tried to save my previous attempts by boiling and whisking but it didn't work. I think sometimes a roux starts to break but you can save it and other times it just breaks completely and there is no way to save that.
I also had NEVER had a problem until the last two times and I had always used room temp stock. Not sure why it suddenly began making a difference. I also made my roux ahead of time so it was cooled so now I make it on the stove top and will not do it ahead of time ever again.
The gumbo I made Friday was the best I had ever done. Having the roux hot when I added in the trinity meant they actually cooked down some and of course, no breaking. Can't wait to have leftovers for dinner!
I finally gave it another shot this past Friday and got it to work perfectly. Your mistake is in having the stock cold or even at room temp.
Put the stock into a big pot and put it on medium on the stove. Then ladle it into your roux a little at a time, stirring well and making sure it doesn't burn while you ladle more in. It worked perfectly for me. The stock needs to be warm, at a minimum.
Edit: I also tried to save my previous attempts by boiling and whisking but it didn't work. I think sometimes a roux starts to break but you can save it and other times it just breaks completely and there is no way to save that.
I also had NEVER had a problem until the last two times and I had always used room temp stock. Not sure why it suddenly began making a difference. I also made my roux ahead of time so it was cooled so now I make it on the stove top and will not do it ahead of time ever again.
The gumbo I made Friday was the best I had ever done. Having the roux hot when I added in the trinity meant they actually cooked down some and of course, no breaking. Can't wait to have leftovers for dinner!
This post was edited on 12/12/16 at 1:16 pm
Posted on 12/12/16 at 1:05 pm to gmrkr5
I probably made a 100+ gumbos and never had an issue with the roux breaking until last year. Did it two times in a row. First time I thought I put the stock in too fast. So the 2nd time, I ladled the stock in very slow. Like one ladle every 20-30 seconds. Stock was room temperature and it still broke. I chalked it up the the oil or flour I was using. Still not sure what made it break.
I was able to save it by scooping the broken roux (which floated to the top) and some stock out of the gumbo and putting it in a blender. I added a small amount of flour and blended it while also adding some stock back to it. It was the only thing that I tried that saved it. I tried whisking and next an immersion blender. Neither worked so I figured I would try a blender.
I was able to save it by scooping the broken roux (which floated to the top) and some stock out of the gumbo and putting it in a blender. I added a small amount of flour and blended it while also adding some stock back to it. It was the only thing that I tried that saved it. I tried whisking and next an immersion blender. Neither worked so I figured I would try a blender.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 1:13 pm to Evil Little Thing
I have cooked Gumbo more times than I can count and have never had this happen, and I use room temp stock. Is there a science behind it or just random bad luck that can happen?
Posted on 12/12/16 at 1:13 pm to BigB0882
Definitely heartbreaking. I think you're right, I'll definitely have the stock hot next time.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 1:14 pm to Evil Little Thing
I guess I could have but the roux looked just like every other roux I've made without issues.
Posted on 12/12/16 at 1:36 pm to NDA13112
Ummmm. I'm not even sure where to start. My wife has bitched for years that I cook with a roux too much. Between gumbo, sauce piquant, stews...I mean pretty much everything I eat on rice has a roux. And I eat a lot of rice. Damn near every critter I and the wife and kids hunt gets made over rice. Probably 50 meals a year AT LEAST have a roux. Been cooking like this for 25(?) years. On occasion I will use Kary's roux, but the vast majority are homemade.
I say all that to say this...I've never had a gravy (encompasses everything I've put roux in) that the roux wouldn't incorporate. I've thrown cold stock, frozen vegetables, you name it, into a hot roux. I've throw cold roux out the fridge into a hot stock. I've seen roux blend nicely and make a paste before adding more stock. I've had roux lump up into little balls in a dimly colored stock. I've seen damn near every variation of weird looking roux particles when cooking. Every single time, the roux will still cook down and incorporate into the dish.
I think you saw something you've never seen before and panicked and didn't let it cook. It will blend and meld into the dish. Put the lid on it and have a beer next time.
I say all that to say this...I've never had a gravy (encompasses everything I've put roux in) that the roux wouldn't incorporate. I've thrown cold stock, frozen vegetables, you name it, into a hot roux. I've throw cold roux out the fridge into a hot stock. I've seen roux blend nicely and make a paste before adding more stock. I've had roux lump up into little balls in a dimly colored stock. I've seen damn near every variation of weird looking roux particles when cooking. Every single time, the roux will still cook down and incorporate into the dish.
I think you saw something you've never seen before and panicked and didn't let it cook. It will blend and meld into the dish. Put the lid on it and have a beer next time.
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