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re: What minimum salary would be required to be part of the middle class?
Posted on 10/7/14 at 2:06 pm to The Spleen
Posted on 10/7/14 at 2:06 pm to The Spleen
You find it hard to get students, but you're willing to factor in 10+ students a week to your proposed budget? Duh.
Yes, a family of four can live on $59K. No, a family of four cannot live beyond their means on $59K. Either plan the life you can afford, or work to fund the life you aspire toward. Location is the most expensive part of this equation--if you truly want to do this, you're gonna have to downsize your suburban dream house.
But what does your wife think of all this? Is the $250K house her dream or yours? Please look around at all of the foreclosures and understand what it means to bite off more than you can chew. An extended illness (you or the kids), an unexpected car accident....this stuff can & does happen. The mortgage company doesn't care.
Yes, a family of four can live on $59K. No, a family of four cannot live beyond their means on $59K. Either plan the life you can afford, or work to fund the life you aspire toward. Location is the most expensive part of this equation--if you truly want to do this, you're gonna have to downsize your suburban dream house.
But what does your wife think of all this? Is the $250K house her dream or yours? Please look around at all of the foreclosures and understand what it means to bite off more than you can chew. An extended illness (you or the kids), an unexpected car accident....this stuff can & does happen. The mortgage company doesn't care.
1
Posted on 10/7/14 at 2:13 pm to StringedInstruments
I know I couldn't do it although I'm sure it's possible
Posted on 10/7/14 at 2:22 pm to yellowfin
I can speak from experience in saying that the unexpected with kids will bite you in the arse.
My household income is 90K - 100K depending on the bonus. My wife only brings in about $800 a month on average. I even get a free company car and phone.
After taxes from salary, taxes on the house, medical, co-pays, food, items for kids, trips to the store, retirement, house maintenance, car maintenance, etc, it really is not much to live on and 59K is lower than what we bring in and we live in a 140K home. (Texas).
250K house note seems to be a huge disaster waiting to happen if you ask me.
My household income is 90K - 100K depending on the bonus. My wife only brings in about $800 a month on average. I even get a free company car and phone.
After taxes from salary, taxes on the house, medical, co-pays, food, items for kids, trips to the store, retirement, house maintenance, car maintenance, etc, it really is not much to live on and 59K is lower than what we bring in and we live in a 140K home. (Texas).
250K house note seems to be a huge disaster waiting to happen if you ask me.
Posted on 10/7/14 at 2:40 pm to StringedInstruments
quote:
thinking the $250k range
with only a $60k total household with 2 kids?
I mean..its doable, but you are one A/C or some other financial emergency away from disaster
Posted on 10/7/14 at 2:41 pm to StringedInstruments
quote:
I should probably add the adjective "upper" for middle class as I have rather expensive tastes for some things like food.
I found this chart on Wikipedia. Take it for what you will. It shows the different class ranges in 1984 and 2014:
At 59K with just your earnings, this puts you in "lower middle class".
Why do you want to be "upper middle class" so badly? That doesn't automatically afford you luxuries. People who make more end up spending more, and are often just as poor as those who don't make as much. If you have expensive tastes in food, on your salary, you will need to buy less house or make sacrifices elsewhere. Or you could make your wife get a job so you can eat caviar on the weekends
edit: for a Wikipedia chart, that is pretty shitty. it has multiple misspellings and is confusing. But you get the idea. Also education seems irrelevant..but this chart just shows you an idea of what the different classes are. There is no "true" definition of the middle class.
This post was edited on 10/7/14 at 2:45 pm
Posted on 10/7/14 at 2:52 pm to yellowfin
quote:
What minimum salary would be required to be part of the middle class?
Out of college my wife and I were making ~85k gross and I didn't like it. 59k with two kids and a wife that doesn't work would be REALLY tight.
Posted on 10/7/14 at 2:56 pm to hungryone
quote:
You find it hard to get students, but you're willing to factor in 10+ students a week to your proposed budget? Duh.
Sorry. I'm having a hard time finding students where I am going to graduate school. When I lived in Birmingham, I had up to 45 at one point. Ranged from 30-35 on average.
This post was edited on 10/7/14 at 2:57 pm
Posted on 10/7/14 at 3:01 pm to StringedInstruments
quote:
I should probably add the adjective "upper" for middle class as I have rather expensive tastes for some things like food.
You should just come to terms with it now...
You're not the jet set, you're the old Chevrolet set
Posted on 10/7/14 at 4:29 pm to StringedInstruments
Upper middle class with a family of four would probably be 135k+ in household income. I have serious doubts that you could make a 250k house (along with retirement, savings, college fund, entertainment) work with only 59k of household income.
For a frame of reference:
My income is above that, I have zero kids, my rent is considerably less than $1600, and my check is stretched pretty thin after retirement, insurance, and savings for my wife's tuition, along with other monthly bills.
I also have a friend who purchased a house that was roughly 240k when he was making ~50k. He was single at the time and rented out two of his bedrooms to friends. He barely had money to save each month and ate on $180 worth of groceries, with no car note. This wasn't a terrible idea for him, because he married about a year later and doubled his income, but he was on a really strict budget for a while.
For a frame of reference:
My income is above that, I have zero kids, my rent is considerably less than $1600, and my check is stretched pretty thin after retirement, insurance, and savings for my wife's tuition, along with other monthly bills.
I also have a friend who purchased a house that was roughly 240k when he was making ~50k. He was single at the time and rented out two of his bedrooms to friends. He barely had money to save each month and ate on $180 worth of groceries, with no car note. This wasn't a terrible idea for him, because he married about a year later and doubled his income, but he was on a really strict budget for a while.
Posted on 10/7/14 at 6:05 pm to StringedInstruments
I'd say impossible to live a upper middle class life style if you make only $59k in your household a year with a wife and two kids. Double that then you may be in that range.
Posted on 10/7/14 at 7:27 pm to Beerinthepocket
I believe that once you have a fridge in your garage then you are officially considered middle class.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 7:01 am to DownSouthDave
Making 62k (base salary not including car allowance, bonuses, stock gains), I bought a house for 175k with 20% down. Notes were VERY manageable and I really didn't need to dip into the money that came from the parenthesis. Now I'm making twice that, but there's no way I can afford twice the house now that I have a wife and kid. At least not at the rate I've gotten used to saving. I'm looking at 250k houses with my current salary.
This post was edited on 10/8/14 at 7:03 am
Posted on 10/8/14 at 8:07 am to StringedInstruments
quote:
have rather expensive tastes for some things
quote:
teaching high school
I hope you have a trust fund
Posted on 10/8/14 at 8:09 am to yellowfin
This thread has been really informative. 
I'm mainly trying to figure out if I should go back into teaching or not, honestly. The benefits are great and nothing's better than having tenure. But I also want money. I just need to explore options with an MA in English. Worst mistake of my life was going into the humanities in undergrad and not realizing there are other fulfilling options that pay more money.
I'm mainly trying to figure out if I should go back into teaching or not, honestly. The benefits are great and nothing's better than having tenure. But I also want money. I just need to explore options with an MA in English. Worst mistake of my life was going into the humanities in undergrad and not realizing there are other fulfilling options that pay more money.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 8:14 am to StringedInstruments
I have a wife and 2 kids and it's tough something...health insurance, car notes, house note, private school tuition, homeowners insurance, car insurance, life insurance, 401k, college savings, groceries, fuel, daycare, gym, etc
and we haven't even got into my hobbies yet
and we haven't even got into my hobbies yet
Posted on 10/8/14 at 9:04 am to StringedInstruments
quote:
MA in English
Fellow MA here who made the change from academia to public sector to private sector in just about 4 years and haven't regretted it a bit.
What's wrong with:
quote:
Rhet/Comp with a graduate certificate in technical and professional communication
These are some of the most profitable jobs coming from an English degree. You can break 100k after a few years if you find the right company. You don't need any extra schooling, that's just more money.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 9:14 am to StringedInstruments
quote:
Worst mistake of my life was going into the humanities in undergrad and not realizing there are other fulfilling options that pay more money.
What a sorry perspective....your humanities education isn't the obstacle here. (Let's not forget that economics is considered a humanistic discipline as well.) Three degrees in the humanities didn't handicap me; in fact, I have found that the writing, analysis, and research skills learned through humanities classes are in demand in the business world.
"I also want money".....you can earn a nice living as a teacher. But NO ONE should be teaching because of the paycheck. I don't mean that it's not remunerative--I mean that it's a challenging, all-in endeavor when done properly. Pay shouldn't be the motivating factor, IMHO. It's a calling, not a job. Seriously. Perhaps a school admin track would suit you better. Or private school fundraising/alumni affairs work, or recruiting/admissions at the college level.
But I do chuckle about your thinking that the MA in English somehow boosts your pay/employment options. It might be good for a side gig teaching English comp at the local community college ($1800--$2500 class, 15-30 students).
The cold, hard reality of being middle class in the US today is a two-income household, unless you were gifted with an early inheritance, free house, or started working at a very young age.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 9:35 am to Freauxzen
quote:
These are some of the most profitable jobs coming from an English degree. You can break 100k after a few years if you find the right company. You don't need any extra schooling, that's just more money.
Well don't hold back, man! Give me some names or ideas.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 9:42 am to hungryone
quote:
What a sorry perspective
It's not so sorry. There's a reality as evidenced by this thread that to procure what is available to the "middle" class one must earn a sizable living. I'm also of the belief that it's best for the household and the children for the mother to be at home during the little years. I'm lucky to have a wife that enjoys working and will return to working within the next decade.
Part of the OP was to find out more about options as a English major with a master's. I was offered a fellowship to receive my MA and felt that earning a degree without debt was too good of an opportunity to pass up. Was that a mistake? Maybe. Maybe not. I'm enjoying my time and am growing exponentially as a communicator, researcher, and overall person. But having a family that is financially secure is of the utmost importance, and providing my children with a safe environment with a good education is part of that security.
And again, here was part of the OP: Do I need to explore private sector careers that may pay more?
What other careers are there for me? I've looked into editing, copywriting, and authorship. They don't pay more than teaching nor do they offer the same benefits.
Posted on 10/8/14 at 9:50 am to StringedInstruments
quote:
And again, here was part of the OP: Do I need to explore private sector careers that may pay more?
See above. Again, as someone with an MA in English as well, if you don't feel the calling, it will never be worth it unless you value family time and time off more than anything else. Teaching is good, I love it, and still do it from time to time, but I doubt I could ever teach full time. I value a career, opportunity being creative, solving problems. If you're wrestling with that problem, you might be as well. Clearly though, you aren't sold on teaching, which means there's a good chance it won't be fulfilling because you'll never make enough.
And the adjunct market is continually growing, talk about bad working conditions.
quote:
What other careers are there for me? I've looked into editing, copywriting, and authorship. They don't pay more than teaching nor do they offer the same benefits.
Technical writing.
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