- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Chicago Cubs Super Prospect Futureboner Sploosh Emporium Thread | Maddon Thread
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:44 am to Lester Earl
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:44 am to Lester Earl
0
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:48 am to piggidyphish
quote:Beeler is getting to pitch this week, too. I liked his Roy Halladay impersonation. He needs to watch the fastballs up in the zone, but otherwise he pitched fairly well.
Hopefully we see hendricks do well this week (assuming we can discuss him in the prospects thread at least until he makes his start). I'm more bearish on him than some, but would love to be wrong.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:54 am to GynoSandberg
quote:
Fielding % has been giving mediocre fielders gold gloves for years.
No doubt...it's just a stat.
quote:
Whether you agree with advanced stats or not, fielding % is a basic stat
Which is why I used UZR and ErrR as well in my post.
quote:
But he's average to below league average on defense.
Agree
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:56 am to Yak
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:39 pm to Yak
quote:
Fielding % has been giving mediocre fielders gold gloves for years.
quote:
Whether you agree with advanced stats or not, fielding % is a basic stat
Meh, from what I've seen, in my opinion sabermetric defensive stats and a simple stat like fielding % are both useful, and both have flaws. For example, concerning DWAR, Kyle Seager had a -0.3 DWAR last year while committing 15 errors at 3B. Pedro Alvarez had a 0.5 DWAR while committing 27 errors at 3B. Seager played in 10 more games than Alvarez. So Seager has a worse defensive DWAR stat compared to Alvarez, therefore according to sabermetrics Alvarez is a better defensive player, but Seager committed 12 fewer errors than Alvarez. This just seems a little off to me. I guess Alvarez may have better range at 3B according to DWAR, but Seager makes the regular plays more often according to Fielding %. The same and maybe better comparison can be made with David Freese or maybe Adrian Beltre vs. Alvarez. You are essentially replacing one useful but flawed stat with another useful but flawed stat.
BTW I'm glad I found this thread.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:43 pm to Monkeyboy
Rizzo in 2nd place...behind morneau, for the last allstar spot.
#voterizzo
#voterizzo
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:46 pm to piggidyphish
I think I've voted a million times.
Also, Ken Rosenthal said the A's also wanted Luis Valbuena in the deal, but the Cubs balked at including him. He goes on to say that the A's could look into adding him before the deadline.
Luis for Cespedes, make it happen.
Also, Ken Rosenthal said the A's also wanted Luis Valbuena in the deal, but the Cubs balked at including him. He goes on to say that the A's could look into adding him before the deadline.
Luis for Cespedes, make it happen.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:51 pm to piggidyphish
quote:
Doesn't Castro also have an absurd amount of Total Chances since he's been in baseball when compared to other players?
nah...he's got more than some, but not an absurd difference.
Just looked this up. From Castro's first full season in 2011, he has the most total chances at the shortstop position at 2,552. Alexei Ramirez has the next highest amount at 2,444, so that's 108 more total chances then the next guy. Third is J.J. Hardy at 2,417 total chances. Now, if you count Castro's rookie season of 2010, he has the second most TCs at SS behind Ramirez, but Ramirez played in 28 more games from 2010 to the present than Castro. I don't know if I'd call it an absurd difference but I see what Len Kasper was getting at.
This post was edited on 7/8/14 at 1:55 pm
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:51 pm to Monkeyboy
quote:There was a monster difference between the two in range factors.
Meh, from what I've seen, in my opinion sabermetric defensive stats and a simple stat like fielding % are both useful, and both have flaws. For example, concerning DWAR, Kyle Seager had a -0.3 DWAR last year while committing 15 errors at 3B. Pedro Alvarez had a 0.5 DWAR while committing 27 errors at 3B. Seager played in 10 more games than Alvarez. So Seager has a worse defensive DWAR stat compared to Alvarez, therefore according to sabermetrics Alvarez is a better defensive player, but Seager committed 12 fewer errors than Alvarez. This just seems a little off to me. I guess Alvarez may have better range at 3B according to DWAR, but Seager makes the regular plays more often according to Fielding %. The same and maybe better comparison can be made with David Freese or maybe Adrian Beltre vs. Alvarez. You are essentially replacing one useful but flawed stat with another useful but flawed stat.
Always fun to bring up Jeter... in 2012 Jeter finished 7th in the league in error factor with a well above average 2.1 ErrR but was almost 50% worse than the 2nd to last ranked shortstop with a -15.4 range factor. He had the worst defensive ranking of any qualified SS despite being near the top in the error portion of the UZR defensive metric.
Advanced metrics obviously aren't perfect, but they're a whole frickton better than some simple fielding % statistic.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:56 pm to The Sad Banana
Valbuena has some value, Im glad we held him. We can parlay him into something decent to a desperate team. LH hitting guy who can play 3B or 2B... pretty much every AL team in the running could use him.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:58 pm to Monkeyboy
quote:
I see what Len Kasper was getting at.
that he's rooting for the home guy. Doesn't want to get chip carry-ed and steve stone-ed.
I wouldn't call it absurd, and he shouldn't be only 30 TC's more than JJ hardy last year and have 10 more errors if he's a good defensive short stop. Unless defensively last year was an aberration.
Also the eye test...he doesn't pass it for being a good defensive short stop. Add it all up and yea he's certainly a very good player, but his value comes from the bat, not the glove. Which is good, i'll take a castro any day over a fricking barney.
This post was edited on 7/8/14 at 2:02 pm
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:01 pm to The Sad Banana
quote:
Also, Ken Rosenthal said the A's also wanted Luis Valbuena in the deal, but the Cubs balked at including him. He goes on to say that the A's could look into adding him before the deadline.
Good for the cubs. I think we talked about it pages ago, but i just can't see anyone offering something that is going to be valuable to pry him away from the cubs. That's not to say he's so great we can't part with him, just that all the other factors (flexibility, contract length and cost)make him more valuable to the cubs than to other teams.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:01 pm to Monkeyboy
quote:
. I guess Alvarez may have better range at 3B according to DWAR, but Seager makes the regular plays more often according to Fielding %.
What these stats are basically telling you is that Alvarez prevents more hits/runs than what Seager does. The higher total of errors can be attributed to A)more total chances overall & B)better range, which leads to tougher plays.
with that being said Seager's UZR is actually higher than Alvarez's from 2013-present. Alvarez has a higher DRS(defensive runs saved)
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:05 pm to Monkeyboy
quote:
Just looked this up. From Castro's first full season in 2011, he has the most total chances at the shortstop position at 2,552. Alexei Ramirez has the next highest amount at 2,444, so that's 108 more total chances then the next guy. Third is J.J. Hardy at 2,417 total chances. Now, if you count Castro's rookie season of 2010, he has the second most TCs at SS behind Ramirez, but Ramirez played in 28 more games from 2010 to the present than Castro. I don't know if I'd call it an absurd difference but I see what Len Kasper was getting at.
Castro has played the most innings of any SS in the MLB in that time. The only SS that is close is Alexi Ramirez. Castro has played in 30 more innings than him.
He has 280 more innings at SS than JJ Hardy.
Basically him having that many total chances is a result of his longevity.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:11 pm to Louie T
quote:
Always fun to bring up Jeter... in 2012 Jeter finished 7th in the league in error factor with a well above average 2.1 ErrR but was almost 50% worse than the 2nd to last ranked shortstop with a -15.4 range factor. He had the worst defensive ranking of any qualified SS despite being near the top in the error portion of the UZR defensive metric.
All that being said, he's still my post season starting SS. Dude's a fricking monster in October.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:14 pm to Lester Earl
Valbuena won't make it to August IMO. Probably pair him with one of our pitchers in some deal.
Bonifacio could be trade bait, too. His injury may hurt his chances of being dealt, though. He could end up playing the utility role if Valbeuna gets dealt
Bonifacio could be trade bait, too. His injury may hurt his chances of being dealt, though. He could end up playing the utility role if Valbeuna gets dealt
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:17 pm to GynoSandberg
Is Bonifacio even going to be back by the trade deadline?
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:27 pm to Yak
quote:
Is Bonifacio even going to be back by the trade deadline?
RR said recently they still don't have a time table for him.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 4:34 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
The higher total of errors can be attributed to A)more total chances overall & B)better range, which leads to tougher plays.
So I have to respectfully ask. If what you are saying above is the case for Alvarez's errors, couldn't you say the same thing for Castro? What's the difference? Castro has the highest total chances at shortstop since 2011. And I think Castro has good range. I've always felt throwing errors, especially after effort plays, have been more of his problem.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 6:19 pm to Monkeyboy
all i can see is that from 2011, Castro has the most total chances out of any SS. But within the top 10 of SS in total chances, he's the only one on the list with a negative UZR, at -14 (ZERO is league average)
this may help explain the differential
quote:
With UZR, if a fielder makes an out, and the UZR engine estimates that it was a difficult ball to field (and turn into an out) by an average fielder at that position, then the fielder will get more credit than if the UZR engine determined that it was an easy ball to field. Likewise, if a batted ball drops for a hit, a fielder will get more negative credit if UZR determined that it was an easy ball to field (for that fielding position) and less negative credit if it was a difficult ball to field. If a fielder makes an error, UZR automatically assumes that it was a relatively easy ball to field, since that is presumably the definition of an error in the first place, so there is no need to incorporate the speed and location of the batted ball and other factors that can influence how difficult a batted ball is to field. In other words, in UZR, errors are treated as balls that are normally fielded by that fielder and that fielder only (the one who made the error), 95% of the time, or whatever the average error rate is for that position and that type of ball.
Page 22 of 68
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News