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re: Why aren't there more pro choice conservatives?
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:12 am to olddawg26
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:12 am to olddawg26
quote:
Furthermore that doesn't even touch ectopic pregnancies and rape. I think my point is that it's more complicated than a cave man attempt saying "all abortions are murder no matter what".
True... but in this case we're talking something on the order of 2% of all abortions
When it comes to endangering the life of the mother, harder decisions must be made, and in this case, I would be pro abortion, if all other options were off the table
In the case of rape, id rather kill the rapist than the child
But again, we are talking a vast minority of abortion cases, so the argument has no real validity on the larger picture... that arguement is an emotional appeal more so than a common occurrence... it's quite literally the exception and not the rule, in practice
1
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:12 am to TheArrogantCorndog
Fair enough. Nice chatting with you. It's better when there's not 100 trolls screaming and insulting
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:13 am to olddawg26
quote:
Fair enough. Nice chatting with you. It's better when there's not 100 trolls screaming and insulting
You said it, baw
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:34 am to Tiguar
quote:
Why do people have a moral objection to murder but hate having their money stolen?
-you
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:41 am to TheArrogantCorndog
quote:
but with our enlightened minds we should also accept the responsibility of population control with the advantage of our higher intellect... i.e. birth control or abstinence... and not fall into the trap of our animal instinct... that's why humans got to where we are in the first place
Actually, killing off rival species is how we got to where we are. Humans are moral and good on average insofar as it behooves us to act that way. On average, people who come from irresponsible people will be irresponsible themselves. You are holding people to a standard which they are not likely to meet.
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:43 am to TheArrogantCorndog
quote:
When it comes to endangering the life of the mother,
Hmm... now why is that? If we are not all equally human with equal rights, shouldn't the youngest take precedent?
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:51 am to olddawg26
Then why do we give anyone, whether man or woman, a CHOICE to murder a human in the womb?
Posted on 5/19/17 at 3:56 am to Dick Leverage
Once again you're calling a zygote a human. You haven't won that debate or anywhere near it. A choice could happen for the mothers health or maybe rape? There's plenty of scenarios where it's perfectly logical to give the woman a choice whether she has to carry that baby to term, and it's quite ridiculous to say "hey woman I've never met you have to do as I say simply because of my feelings and opinion on when a zygote becomes a human". If you've already just decided abortion is "murdering humans" no matter what then you shouldn't even debate anyone.
Posted on 5/19/17 at 4:16 am to Masterag
quote:
because it WOULD be a human being if another hadn't intervened.
I'm pro choice (in the sense that I don't really care one way or another), but this is a stupid argument. If it's murder because it WOULD be a human if another person had not intervened, then the same can be said of the mother, who is another person separate from the would be human. Therefore, the fetus WOULD be a human had the mother, AKA another person, not intervened and aborted the fetus.
It's not murder because in order for an act to constitute murder then the person killed must have been a living being. The fetus is not because it cannot sustain life on its own.
Statutes in various states that make feticide a crime, while listed under "homicide," are not homicide in the traditional since. It is not murder; but in fact, feticide, evidenced by the statute's names, which is the unlawful killing of a fetus, not a human. Constitutional Law explicitly exempts would be mothers from these statutes up to a point.
This post was edited on 5/19/17 at 4:21 am
Posted on 5/19/17 at 4:33 am to Masterag
I did not know abortions were difficult to obtain at all in the U. S., I think these are the women who have the most most abortions
valuing unborn life and wanting individuals to be capable of taking care of themselves and not become wards of the state is not antithetical and most would argue that they are compatible ideals
This post was edited on 5/19/17 at 4:36 am
Posted on 5/19/17 at 4:55 am to Masterag
Because they get ostracized like Tomi Lahren did.
Posted on 5/19/17 at 5:14 am to olddawg26
quote:
you'd have no more of a moral obligation to save the baby over the Petri dish if they were both falling?
Absurd. Your argument is awful. In your hypothetical you assume that the shock of hitting the floor has the same effect on infant as the baby in Petri dish. You also ignore human tendencies to protect infants.
Your "drop" test is weak. Think harder and come back with something better.
Posted on 5/19/17 at 5:19 am to TigernMS12
quote:
The fetus is not because it cannot sustain life on its own.
So can I walk through an intensive care unit and unplug life supporting systems without consequence? I'm interested to hear how your definition of "had been living" is applied here.
Posted on 5/19/17 at 5:31 am to Masterag
quote:
aborting a fetus is not murder.
How is it not? It ends a life. Intentionally. More or less with malice aforethought.
Posted on 5/19/17 at 5:40 am to Masterag
quote:
aborting a fetus is not murder. next...
Have you ever watched the videos of doctors injecting the fetus and having the syringe jerk out of their hands and flail around? Yea it's not a living organism... clearly not a life......
Posted on 5/19/17 at 5:46 am to Masterag
I hate these threads where peole make it seem that the only two options are, aborting a baby, or paying for it through welfare later!
Posted on 5/19/17 at 5:48 am to Masterag
Because its pretty much murder. With the exception of extenuating circumstances I look at abortion almost at the same level of murderers, rapists, and pedophiles.
Im late 20s and not extremely religious fwiw.
Im late 20s and not extremely religious fwiw.
Posted on 5/19/17 at 5:51 am to Masterag
quote:
IMO, being pro life and against welfare are antithetical.
Stupidity
But. If you're going with that, then the opposite question applies also
Posted on 5/19/17 at 6:26 am to Masterag
quote:
because it WOULD be a human being if another hadn't intervened.
Um....so, why doesn't this apply to abortion?
Posted on 5/19/17 at 6:30 am to Tiguar
quote:
Conservatives who don't support believe it is. Next.
That's because they're ignorant. Next.
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