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Started By
Message
1
Posted on 9/1/14 at 2:19 am to Jim Rockford
Big Nanny state needs to step in and stop this!
Posted on 9/1/14 at 5:43 am to asurob1
quote:
frickballs
I prefer oh shitballs...
Posted on 9/1/14 at 5:44 am to LordoftheManor
quote:
This statement sounds pretty absolute to me.
Errors in reasoning don't make you look smart.
This post was edited on 9/1/14 at 5:51 am
Posted on 9/1/14 at 6:36 am to Sentrius
quote:
Anyway, this DIY abortion business is what happens when you go batshit crazy with social conservatism and reduce access to safe, sterile and competent facilities and doctors
Exactly. Its the same logic used to argue the futility of gun restrictions. Those who really want to get a gun will find a way to get one--whether legal or not.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 6:54 am to onmymedicalgrind
quote:
Exactly. Its the same logic used to argue the futility of gun restrictions. Those who really want to get a gun will find a way to get one--whether legal or not.
The right to have arms is constitutionally protected. The right to an abortion isn't.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 6:59 am to Revelator
quote:
The right to have arms is constitutionally protected. The right to an abortion isn't.
I never brought up the Constitution nor am I trying to make that type of argument. The point I am making is outlawing or making safe abortions difficult to obtain will not decrease abortions as much as it will increase riskier/black market ones. Its really not rocket science.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 7:20 am to onmymedicalgrind
quote:
I never brought up the Constitution nor am I trying to make that type of argument. The point I am making is outlawing or making safe abortions difficult to obtain will not decrease abortions as much as it will increase riskier/black market ones. Its really not rocket science.
If I extrapolate your point to other issues, I believe it falls apart? In your scenario, we would give booze to drunks, pills to drug addicts and help suicidal people jump off of bridges. If an activity is harmful or inhumane to begin with, it shouldn't be encouraged.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 7:25 am to Revelator
quote:
If I extrapolate your point to other issues, I believe it falls apart? In your scenario, we would give booze to drunks, pills to drug addicts and help suicidal people jump off of bridges.
Umm no. Not making something illegal (or extremely difficult through BS legislation) is not the same as "giving" people something. Note I never said anything about subsidizing abortions or morning after pills--just that making it illegal won't stop those who really want to get one.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 5:51 pm to Revelator
quote:
Exactly. Its the same logic used to argue the futility of gun restrictions. Those who really want to get a gun will find a way to get one--whether legal or not.
The right to have arms is constitutionally protected. The right to an abortion isn't.
The right to privacy is an implied right.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 5:52 pm to Revelator
quote:
I never brought up the Constitution nor am I trying to make that type of argument. The point I am making is outlawing or making safe abortions difficult to obtain will not decrease abortions as much as it will increase riskier/black market ones. Its really not rocket science.
If I extrapolate your point to other issues, I believe it falls apart? In your scenario, we would give booze to drunks, pills to drug addicts and help suicidal people jump off of bridges. If an activity is harmful or inhumane to begin with, it shouldn't be encouraged.
Well hell by your logic Prohibition was brilliant idea which probably would have succeeded if we'd only held out a bit longer.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 7:37 pm to Revelator
quote:those aren't reasons. Was Aquinas and the Popes unaware of those verses?
Jeremiah 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee Psalms 139:13 For it was You who created my inward parts; You knit me together in my mother’s womb. 14 I will praise You because I have been remarkably and wonderfully made.
And those most definitely aren't reasons if I'm a Jew, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, etc.
Relying on the New Testament as a reason is weak tea.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 7:39 pm to SlowFlowPro
Abortion is certainly immoral? How so? I just gave you leading Christians/theologians who had the exact opposite view.
Not to mention that you are deriving your morality from a source that not all believe in.
Human being: when the soul enters.
Not to mention that you are deriving your morality from a source that not all believe in.
Human being: when the soul enters.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 7:41 pm to SlowFlowPro
A thing isn't a human being. Sorry it isn't.
We can debate when this thing becomes close to a human being, but a two week old zygote isn't a human being.
We can debate when this thing becomes close to a human being, but a two week old zygote isn't a human being.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 7:43 pm to Revelator
quote:That is some terrible logic. As we'll as completely missing the point.
So to you, what matters as far as moral issues is what's legal? So conversely, what's illegal would be immoral. I didn't realize that politicians had so much power as to make things moral and immoral with the stroke of a pen?
Posted on 9/1/14 at 7:44 pm to Jake88
quote:How so? Be exact.
You are biologically ignorant. Congrats.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 7:57 pm to theunknownknight
quote:
Should be murder
No, we should be giving them safe environments to do them in. Chances are the people doing DIY abortions shouldn't be having kids, and are saving the taxpayers hundreds of thousands every time it's done.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 8:01 pm to Homesick Tiger
quote:
Getting pregnant is a personal choice. Why should I have to subsidize a mistake you and your gf make? I'd be more inclined to help pay for some type medication you might need for a "situation" you had no control over.
Because you're either going to have to subsidize fractions of a penny right now, or thousands once the kid is born. Either way, this is coming out of your pocket as a taxpayer, so why not do it in the most cost effective way? People who have abortions 95% of the time can't afford to have kids, and 100% of those babies are unwanted. You know what is responsible for 99% of crimes? Unwanted kids. These are the kids who are going to be coming into your house, and stabbing your children while high on speed. We should nip it in the butt before it even becomes a problem.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 8:10 pm to GeeOH
quote:
Why would you be dumb enough to assume the kids would be welfare kids?
Because it's very much statistically proven.
quote:
Actually the ones going buy the pills are probably more capable of financially raising the kid. The welfare lifers don't give enough of a frick to care. They actually want the bbay for a bigger check and tax scam.
Which is why we should also revamp welfare. No longer will it be financially viable to have 10 kids on stamps. In my world, people on welfare would have their rights stripped from them until they got off of it. Since we the taxpayers are now their employers and they put forth no service besides spitting out more kids, then they really should have no real rights. We are now their parents, coach, and drill sergeant. They don't get a vote anymore than kids do when they're growing up in their parents' household. So if someone has been on welfare for a year or more and has a kid, I would let them have the kid and pay for it on the taxpayers' dime, but the mother and the father would both be sterilized.
Do you have any idea how many problems this would solve if we just did this? I really don't think it's a coincidence that the crime rate started to drop exactly 15 years after it happened.
Posted on 9/1/14 at 8:16 pm to Sentrius
quote:
No he's not. He's making good points about what you would rather, 18 years of taxpayer funded welfare or a simple taxpayer funded pill. People are getting upset over reality.
Anyway, this DIY abortion business is what happens when you go batshit crazy with social conservatism and reduce access to safe, sterile and competent facilities and doctors. Anybody could see this coming, no offense but I'd rather them get an abortion safely at a sterile medcal facility than at home or some roach infested shop where anything could go wrong and the woman's life becomes in danger.
I'm morally opposed to abortion but I can see the practical, logistical and factual reality about it.
Yep, completely spot on.
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