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Message
re: The Latest Snowden Leak Is Devastating to NSA Defenders
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:11 am to Paluka
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:11 am to Paluka
quote:
There is no way to protect people from the improper use of NSA survellience techniques. No amount of oversight, warrants, etc. will ever be enough. This is a secretive process and, by rule, will always be able to circumvent any oversight.
The same can be said for any number of government functions and processes. Especially WRT the business of intelligence. If any particular entity has leadership or cultural issues, there are rememdies for that. But there is no way to do certain things in the light of day.
1
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:13 am to Lakeboy7
quote:
This is what I have a major problem with, and the Russians and Chinese have it all. A real hero.
Let's not even get started on what's unfolding in Germany.
That pretensious little arse has weakened us and our allies (mainly the UK) militarily and diplomatically.
But thank God he exposed that some nerds at NSA didn't properly dispose of a couple hundred e-mails. Because everone knows that non-encrypted e-mails sent over non-encrypted networks are otherwise absolutely private.
This post was edited on 7/8/14 at 11:16 am
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:15 am to Navytiger74
quote:Who did this exactly? I mean, if what was happening is OK, then the German leaders wouldn't be upset. So, who exactly weakened our relationship with the Germans?
That pretensious little arse has weakened us and our allies
That's like a woman saying the person who told her hubbby she was cheating "weakened" their marriage.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:16 am to ShortyRob
quote:
Who did this exactly? I mean, if what was happening is OK, then the German leaders wouldn't be upset. So, who exactly weakened our relationship with the Germans?
That's like a woman saying the person who told her hubbby she was cheating "weakened" their marriage.
I'd ask you not to be obtuse, but that's probably a bridge too far.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:18 am to Navytiger74
quote:I'll take that as a "you aint got shite for a response" answer.
I'd ask you not to be obtuse, but that's probably a bridge too far.
The NSA cannot be trusted. PERIOD. Anyone who does trust them is a goddamned idiot.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:20 am to Navytiger74
quote:
But thank God he exposed that some nerds at NSA didn't properly dispose of a couple hundred e-mails.
You're deflecting and downplaying but are asking someone to not be obtuse?(not that I thought his answer was obtuse at all)
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:21 am to ShortyRob
quote:
I'll take that as a "you aint got shite for a response" answer.
You're right I "aint got shite for a response" to anyone comparing a marriage between two people with the relationship between two governments. All governments seek leverage in their relationshiips with partners and adversaries. I'll just stack that up as one more thing those of you in the "outraged" crowd didn't realize.
I should remind you again, your non-secure communications are non-secure. In case you'd forgotten.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:22 am to NbamaTiger90
quote:
You're deflecting
You guys throw this around way too much. What the frick did I deflect or fail to answer?
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:22 am to Navytiger74
Thank you for proving my point. Electronic methods now make massive intrusion an easily conducted operation. Way too easy.
The less we have to count on these idiots to be honest the better.
The less we have to count on these idiots to be honest the better.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:25 am to Navytiger74
quote:I realize it. Do you?
You're right I "aint got shite for a response" to anyone comparing a marriage between two people with the relationship between two governments. All governments seek leverage in their relationshiips with partners and adversaries. I'll just stack that up as one more thing those of you in the "outraged" crowd didn't realize.
I mean, are relations really "weakened" then? I mean, ya know. Since quite obviously the German government would be full of people that recognize this is just something "all governments" do. Why would they even be REALLY upset? Oh, I suppose they would feign being upset for public consumption but you're asserting actual damage.
Which is it?
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:26 am to Navytiger74
quote:I should remind you that we already know that even when people thought they were encrypting their stuff, the NSA was peeping. In case you'd forgotten.
I should remind you again, your non-secure communications are non-secure. In case you'd forgotten.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:32 am to Navytiger74
quote:
But thank God he exposed that some nerds
quote:
What the frick did I deflect
You're either deflecting or just out right lying. You take your pick. They are both the same when you break them down.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:33 am to ShortyRob
quote:
Oh, I suppose they would feign being upset for public consumption but you're asserting actual damage.
Suspecting that something is probably taking place is one thing. Being given information concerning when, how, by whom, and by which methods is another.
He is compromising sources and methods. That is not the same as saying, "oh the US probably spies against xx country".
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:35 am to NbamaTiger90
quote:
You're either deflecting or just out right lying.
Do you have an alternate version of events to present based upon that article?
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:36 am to Navytiger74
quote:Bull shite. But hell, even if you were right, ya know the opposite sentence can be written, right?
Will go back to not giving a shite about this kind of thing as soon as Obama leaves the WH.
To me, THAT is the sad part. For decades the left has been in full "don't trust the govt" mode and finally, a large subset of conservatives jump on board only for the left to go full bore "let the govt do whatever the frick it wants, they're good people" mode?
Yeah. We're fricked.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:40 am to Navytiger74
quote:Oh no no no fricking no you don't get that one. "Suspecting" my arse. YOU asserted that ALL governments do this and hence, they ALL KNOW it is being done. Nice try.
Suspecting that something is probably taking place is one thing.
quote:That has nothing to do with whether or not our relations with allies should be damaged. They should, according to you, be alreayd of the view that everyone is doing it. THEY are doing it. WE are doing it. EVERYONE is doing it!!
He is compromising sources and methods.
quote:Nice try again. You didn't say "probably". EVERYONE does it. You are portraying people on a fricking football board as fools for not knowing this as a matter of course. One certainly must assume that if ShortyRob is supposed ot know this is the norm, government officials in Germany do. There is no "probably" about it.
oh the US probably spies against xx country
Try again.
This post was edited on 7/8/14 at 11:41 am
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:44 am to Navytiger74
quote:
Do you have an alternate version of events to present based upon that article?
Point me to the part of that article that talks about Germany.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:48 am to ShortyRob
quote:
YOU asserted that ALL governments do this and hence,
I said that all governments seek leverage in their relationships with partners and adversaries.
quote:Yes. Everyone seeks leverage.
You didn't say "probably". EVERYONE does it.
And again, in case it really evaded you, there is a huge difference in "knowing" (if that makes you feel better) that a foreign government is openly pursuing an information advantage over you and knowing exactly which vulnerabilities they exploit to achieve it.
A huge difference.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:51 am to Paluka
quote:
Thank you for proving my point. Electronic methods now make massive intrusion an easily conducted operation. Way too easy.
Too bad we can't undo technology, eh.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 11:57 am to Navytiger74
quote:
And again, in case it really evaded you, there is a huge difference in "knowing" (if that makes you feel better) that a foreign government is openly pursuing an information advantage over you and knowing exactly which vulnerabilities they exploit to achieve it.
Um. How would this create a "huge difference" in relations?
If a couple "knows" they they are in an open marrige then finding out who the hubby is screwing and how he's doing it might lead to many things but being pissed he was screwing her would seem sort of silly.
The Germans may want to stop how we're doing it, but, if it's so darned normal for all nations to do, then there really should be no reason for them to stop being our allies. They already KNEW we were doing it BEFORE finding out how.
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