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re: Question about our debt ?
Posted on 1/15/17 at 12:29 pm to Crimson Wraith
Posted on 1/15/17 at 12:29 pm to Crimson Wraith
Debt increases automatically as currency is created.
Obviously there is also wasteful spending.
Obviously there is also wasteful spending.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 12:41 pm to SCLibertarian
quote:
They cost us far less than the wars, surveillance and military budget.
The military is necessary. Sometimes wars are foisted upon nations in order to protect themselves. Filtering for those, what are you basing that claim on? What numbers did you use to arrive at that conclusion, and what method did you use to separate the actual needy from the welfare program scammers?
Just curious.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 12:43 pm to Crimson Wraith
quote:
We need the military and surveillance, we don't need illegals and generational welfare families.
Exactly.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 12:47 pm to SCLibertarian
quote:
If you think we need to spend as much as the next 42 countries combined on military and surveillance
Yeah...a lot of waste. Let those other countries carry the majority of their own defense. That said the welfare waste is the result of actual scam artists...so, apples to oranges.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 12:50 pm to Hugo Stiglitz
Umm..your graphs show that the majority of spending is for social programs of one form or another...soo...
Posted on 1/15/17 at 1:01 pm to Dale51
quote:
Umm..your graphs show that the majority of spending is for social programs of one form or another...soo...
Actually, it's even more. Almost half of the generic "military" number is to provide healthcare and lifetime pensions for former military. The other half (just more than half, actually) is spent on actual defense.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 1:01 pm to tigerfan63
There are really only a few facts you need to understand about debt. Everything else is fluff.
1) Debt, both in the US and globally is massively unpayable in current value terms of the currencies in which it's denominated. That means the debt is worthless.
2) Central banks everywhere have vowed to do "whatever it takes" to prevent the massively unpayable debt from outright default, and they're multiple decades into that course of action. That means the currencies of those central banks are also worthless, which was always inevitable.
3) Central banks and governments are managing this currency default in such a way as to strip mine the assets of their middle class, which will be progressively forced into poverty and dependency. The beneficiaries of that process are a relative handful of global "oligarchs" who wield power over politicians and central banks.
4) All of the global political chaos, corruption, class warfare, real warfare, etc., is due to government rulers and "oligarchs" jockeying to improve their personal outcomes when this financial house of cards collapses.
5)If you're looking for someone to blame, you're wasting your time. A quick read of history demonstrates that this is just the messy way that evolution works at the top of the food chain. Winners and losers are hard to predict despite the best laid plans of mice and men.
1) Debt, both in the US and globally is massively unpayable in current value terms of the currencies in which it's denominated. That means the debt is worthless.
2) Central banks everywhere have vowed to do "whatever it takes" to prevent the massively unpayable debt from outright default, and they're multiple decades into that course of action. That means the currencies of those central banks are also worthless, which was always inevitable.
3) Central banks and governments are managing this currency default in such a way as to strip mine the assets of their middle class, which will be progressively forced into poverty and dependency. The beneficiaries of that process are a relative handful of global "oligarchs" who wield power over politicians and central banks.
4) All of the global political chaos, corruption, class warfare, real warfare, etc., is due to government rulers and "oligarchs" jockeying to improve their personal outcomes when this financial house of cards collapses.
5)If you're looking for someone to blame, you're wasting your time. A quick read of history demonstrates that this is just the messy way that evolution works at the top of the food chain. Winners and losers are hard to predict despite the best laid plans of mice and men.
This post was edited on 1/15/17 at 3:13 pm
Posted on 1/15/17 at 1:12 pm to Evolved Simian
quote:
Actually, it's even more. Almost half of the generic "military" number is to provide healthcare and lifetime pensions for former military. The other half (just more than half, actually) is spent on actual defense.
Exactly.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 1:19 pm to wdhalgren
quote:
Winners and losers are hard to predict despite the best laid plans of mice and men.
True...until we go to a cashless system Then the only winners is the government.
There are counties already transitioning to that, with little reported in the press..(surprise..surprise). In some places you can't buy a loaf of bread with cash. The vendor will not accept it. Once that happens your life will be under total control of the government..there will be no underground economy or people working for cash. It will have no value nor any place to use it.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 1:20 pm to Crimson Wraith
quote:
Plenty of money was wasted by the dear leader. He doubled the debt in 8 years.
Spending is controlled by Congress. Bet you love Paul'Big Spender' Ryan.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 1:28 pm to tigerfan63
quote:
I thought that the 20 trillion was money that we borrowed from china.
No most of our debt is owed to ourselves.
Social Security is close to 3 Trillion
Government pensions around 1 Trillion
Military Retirement 800 billion
3 trillion to the Fed
Total Foreign debt is around 6 Trillion.
We owe less than 2 Trillion to China.
1.3 Trillion to Japan
This post was edited on 1/15/17 at 1:31 pm
Posted on 1/15/17 at 1:34 pm to tigerfan63
I think if you took the time to do even a bit of research you would already know that the programs you are talking about wouldn't even put a dent in the deficit. Military spending, corporate welfare, medicare, social security. Conservatives have never and will never have the balls to touch any of it. You've been sold a bill of dog shite and you lap it up like a ravenous sewer rat.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 1:54 pm to Dale51
quote:
True...until we go to a cashless system Then the only winners is the government.
I've seen a lot of hand wringing about the death of cash, but it's not a foregone conclusion IMO. At least not in the near term. The main reason for eliminating cash would be to enable negative nominal interest rates, but that would immediately reveal the confiscatory nature of our monetary system to the broad public. It's much easier to keep real (inflation adjusted) interest rates negative and dropping by allowing them to progressively lag a rising rate of inflation. The public remains blissfully ignorant to that "inflation tax" as Ben Bernanke called it.
Plus, despite all the talk of ties between currency and corruption/terrorism, etc., the bulk of that activity transpires at the level of politicians and their wealthy owners. It's hard for me to see them giving away one of their biggest advantages, which is opacity in money flows, until we've reached the very end game. If we do go cashless, you'll know either the gig is up, or the system of tracking the fully electronic money is fatally compromised from the outset. Either way, it does nothing to change the final outcome of governments losing control as populations grow progressively destitute.
This post was edited on 1/15/17 at 2:24 pm
Posted on 1/15/17 at 2:13 pm to CaptainBrannigan
quote:
quote:
Plenty of money was wasted by the dear leader. He doubled the debt in 8 years.
Spending is controlled by Congress.
Not when you have a phone and a pen, are the first half black pres and the MSM toting your water.
dims also controlled all three branches for his first two years and accomplished nothing but more debt.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 2:24 pm to Crimson Wraith
quote:
Not when you have a phone and a pen, are the first half black pres and the MSM toting your water.
Exactly. How many years did the Senate go without providing a budget?
Posted on 1/15/17 at 2:41 pm to tigerfan63
The first thing that needs to happen is Congress signing off on a balanced budget. How this is not required is beyond me.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 2:46 pm to PaperTiger
quote:
The first thing that needs to happen is Congress signing off on a balanced budget. How this is not required is beyond me.
First thing that needs to happen: currency no longer created as debt by private companies, and remove the internationally owned private company (the FED) from running our monetary system.
Create currency as a simple means of exchange, not as automatic debt with the intent to control.
This is the core of the apple, but nobody really talks about it much.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 3:57 pm to PaperTiger
Yawn.
It's something I'll let my kids worry about. Not my problem.
It's something I'll let my kids worry about. Not my problem.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 4:07 pm to Crimson Wraith
quote:
Spending is controlled by Congress.
Not when...
No, still then. It's uncomfortable for you guys, but Republicans love spending money and telling you they hate it.
Posted on 1/15/17 at 4:08 pm to BamaAtl
Reality is dems are at their lowest point since the 1920s
Thanks obama!
Thanks obama!
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