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Started By
Message
Historical monuments okay or not
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:02 pm
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:02 pm
Since I've asked several of our resident anti-monument posters these questions and none will answer... I figured I'd make a thread and try this way.
So... How do you feel about honoring and immortalizing Julius Caesar? Alexander the Great? Ghengis khan? Nero? Several of the British kings? Damn near any and all leaders of the separatist movements that created many of the countries we know today? How about George Washington? The racist slave owner whom rebelled and founded a country built on slavery?
How do the statues of these men make you feel? Each and every one of them commited far worse atrocities, far more genocidal acts, we're extreme racist against those not like them.
Are these figures okay? If so, why are they okay?
There are two sides to every single coin. One man's hero is another man's villain. The men who we immortalize the world over were responsible for atrocities that would make you turn your head in disgust. Yet we name restaurants after them. Casinos. Multi million dollar businesses, monuments. Statues. They're on our money. They are in pop culture. Yet they are, at their very core, horrible. Horrible men.
So, pray tell, why are these statues and monuments and businesses okay?
So... How do you feel about honoring and immortalizing Julius Caesar? Alexander the Great? Ghengis khan? Nero? Several of the British kings? Damn near any and all leaders of the separatist movements that created many of the countries we know today? How about George Washington? The racist slave owner whom rebelled and founded a country built on slavery?
How do the statues of these men make you feel? Each and every one of them commited far worse atrocities, far more genocidal acts, we're extreme racist against those not like them.
Are these figures okay? If so, why are they okay?
There are two sides to every single coin. One man's hero is another man's villain. The men who we immortalize the world over were responsible for atrocities that would make you turn your head in disgust. Yet we name restaurants after them. Casinos. Multi million dollar businesses, monuments. Statues. They're on our money. They are in pop culture. Yet they are, at their very core, horrible. Horrible men.
So, pray tell, why are these statues and monuments and businesses okay?
14
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:03 pm to beerJeep
quote:
How do you feel about honoring and immortalizing Julius Caesar? Alexander the Great? Ghengis khan? Nero? Several of the British kings?
frick 'em....none are 'Mericans
quote:
How about George Washington?
The GOAT
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:07 pm to Wtodd
quote:
frick 'em....none are 'Mericans
So they get a pass for being genocidal, racist, murdering and enslavement savages? What about American businesses whom profit on their image? Caesars palace is a massive multimillion dollar business that profits on the imagery of a racist, genocidal maniac who murdered hundreds of thousands and enslaved just as many. Why is he okay to immortalize?
And the GOAT what? Rebel? Slave holder? Racist? Either these are horrible traits and traits that should bar someone of being immortilized or not. You can't say one group is bad because slavery but give every other group a pass just because they "won"
This post was edited on 8/15/17 at 12:09 pm
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:08 pm to Wtodd
quote:
How about George Washington?
The GOAT
A clear racist. How can you support someone who owned slaves and was vital to white property owning men having the exclusive right to vote?
Next youll tell me Andrew Jackson was worthy too.
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:10 pm to beerJeep
quote:
So they get a pass for being genocidal, racist, murdering and enslavement savages?
I guess you didn't understand what "frick 'em" means.....it means "frick 'em"....they get no statues or monuments.
quote:
And the GOAT what?
GOAT Prez
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:11 pm to NYNolaguy1
quote:
A clear racist
I'm white so I've known this for awhile.
quote:
How can you support someone who owned slaves and was vital to white property owning men having the exclusive right to vote?
He's dead and so are the slaves he owned
quote:
Next youll tell me Andrew Jackson was worthy too.
Dead too
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:11 pm to Wtodd
quote:
guess you didn't understand what "frick 'em" means.....it means "frick 'em"....they get no statues or monuments.
Yet they do. Why do they get a pass? Why are they not equally scrutinized by the anti-monument folk?
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:11 pm to Wtodd
quote:
quote:How do you feel about honoring and immortalizing Julius Caesar? Alexander the Great? Ghengis khan? Nero? Several of the British kings? frick 'em....Merican Blacks don't care
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:12 pm to beerJeep
The real point is that you cannot change history no matter how much you love it or hate it. History, both good & bad, should always be preserved. The only way to grow from our past is to study it and learn from it. Hiding it, changing it, or destroying it only destroys the memories and lessons to learn from the real past.
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:12 pm to beerJeep
I think it sets a dangerous precedent.
If you take down all the statues, then whats next? Pictures (left has already complained about a picture in the White House)? Are books going to be burned by the 1000s because we dont like what they say? Any of this ringing a bell with the Left?
If you take down all the statues, then whats next? Pictures (left has already complained about a picture in the White House)? Are books going to be burned by the 1000s because we dont like what they say? Any of this ringing a bell with the Left?
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:13 pm to beerJeep
Which government building has a statue of Caesar?
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:13 pm to beerJeep
I didn't answer you over there because it's a ton of bad false equivalencies. Still true over here.
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:14 pm to beerJeep
quote:
Yet they do. Why do they get a pass?
I'm not giving them anything.
quote:
Why are they not equally scrutinized by the anti-monument folk?
Ask them; I'm not one
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:15 pm to dbeck
quote:
Which government building has a statue of Caesar?
Quite a few actually.
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:15 pm to beerJeep
quote:
Are these figures okay? If so, why are they okay?
This isn't difficult, guys. They're OK b/c they contributed greatly to America even though they took part in some of the less savory particulars of our nation's history. Context is key.
People who rebelled against America and gave full-throated endorsement to and armed defense of those less savory particulars did nothing to deserve memorialization by America. But if you want to honor them privately or petition for their remembrance in graveyards, museums, etc. you won't get any objection from me.
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:16 pm to mwade91383
quote:
didn't answer you over there because it's a ton of bad false equivalencies. Still true over here.
Bad men are bad men. Slavery is wrong. Genocide is wrong. Why are these men forgiven? Is it because it's in the past? Is it because the ends justified the means?
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:20 pm to WheelRoute
quote:
People who rebelled against America and gave full-throated endorsement to and armed defense of those less savory particulars did nothing to deserve memorialization by America.
So your argument isn't that racism is bad. It isn't slavery is bad. Nor genocide. It's rebelling against ones country that is the straw that breaks the camels back.
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:20 pm to dbeck
quote:
Which government building has a statue of Caesar?
Theres more than one govt building that has statues of even religious figures, Moses included. He massacred his priests because they worshiped the wrong god. I am sure he will come down soon too.
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:21 pm to beerJeep
quote:
Quite a few actually.
Which ones?
Posted on 8/15/17 at 12:24 pm to dbeck
Well. There's the us capital for one.
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