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re: Hamas rejects proposed Gaza cease-fire minutes after Israel approves deal
Posted on 7/15/14 at 8:46 am to Burt Reynolds
Posted on 7/15/14 at 8:46 am to Burt Reynolds
quote:How do the policies of Hamas differ from the Palestinian Charter of 1968? Why hasn't Hamas modified their 1988 Covenant if their policies have changed? Symbolic gestures aside, that Covenant reflects the official positions of Hamas.
Hamas would've never been in control if Palestine were a unified country.
quote:What is the meaning of Article 31 of the Hamas Covenant? Giving Islam precedence over other religions, and its followers preferential treatment, sounds like an Apartheid policy to me. So your opposition isn't to Apartheid policies just who imposes them and who suffers from them.
Apartheid society has that effect on people.
2
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:01 am to JEAUXBLEAUX
quote:
Israel needs to accept a Palestinian state in Gaza and West bank but only with 100% guarantees no terrorism or rockets or reprisals.
The various groups in Palestinian territories love to point fingers at each other while claiming they are innocent, meaning that they have no control over their rivals but will treat any Israeli response as aggression against them.
That kind of triangle bullshite can't stand if they're going to be considered an actual sovereign nation.
If jackasses in Gaza are going to fire rockets into Israel, then Israel has the right to expect the authorities in Gaza to do something about it or Israel should have the right to fix the matter.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:03 am to Poodlebrain
quote:
How do the policies of Hamas differ from the Palestinian Charter of 1968? Why hasn't Hamas modified their 1988 Covenant if their policies have changed? Symbolic gestures aside, that Covenant reflects the official positions of Hamas.
Have you seen Likud's charter?
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:04 am to BeYou
quote:It sounds to me like Isreal just stopped firing for a few hours. I doubt the Palestinians have the infrastructure to fully institute a cease-fire that quickly.
Hamas rejects proposed Gaza cease-fire minutes after Israel approves deal
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:05 am to BeYou
Because they don't really want an agreement - they just want Israel gone.
The only way to do that is to continue to generate global animosity towards them. And they have to do that by protecting their rockets with innocent woment and children.
The only way to do that is to continue to generate global animosity towards them. And they have to do that by protecting their rockets with innocent woment and children.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:10 am to teke184
quote:
The various groups in Palestinian territories love to point fingers at each other while claiming they are innocent, meaning that they have no control over their rivals but will treat any Israeli response as aggression against them.
That kind of triangle bullshite can't stand if they're going to be considered an actual sovereign nation.
If jackasses in Gaza are going to fire rockets into Israel, then Israel has the right to expect the authorities in Gaza to do something about it or Israel should have the right to fix the matter.
I agree with this. Hamas in Gaza, and Fatah in the West Bank, should be held responsible for anything emanating from their territories. Hezbollah realizes this which is why when Al Qaeda tried to set up shop in Lebanon, they immediately took them out, lest they get blamed for Al Qaeda attacks on Israel.
On the other hand, when Israel turns a blind eye to settler attacks on Palestinians, they are just as irresponsible as the Palestinians.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:12 am to ApexTiger
quote:
Just imagine living in New Jersey and the surrounding boarders were full of people who wanted you gone...
I think that is actually the case in the northeast. It was the main reason Christie blocked the toll roads going in.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:13 am to trackfan
quote:Yes. It states the belief that the West Bank should be part of Israel. It also states
Have you seen Likud's charter?
quote:Sounds to me as if Likud has always recognized the possibility of trading land for peace.
Israel will invite her neighbors to hold direct negotiations, in order to sign without pre-conditions on either side and without any solution formula invented by outsiders (invented outside ).
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:15 am to Ace Midnight
They want the movement, they don't care about the violence. Rejecting the ceasefire means Israel will continue to respond heavily, making for good tv and bringing more support to the Palestinian cause.
Golda Meir was correct in saying; "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us."
Golda Meir was correct in saying; "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us."
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:16 am to trackfan
quote:
On the other hand, when Israel turns a blind eye to settler attacks on Palestinians, they are just as irresponsible as the Palestinians.
Nobody has clean hands in the region. Since you conceded the earlier points, I concede this one - Israel should do a much better job of security in and around the settlements and not just protecting the settlers.
In any event, I always thought a better solution was for Israel to keep Gaza and put all the Palestinians on the West Bank - dismantle the settlements on the West Bank or transfer them to the relocated Palestinians. That way, Israel could have been "contiguous" and a future Palestinian state would have been contiguous, at least in theory. But, nobody asked me.
Problems:
1. Gaza is a $hithole.
2. Relocating that many Palestinians/Jews, more or less involuntarily, upon orders of their respective governments, would have looked a lot like the Trail of Tears or the Holocaust (at least the transportation part).
But, now, we're going to have increasingly fractured and insecure areas with little in the way of law, order, security or stability for the Palestinians (the vast majority of them are just regular, ordinary people who want to lead normal lives) or the Israelis in the settlements (the vast majority of them are just regular, ordinary people who want to lead normal lives).
And it will be expensive and violent - until the next round of attacks/reprisals/ceasefire/agreement/broken agreement.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:19 am to Poodlebrain
The US and Israeli governments are two of the most terroristic governments on the planet. Both create their own problems in the middle east. The US helps Israel create its own problems. The religious lobby in the United States helps perpetuate this madness. As long as religion governs the affairs and policies of government, there will never be peace on this planet. It drives the majority of violence. All based on ancient holy books. It is absolute insanity. I agree with you Burt. The Israelis had no right to the territory carved up for them after WW2. That is what happens when you use a Bronze Age manual for geopolitical solutions in the 20th and 21st Century.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:21 am to genuineLSUtiger
quote:No.
The US and Israeli governments are two of the most terroristic governments on the planet.
quote:Yes.
Both create their own problems in the middle east. The US helps Israel create its own problems. The religious lobby in the United States helps perpetuate this madness.
quote:
As long as religion governs the affairs and policies of government, there will never be peace on this planet.
There will never be peace, period.
quote:Hilarious.
The Israelis had no right to the territory carved up for them after WW2.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:22 am to Poodlebrain
quote:
Sounds to me as if Likud has always recognized the possibility of trading land for peace
Did you see he parts where it says that they will NEVER approve of a Palestinian state, nor giving Israeli citizenship to the Palestinians? I don't know wat kind o peace you envision.
This post was edited on 7/15/14 at 9:24 am
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:25 am to genuineLSUtiger
quote:
The US and Israeli governments are two of the most terroristic governments on the planet. Both create their own problems in the middle east. The US helps Israel create its own problems. The religious lobby in the United States helps perpetuate this madness. As long as religion governs the affairs and policies of government, there will never be peace on this planet. It drives the majority of violence. All based on ancient holy books. It is absolute insanity. I agree with you Burt. The Israelis had no right to the territory carved up for them after WW2. That is what happens when you use a Bronze Age manual for geopolitical solutions in the 20th and 21st Century.
Amen!
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:52 am to bamafan1001
quote:
People like you are lost causes. Just like your lord and savior Obama, you have no qualms throwing honesty out the window for the sake of your argument.
Obama my savior I think not
Posted on 7/15/14 at 9:57 am to Ace Midnight
quote:
Nobody has clean hands in the region
this
sad but some don't come to grips with it
This post was edited on 7/15/14 at 10:10 am
Posted on 7/15/14 at 10:01 am to genuineLSUtiger
quote:
The US and Israeli governments are two of the most terroristic governments on the planet.
It's like you know exactly what to say to make me ignore you.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 10:05 am to Revelator
Egypt's peace proposal was designed to be unacceptable to Hamas. The point is to justify an Israeli ground offensive.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 10:32 am to genuineLSUtiger
quote:What rights did Poland have to Prussia after WWII? What rights did the Soviet Union have to the Baltic states and parts of Poland? Why are there two separate Korean nations? Why were colonial masters reinstalled? Victors have the right to dictate terms. It was in fact the same victors who dictated the terms for the division of the territories in the Middle East. How was one division more or less legitimate than the others?
The Israelis had no right to the territory carved up for them after WW2.
Posted on 7/15/14 at 10:36 am to Poodlebrain
I've never believed that might makes right. Palestinian families were displaced to create and carve out an artificial state based on a 2,500 year old holy book. It drives a huge percentage of animosity in the middle east. The US meddling for oil and geopolitical advantage drives most of the other.
This post was edited on 7/15/14 at 10:37 am
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