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Message
re: Democrats criticize GOP for moving forward on repeal of Obamacare
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:30 pm to BamaAtl
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:30 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
But repealing and delaying the repeal is cowardly. Let's hope this election doesn't have the consequences of denying millions of Americans access to healthcare, and subsequently killing thousands - all because Republicans are cowards.
I actually used to enjoy debating healthcare with you, but your shilling of the ACA as a whole, and your chicken little act has put quite a dent in your credibility.
It's a shame, b/c I think you know what you're talking about. But ideology, or just this board, has blinded you
0
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:34 pm to BamaAtl
Melt!!
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:34 pm to MSMHater
quote:
Patients with pre-existing conditions are winners, kids under 26 are winners, and the highest utilizers under the poverty line are winners.
these would be a ton to me.
quote:
The younger, healthier below poverty are now paying for a product they didn't previously desire. The middle class young and healthy are getting screwed like no one else. And the adult middle class is now paying more toward the cost of care than at any point in their lifetime.
There are a lot of losers.
But again, the losers know they are losing. the winners don't.
quote:
ANd the people actually paying for it think that's a flawed ideology.
The problem is the only real alternative is universal health care, if you want to deal with preexisting conditions. I dont think those high risk pools will do shite, except dump the sickest of everyone on the middle class.
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:42 pm to skrayper
Easy solution is let the free market go with some reduced regulation and nation competition while offering a public option.
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:53 pm to oklahogjr
quote:
Easy solution is let the free market go with some reduced regulation and nation competition while offering a public option.
While I don't disagree, the arms race that has been the insurance vs the provider for so many years may make a free market solution hard to implement.
The reason healthcare in this country is so expensive compared to countries with equal technology isn't because they offer free, government healthcare. It's because insurance companies would only pay what they think they should pay, and hospitals (and doctors) had to drum up those bills to get what was actually spent. That, coupled with medical malpractice lawsuits and rampant pharmaceutical costs, have led to a veritable quagmire that I do not envy anyone trying to "fix".
The countries that spend the next most to the US still spend 34% per person less than us. Best healthcare in the world or not, that's an absurd jump from #2 to #1.
We have a mentality in this country: If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
The biggest problem is no one can agree on the definition of "broke", at least in the context of healthcare.
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:57 pm to Hawkeye95
quote:
its good politics thought.
Is it? Because repealing means that insurance companies will trip over themselves in their haste to vacate the market - the only way to stop it would be a Republican-owned bailout of big insurance, for no reason than their own cowardice.
quote:
Repealing obmacare might end up being awesome, especially if they can manage to replace it somehow.
With what? There's nothing that's been proposed to replace it that solves the fundamental problems of access and cost.
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:58 pm to BamaAtl
quote:You mean the ones that already have bailed or the handful that are left?
Is it? Because repealing means that insurance companies will trip over themselves in their haste to vacate the market
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:59 pm to Aristo
quote:
Healthcare and health insurance are not the same things.
Do you propose we give you free chemotherapy when you lose your insurance (but not your job, so you're not Medicaid-eligible)?
How many times should we do that before you'll save every large hospital in the country from bankruptcy?
Posted on 1/3/17 at 1:59 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:
Democrats think it is murder when the government doesn't fund someone's consumption of healthcare.
Republicans don't think it's harmful to remove someone's ability to purchase healthcare without a replacement plan.
Good luck with that.
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:02 pm to skrayper
quote:
First, Republicans don't want to have to suddenly revoke 11.3 million American citizens of healthcare without an alternative
Estimates range from 20-30 million Americans who will lose health insurance if the ACA is repealed without a replacement plan. Not 11.3
quote:
Democrats need to either fully let go of Obamacare (acknowledging it to the rest of the country that it was a failure)
It isn't! Health care costs are slowing down, readmission rates are decreasing, more people are insured, etc etc etc. You just refuse to admit it because Obama got it passed, not Bush.
quote:
The BEST solution is to come up with either a transitory period, giving those who signed up for the ACA to find an alternative
Why would any insurance company stay in a market that is about to collapse? There will be no transitory period without a Republican-funded bailout.
quote:
a bipartisan solution to keep something akin to the ACA that is mutually acceptable to both sides.
You mean..the ACA? The Republican plan for health insurance reform? If that's not acceptable to Republicans, nothing will be.
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:04 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
Because repealing means that insurance companies will trip over themselves in their haste to vacate the market
Why would payers quickly exit a market that is now not limited to plans with "minimum qualifying benefits"?
They can actually provide a broad range of products if the minimum benefits needed to sell on the exchange are eliminated. Payers are exiting b/c they can't provide all those benefits to high utilizing exchange users and remain profitable.
quote:
There's nothing that's been proposed to replace it that solves the fundamental problems of access and cost.
Nothing is currently in place that fixes the fundamental problems of cost and quality anyway. Only access is addressed, at the expense of the other two. That's terrible health policy.
This post was edited on 1/3/17 at 2:07 pm
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:05 pm to Jbird
quote:
You mean the ones that already have bailed or the handful that are left?
The ones who are left, who are now starting to show profits in the individual markets. The ones who underpriced and bailed are already gone, obviously.
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:07 pm to BamaAtl
quote:Hmm like my $2500 in savings?
The ones who underpriced
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:17 pm to MSMHater
quote:
Why would payers quickly exit a market that is now not limited to plans with "minimum qualifying benefits"?
Without a mandate, who's going to buy that? Lot of healthy 27 year-olds looking to get into the health insurance market before they need it, in your eyes?
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:18 pm to Jbird
quote:
Hmm like my $2500 in savings?
30M people being kicked off of their health insurance is a rounder number, imho.
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:19 pm to BamaAtl
Wait I thought they were getting Killed? 
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:19 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
Is it?
I think it is. Repeat the benefits, delay the costs.
quote:
use repealing means that insurance companies will trip over themselves in their haste to vacate the market - the only way to stop it would be a Republican-owned bailout of big insurance, for no reason than their own cowardice.
easy enough to spin. Obamacare sucks. Its worked for years.
quote:
With what? There's nothing that's been proposed to replace it that solves the fundamental problems of access and cost.
yeah, I dont think there is a replacement that will address its shortcomings. But it doesn't mean one doesn't exist.
The democrats have zero power here, so all they can do it cheer/jeer. better to be optimistic if you are just a dude on the internet.
Let the Rs own this. It should be fun to see what happens, although I do worry about those who lose coverage. But oh the frick well, again nothign we can do.
This post was edited on 1/3/17 at 2:21 pm
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:19 pm to BamaAtl
30 million. 
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:21 pm to BBONDS25
Innit funny how they all have the same talking points?
Posted on 1/3/17 at 2:22 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
30M people being kicked off of their health insurance is a rounder number, imho.
and a large part of them will be republican voters. The 26-40 are the ones that screwed under obamacare and less likely to receive the upside to it.
The 50-65 age group is the one that likely benefits the most. Trump handily won that age group.
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