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re: "conservatives worry about threats to America---except the ones really kill" -JS
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:05 pm to USMCTiger03
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:05 pm to USMCTiger03
quote:
So much stupid that it's hard to know where to start.
+1
mental disorder
social disease
sad
0
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:06 pm to the808bass
quote:
To be clear, by what measure?
By all of them, probably.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:07 pm to inelishaitrust
quote:
Every industrialized nation with more government involvement has significantly less expensive healthcare than we do
Are these the only two variables that go into healthcare costs? If not, then your post is meaningless.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:11 pm to inelishaitrust
Per capita spending isn't nearly so impressive to me. We have the most accessible and responsive healthcare system with the highest rates of survival for Major illnesses and conditions. That's not free.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:12 pm to KeyserSoze999
quote:
the libs have had their playbook open to the same page for so long that they now think the proper MO is to mock any counter-agenda language as extreme.
It's like there's some big BF Skinner experiment where a lib gets a food pellet every time they say "extreme, waronwomenz, or Bush."
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:13 pm to inelishaitrust
How the hell can you sit there and say that america has the least government involvement?
This post was edited on 10/17/14 at 1:14 pm
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:14 pm to GoCrazyAuburn
quote:
Are these the only two variables that go into healthcare costs? If not, then your post is meaningless.
My post was in response to someone arguing that these are the only two factors. I believe there are many factors for our healthcare costs. The obesity epidemic is probably the most detrimental. People who say government involvement is the problem (a lot of people) are hilariously wrong.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:16 pm to inelishaitrust
Government involvement in healthcare is certainly a big driver of costs. It may not be the biggest. But it is pretty obviously part of the equation.
LINK
LINK
This post was edited on 10/17/14 at 1:18 pm
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:18 pm to Napoleon
quote:So, it's your contention that presently, without single payer, only the rich are receiving care?
but single payer is the only way that everyone has a fair shot at healthcare.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:18 pm to the808bass
quote:
Per capita spending isn't nearly so impressive to me. We have the most accessible and responsive healthcare system with the highest rates of survival for Major illnesses and conditions. That's not free.
I agree that we have one of, if not the best healthcare systems in the world.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:20 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
So, it's your contention that presently, without single payer, only the rich are receiving care?
The poor are receiving emergency care, and it's billed to the taxpayers.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:21 pm to inelishaitrust
quote:So... go to those countries when you need cancer care. Why pay US rates when you can go get "cheap" care somewhere else?
Every industrialized nation with more government involvement has significantly less expensive healthcare than we do.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:22 pm to inelishaitrust
quote:Does it include the cost of illegals? The "per capita" divisor almost certainly doesn't count illegals.
By all of them, probably.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:23 pm to inelishaitrust
quote:Plenty of private clinics in my area that are geared towards poor folks. Sliding scales methods of payment.
The poor are receiving emergency care
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:24 pm to inelishaitrust
quote:No. It's not. Most taxpayer reimbursement doesn't even cover OPEX much less CAPEX. Most of cost is shifted to insurance companies. Does it drive prices up, or down?
The poor are receiving emergency care, and it's billed to the taxpayers.
This post was edited on 10/17/14 at 1:25 pm
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:27 pm to the808bass
quote:
Government involvement in healthcare is certainly a big driver of costs. It may not be the biggest. But it is pretty obviously part of the equation.
You're right, Healthcare costs rose when we started giving poor people healthcare.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:27 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
No. It's not. Most of it is shifted to insurance companies. Does it drive prices up, or down?
It contributes less to prices than tort law does. And the government does reimburse hospitals for indigent care. So it's shifted mostly to the government and then managed care secondly.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:30 pm to inelishaitrust
quote:When did we start "giving" care to poor people? There is a long history of care for poor people before the new deal and great society.
Healthcare costs rose when we started giving poor people healthcare.
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:38 pm to inelishaitrust
quote:False. Costs have been relatively flat. Even declining in many cases (see self-pay specialties like plastics any option) Prices are what is rising.
You're right, Healthcare costs rose when we started giving poor people healthcare.
The question you should be asking is: do we deny healthcare to those that do not pay, or do we deny healthcare to those that do pay?
Posted on 10/17/14 at 1:51 pm to Napoleon
quote:
but single payer is the only way that everyone has a fair shot at healthcare.
And everyone gets a worse product.
Healthcare is a commodity subject to supply and demand - just like everything else. Socialized medicine increases demand drastically while stagnating supply resulting in an inferior service.
But if you want to wait 3 months to get an MRI despite possibly having an aggressive brain tumor then, by all means, keep working for socialized medicine.
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