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re: "Conservatives" agree to new entitlement program costing hundreds of millions per year
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:19 pm to 4cubbies
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:19 pm to 4cubbies
quote:The basic point that it's the students, not the schools, we appear to agree nearly 100% if not 100% on.
The rest of your post didn’t address that voucher students perform worse at voucher schools than they did at traditional public schools. That’s why I mentioned it.
Are you just looking to argue? Sheesh.
0
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:21 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
If our Public system were private, everyone would get fired.
If the public kids were in the private system, no one would be paying $10k-$30k per year for their student to join them.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:21 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:Which sadly is why there's really no solution.
n a state like LA, more parents are like Quanasha than are not.
This ain't Alaska.
Literally every possible solution would result in screams of racism. There are exactly zero solutions that are politically feasible.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:21 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:Is it that straightforward? How do Tuition Donation Credit Programs, School Choice for Exceptionalities, Elementary and Secondary School Tuition Deductions, Student Scholarships for Educational Excellence Program mesh with this?
But the vast majority of this program would be for kids who don't use the public schools in the first place, so the state isn't currently paying anything for these kids.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:22 pm to Wishing Well
quote:
We could improve every public school system in the nation if we simply made one school in every district the place we send the lost causes.
The problem in shite schools isn't the fact that the horrible kids in the school fail. The problem is that the horrible kids in the school CAUSE OTHER KIDS who might have a chance to fail also. They bleed resources. They bleed teacher attention. They cause good teachers to leave at the first opportunity. So the few kids who show up actually giving a frick are shite out of luck.
We can try vouchers to help those kids escape but poor kids like this can't go to the private school for many reasons and money is just 1.
Alas. No one wants to make the hard call. No wants to give up on 12 year old Johnny who is on his 3rd stint in the court system. So, we remain stuck in quicksand.
In our school district, sending a kid to the alt school almost always comes with a hearing before the school board, where mom (usually no dad) says my didn;t do nuttin and it's not his fault and racism and all that, and so then the school board, more often than not is scared of a PR nightmare so they put the kid right back in the school.
That happens enough, and the school administrators finally decide to just cut out the time and energy and leave the kid in the school.
Until we get elected officials - at all levels - who are willing to do what's right for the 95% of kids who WANT to be in school... nothing will change.
And by the way, at least in LA, a lot of the private schools will put up with a lot as well, because they don't want to lose that tuition check. Only the absolute best private schools have any sort of discipline system.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:23 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:Are you claiming the system creates jobs for average students after they graduate? Or are you saying everyone who works in a school is a very average human?
But it creates a lot of jobs for very average humans.
Both statements are laughable but which one are you committing to?
quote:
If our Public system were private, everyone would get fired.
Have you ever been to a Walmart or McDonald’s? Remind me which government agency operates those?
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:24 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
In a state like LA, more parents are like Quanasha than are not.
This ain't Alaska.
You’ve obviously never been to Alaska.
Or many places in Louisiana.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:25 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
How do Tuition Donation Credit Programs, School Choice for Exceptionalities, Elementary and Secondary School Tuition Deductions, Student Scholarships for Educational Excellence Program mesh with this?
LA does not have a very big school credit setup, compared to other states, because of the presence of school vouchers for a lot of poor kids.
I would imagine if you took this money, you would also not get the limited tuition deduction for state taxes, but honestly I have not seen that spelled out anywhere. In any event, such a deducton is not worth all that much considering our low tax rates.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:25 pm to meansonny
quote:
$7,951
This is what Utah spends on per student education.
quote:
$16,128
This is what Hawaii spends on per student education
Their achievement is roughly the same.
quote:
$22,832
Washington DC.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:25 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:Yeah. See my post just before this one. They're shooting themselves in the foot and, at this point, I don't care.
In our school district, sending a kid to the alt school almost always comes with a hearing before the school board, where mom (usually no dad) says my didn;t do nuttin and it's not his fault and racism and all that, and so then the school board, more often than not is scared of a PR nightmare so they put the kid right back in the school.
quote:I don't think it's about elected officials.
Until we get elected officials - at all levels - who are willing to do what's right for the 95% of kids who WANT to be in school... nothing will change.
The best hopes we have are 2 longshots.
1. Blacks suddenly start caring more about themselves than about screaming racism at every turn.
or.
2. Blacks become so overwhelmed demographically in the US that we stop giving a frick what they think.
#2, oddly enough. Could happen with the massive influx of hispanics because unlike blacks. Hispanics who have been here a minute actually give a shite about education and mirror whites a good bit culturally on this front.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:26 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
Have you ever been to a Walmart or McDonald’s? Remind me which government agency operates those?
They operate cheaply.
Unlike schools which have budgets higher than many municipal budgets in some cities.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:29 pm to RogerTheShrubber
You haven’t given us the acceptable amount a state or parish/county should spend on educating its children. You just keep complaining about the high cost but you haven’t given any dollar amounts or explained why that should be considered too much money.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:30 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
You haven’t given us the acceptable amount a state or parish/county should spend on educating its children.
Which is precisely the reason it needs competition, to set market prices.
We may be underpaying..
This post was edited on 4/9/24 at 2:33 pm
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:30 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
Property taxes. Wrong, try again.
No, I'm right. From wiki...
quote:
47 percent of Louisiana public education funding comes from local tax revenues
It's a mix of state and parish. My parish is property taxes.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:30 pm to 4cubbies
quote:LOL I'm sure you think there's a point in this response but those companies both meet the exact expectations of their customer bases which is evidenced by their overwhelming success.
Have you ever been to a Walmart or McDonald’s? Remind me which government agency operates those?
Last I checked, no one kidnaps anyone and forces them to do business with either yet, billions upon billions of dollars continue to flow thru.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:34 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
You haven’t given us the acceptable amount a state or parish/county should spend on educating its children. You just keep complaining about the high cost but you haven’t given any dollar amounts or explained why that should be considered too much money.
Um. If one can succeed spending $20 in one place and another fails at the same task while spending $40, then yeah, one can make an argument that there is a ceiling of reasonable.
What Roger's numbers demonstrate isn't that there is some ideal amount but rather, that apparently in some places, no amount is enough.
The current public school model means that in certain districts, no amount of money can solve the problem. If Utah can succeed with less than $10K per student and Washington DC can't succeed on 2.5x that number, then clearly, it ain't the dollars that's the problem. So why spend more at that point?
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:34 pm to RogerTheShrubber
Part of that differnece is cost of living
Part of that difference is probably student needs
Part of that difference is probably student needs
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:35 pm to Wishing Well
quote:
1. Blacks suddenly start caring more about themselves than about screaming racism at every turn.
This only works because elected officials allow it to work.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:36 pm to Wishing Well
quote:
I'm sure you think there's a point in this response but those companies both meet the exact expectations of their customer bases which is evidenced by their overwhelming success.
People continue to send their kids to public schools, too. I guess they are as successful as Walmart and McDonald’s in your eyes, which is a testament to their effectiveness, right?
After all, last I checked, no one kidnaps anyone and forces their kids to go to public schools but most kids still end up there.
Posted on 4/9/24 at 2:37 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
Part of that differnece is cost of living
Part of that difference is probably student needs
Like I said in my earlier long post in a different way.
Places like DC, Baltimore, many areas in the South, etc etc, are simply impossible to address in terms of public schools without acceptance of what must be done.
And, no one is ever going to accept for fear of being called racist so, there's honestly no hope for those places.
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