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Started By
Message
re: Christian Artists Could Be Fined, Jailed for Refusing to Make Gay Wedding Cards
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:58 am to ballscaster
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:58 am to ballscaster
quote:
Our Creator. Liberty is a basic right. Hence, we have the right to marry. We are humans. If we haven't the right to marry, we are beneath humanness.
You have lost your fricking mind
1
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:59 am to goldennugget
quote:Ok Stalin.
You have lost your fricking mind
Sorry that Liberty triggers you.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:00 am to AUstar
quote:
Sounds good in theory, but there are laws already forcing businesses to serve people that they might not have in the past (such as in the south pre 1960). Do you think a bunch of white people who didn't want to serve black people, for example, would have ANY success at all trying to challenge the Civil Rights Act in court? Even though I agree that these women should be left alone, I am afraid that there is precedent in America already that forces businesses in doing things they might not want to do. This isn't going to change. You must serve gay people even if it's against your religious convictions.
Yeah ....that ship sailed when the SCOTUS affirmed gay marriage. Whatever your opinion on it is, gay marriage is the law of the land.
I don't buy the argument that someone who is in business to serve the public has the universal right to refuse service for whatever reason they choose. It was the same argument segregationists made 50 years ago.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:04 am to 14&Counting
quote:Right. There has never been a time in this country when commerce wasn't regulated to some extent. There's no reason we should think that today should be different.
I don't buy the argument that someone who is in business to serve the public has the universal right to refuse service for whatever reason they choose
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:05 am to ballscaster
Nobody was stopping homosexuals from living together, having sex, etc. Those things were already rights.
For most, their creator identifies marriage as a union between a man and a woman. So, forcing them to take part in a gay marriage is a violation of their human right.
The thing is, libs like you aren't satisfied with equality. You want to make everyone adhere to the same ideology and will only be satisfied when people who disagree are forced by threat of law.
At the very least, this should have been left up to the states to decide.
For most, their creator identifies marriage as a union between a man and a woman. So, forcing them to take part in a gay marriage is a violation of their human right.
The thing is, libs like you aren't satisfied with equality. You want to make everyone adhere to the same ideology and will only be satisfied when people who disagree are forced by threat of law.
At the very least, this should have been left up to the states to decide.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:09 am to LSU Patrick
quote:
It can't when an activist SCOTUS rules that marriage is a human right. We were screwed the minute that ruling was made
The "market" was trending towards gay marriage but the right turned to the state to try to stop the market. If anything, SCOTUS restored control to the market.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:11 am to LSU Patrick
quote:
So, forcing them to take part in a gay marriage is a violation of their human right.
They are not being forced to participate in a gay marriage. They are in the business of operating a business that provides services (in this case wedding services) to the public. Same sex marriage has been decided and it is now a legal and binding marriage in all states.
quote:
You want to make everyone adhere to the same ideology and will only be satisfied when people who disagree are forced by threat of law.
No is making you adhere to an ideology. However, if you operate a business that serves the public then you are required to serve the public equally.
quote:
At the very least, this should have been left up to the states to decide.
It was...however, there were constitutional and federal issues that needed to be resolved.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:12 am to ballscaster
quote:
Sorry that Liberty triggers you.
You called being forced to do business liberty?
We're going to see a lot of businesses close down if this stuff stands. No one will like the result of Christians removing themselves from the general marketplace.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:12 am to 14&Counting
quote:
They are not being forced to participate in a gay marriage.
Not sure how you can separate wedding invites (or cake, or catering) for a gay wedding from participation in a gay wedding. Personally, I won't prepare a tax return for a gay married couple. I can't fill it out in that way because their marriage does not exist.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 9:14 am
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:13 am to LSU Patrick
quote:It was. They all ratified the 14th Amendment. It's settled. Deal with it. If you run a business, your business will follow the law lest it be subject to some sort of punishment.
this should have been left up to the states to decide.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:14 am to ballscaster
quote:
They all ratified the 14th Amendment.
Yes, because when the 14th Amendment was ratified they definitely had gay marriage in mind.
ETA: The 14th Amendment would never have been ratified if gay marriage was what it was about.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 9:16 am
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:15 am to imjustafatkid
quote:Every business that exists is free to cease operations if it cannot operate in a manner that is compliant with the law, no questions asked.
being forced to do business
quote:Your problem, not the rest of the world's.
Not sure how you can separate wedding invites (or cake, or catering) for a gay wedding from participation in a gay wedding.
quote:If you do not like what the 14th Amendment says, you have the right to vote every two years for a representative to execute whatever agenda you please.
Yes, because when the 14th Amendment was ratified they definitely had gay marriage in mind.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 9:16 am
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:16 am to imjustafatkid
quote:
Not sure how you can separate wedding invites (or cake, or catering) for a gay wedding from participation in a gay wedding.
I can easily separate it....they are in the market providing a service to the public. Gay marriage is legal. Therefore, they are required to treat it no differently.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:16 am to ballscaster
quote:
Every business that exists is free to cease operations if it cannot operate in a manner that is compliant with the law, no questions asked.
This is not the answer you want, but that is what will happen. Or businesses will simply cease doing wedding invites.
quote:
Your problem, not the rest of the world's.
If it wasn't the rest of the world's problem, we wouldn't be talking about it. Everyone will agree with me eventually. This will not end at forcing Christians to serve gay weddings. Especially once Christians simply remove themselves from that business altogether.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 9:19 am
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:17 am to 14&Counting
quote:
I can easily separate it....they are in the market providing a service to the public. Gay marriage is legal. Therefore, they are required to treat it no differently.
No they aren't. They are in the market doing business with whomever they choose. This is not a public utility.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:19 am to imjustafatkid
quote:
The 14th Amendment would never have been ratified if gay marriage was what it was about.
It would never have even been thought about.
Don't like the fact that a company won't print wedding invites for your gay wedding? Go to another company. How could it be any more difficult? Unless, of course, your sole purpose is to make a point and ruin somebody elses livelihood for not believed the way that you think they should believe.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:19 am to imjustafatkid
quote:Very well. If that is what a Joe Blow LLC wants to do, that is Joe Blow LLC's prerogative.
This is not the answer you want, but that is what will happen. Or businesses will simply cease doing wedding invites.
quote:You're pulling the "you're on the wrong side of history" card now like a damn liberal. You can't defend your stance with facts or with anything in the Constitution, so you are leaving it to future generations to prove you right, just like the batshit left. Get real.
Everyone will agree with me eventually.
quote:Persecution complex. It's real.
forcing Christians to serve gay weddings.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:20 am to imjustafatkid
He does not believe in freedom of conscience or association.
He wants the state to force it's orthodoxy onto others even to the extent that they must violate their conscience and their right to pursue happiness.
He resides in the darkest corner of evil's realm.
He wants the state to force it's orthodoxy onto others even to the extent that they must violate their conscience and their right to pursue happiness.
He resides in the darkest corner of evil's realm.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:22 am to TrueTiger
quote:I'll decide what I believe. You can't have my voice.
He does not believe in freedom of conscience or association.
He wants the state to force it's orthodoxy onto others even to the extent that they must violate their conscience and their right to pursue happiness.
He resides in the darkest corner of evil's realm.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 9:23 am to imjustafatkid
quote:
No they aren't. They are in the market doing business with whomever they choose. This is not a public utility.
The same argument you are making today was the same argument made 50-years ago when the Civil Rights Act was passed. I would suggest reading about the the Heart of Atlanta case
LINK
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