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re: checks and balances...

Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:07 pm to
Posted by GEAUXmedic
Premium Member
Member since Nov 2011
41598 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:07 pm to
You should've stayed on the OT.

Trump's executive order isn't unconstitutional, it is very constitutional, which is why that judge's opinion doesn't matter.
This post was edited on 1/29/17 at 1:08 pm
Posted by Iowa Golfer
Heaven
Member since Dec 2013
10230 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:07 pm to
This actually be argued. The Judge was very careful in the order however.

It's interesting that those that were being made fun of about a Judge not being able to do what was first reported were actually correct. When later reporting came, we actually saw how limited the order was.
Posted by LSU Fan 90812
A man more eviler than Skeletor.
Member since Feb 2005
50655 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:07 pm to
quote:

On January 28, 2017, the petitioners filed an Emergency Motion of Stay of Removal on behalf of themselves and others similarly situated.
IT APPEARING to the Court from the Emergency Motion for Stay of Removal, the other submissions, the arguments of counsel, and the hearing held on the 28th of January, 2017,
1. The petitioners have a strong likelihood of success in establishing that the removal of the petitioner and others similarly situated violates their rights to Due Process and Equal Protection guaranteed by the United States Constitution;
2. There is imminent danger that, absent the stay of removal, there will be substantial and irreparable injury to refugees, visa-holders, and other individuals from nations subject to the January 27, 2017 Executive Order;
3. The issuance of the stay of removal will not injure the other parties interested in the proceeding;
4. It is appropriate and just that, pending completion of a hearing before the Court on the merits of the Petition, that the Respondents be enjoined and restrained from the commission of further acts and misconduct in violation of the Constitution as described in the Emergency Motion for Stay of Removal.
WHEREFORE, IT IS HEREBY ORDERED that the respondents, their officers, agents, servants, employees, attorneys, and all members and persons acting in concert or participation with them, from the date of this Order, are
ENJOINED AND RESTRAINED from, in any manner or by any means, removing individuals with refugee applications approved by U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services as part of the U.S. Refugee Admissions Program, holders of valid immigrant and non-immigrant visas, and other individuals from Iraq, Syria, Iran, Sudan, Libya, Somalia, and Yemen legally authorized to enter the United States.


IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that to assure compliance with the Court's order, the Court directs service of this Order upon the United States Marshal for the Eastern District of New York, and further directs the United States Marshals Service to take those actions deemed necessary to enforce the provisions and prohibitions set forth in this Order.


i'd also add that this case i'm fairly certain has been class certified. which means it applies to all to which this case would apply.

and right now, homeland security is still ordering things in direct conflict with this ruling.

can we talk about it now?
This post was edited on 1/29/17 at 1:11 pm
Posted by buckeye_vol
Member since Jul 2014
35236 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:08 pm to
quote:

You need to look up both the court order, and what a stay actually is.

Then we can debate your concern, but until that time, one really can't argue against a statement that has flaws.

So I can't present my concern with statements like this:
quote:

Whoa. The NY Fed judge has power over the president? Never knew that.
That wasn't too bad since it was an honest question, but this comment was more troubling, especially since it was a poster who makes a lot of threads:
quote:

He doesn't have the power to stop this. Congress, and the Supreme Court, is the checks and balances you fricking bafoon.
This goes beyond this particular incident.
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167218 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:10 pm to
quote:


well we need to explain it to them. and why it's important!

remind them that it's the very thing that got W elected.
remind them that it's the courts that get to decide if abortion is constitutional.


hey repubicans on this board, this is super important. it's not about crying. it's not about winning. it's not even about the issue.

this thing that exists is what makes america great. no branch can rise too much in power. the congress can check the president. the courts can check the congress. the president can veto the bill.

if any one branch goes too much in power, it is really really really dangerous. we're not talking about working within the constitution. we're talking about actual deconstruction of the document itself.




You typed all of this and have no idea what they stay is about
Posted by LSU Fan 90812
A man more eviler than Skeletor.
Member since Feb 2005
50655 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:11 pm to
stout, don't be rude man. shite. i come from a family of lawyers. you think i don't know what a stay is? i worked in a law office for five years and got a scholarship to law school. you don't think i know what a stay is?
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
260266 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:12 pm to
Bush, Obama and Trump trampled on the constitution. It's how we do business now
Posted by buckeye_vol
Member since Jul 2014
35236 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:13 pm to
quote:

Bush, Obama and Trump trampled on the constitution. It's how we do business now
Then people need to stop saying that they care about the constitution.
Posted by Iowa Golfer
Heaven
Member since Dec 2013
10230 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:14 pm to
I wasn't responding to you. You can express whatever concern you want, but at some point you probably need to understand why the Judge worded his order the way he did. Because he clearly can't judicially change a large part of Trump's eo.

I wish he did, so you could see how quickly the SCOTUS would have ruled on this. Probably by today.
Posted by GEAUXmedic
Premium Member
Member since Nov 2011
41598 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:14 pm to
quote:

stout, don't be rude man. shite. i come from a family of lawyers. you think i don't know what a stay is? i worked in a law office for five years and got a scholarship to law school. you don't think i know what a stay is?


So mad you had to repeat it twice.

Posted by Hugo Stiglitz
Member since Oct 2010
72937 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:15 pm to
quote:

or stfu

Well we see whose side you're on
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167218 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:15 pm to
I am sure you know what a stay is but the point is this particular one is very narrow and is not being ignored by Trump like you said. The rest of the EO is still enforceable which is what they are following.

Posted by LSU Fan 90812
A man more eviler than Skeletor.
Member since Feb 2005
50655 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:19 pm to
so why don't you say that?

why don't you say that you are of the opinion that president trump is following the court ordered stay, but disagree with the proposal that he is turning away legal visa-holding immigrants?

instead, you want to turn this about my wording or whatever.
you want to talk? let's talk.

you guys think this is just for kicks? like i don't care about this country just because i disagree with you? what the hell?
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
260266 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:20 pm to
quote:


Then people need to stop saying that they care about the constitution


If you mean people who supported these three, yes. I'm not one
Posted by buckeye_vol
Member since Jul 2014
35236 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:20 pm to
quote:

I wasn't responding to you. You can express whatever concern you want, but at some point you probably need to understand why the Judge worded his order the way he did. Because he clearly can't judicially change a large part of Trump's eo.

I wish he did, so you could see how quickly the SCOTUS would have ruled on this. Probably by today.

Fair enough. Then I guess we mostly, if not completely, agree.
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167218 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:22 pm to
quote:

instead, you want to turn this about my wording or whatever.



Because your first post is literally hyperbole. Let's look at it again:

quote:

the executive branch says no we're going full force right now anyway.

this is a constitutional crisis. the executive branch of government is overreaching it's constitutional mandate. the judicial branch is doing it's job.


They are still enforcing the EO while being sensitive to the stay which is not a constitutional crises.

quote:

you guys think this is just for kicks? like i don't care about this country just because i disagree with you?


Were you this pissed in 2011 when Barry suspended people for 3 months longer than Trump has?
This post was edited on 1/29/17 at 1:23 pm
Posted by LSU Fan 90812
A man more eviler than Skeletor.
Member since Feb 2005
50655 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:23 pm to
quote:

I wasn't responding to you. You can express whatever concern you want, but at some point you probably need to understand why the Judge worded his order the way he did. Because he clearly can't judicially change a large part of Trump's eo.


so you would agree that if we're turning away legal visa holding immigrants, that would violate the judge's order?
Posted by LSU Fan 90812
A man more eviler than Skeletor.
Member since Feb 2005
50655 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:24 pm to
quote:

They are still enforcing the EO while being sensitive to the stay which is not a constitutional crises.


quote:

A White House spokesperson defended the order Sunday, saying: "It is the right and duty of the President to do everything in his legal and constitutional power to protect the American people."

"Saturday's ruling does not undercut the President's executive order. All stopped visas will remain stopped. All halted admissions will remain halted. All restricted travel will remain prohibited. The executive order is a vital action toward strengthening America's borders, and therefore sovereignty. The order remains in place," the spokesperson said.
This post was edited on 1/29/17 at 1:26 pm
Posted by LSU Fan 90812
A man more eviler than Skeletor.
Member since Feb 2005
50655 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:25 pm to
quote:

Were you this pissed in 2011 when Barry suspended people for 3 months longer than Trump has?


firstly, yes. and secondly, what does this have to do with anything.
Posted by Iowa Golfer
Heaven
Member since Dec 2013
10230 posts
Posted on 1/29/17 at 1:26 pm to
Again, show me where the executive branch is disregarding the order. Now I know maybe some border patrol agent might violate the order, possibly innocently, but show me the broad disregard for the Judge's order.
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