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Started By
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Official Oil/Energy ETF Thread
Posted on 12/15/14 at 3:15 pm
Posted on 12/15/14 at 3:15 pm
Figured now would be a good time to have a thread dedicated to oil as energy ETF discussions.
Which so you consider the best? Pros/cons of the popular ones?
VDE
XLE
OIL
List which ones you like, prefer, dislike, over/underrated, etc
Which so you consider the best? Pros/cons of the popular ones?
VDE
XLE
OIL
List which ones you like, prefer, dislike, over/underrated, etc
4
Posted on 12/15/14 at 3:49 pm to CrackingCodes
I've always used USO.
Posted on 12/15/14 at 4:00 pm to CrackingCodes
DBO. Commission free through Ameritrade...tracks crude well. It's *actively managed and usually does a better job than USO or OIL.
Ive been watching this one since $23. It's now around $16.
Ive been watching this one since $23. It's now around $16.
Posted on 12/15/14 at 4:28 pm to bayoubengals88
I've been watching VDE.... I plan to start Dollar cost averaging until oil gets back to "normal" at which point I'll switch back to SCHD or VOO
Posted on 12/15/14 at 4:33 pm to CrackingCodes
DWTI has made me a killin the past month. Will switch to UWTI when oil bottoms.
Posted on 12/15/14 at 4:43 pm to bayoubengals88
Not sure I'd like an etf that doesn't offer any type of reinvested dividend.
This post was edited on 12/15/14 at 4:44 pm
Posted on 12/15/14 at 4:58 pm to TigerTatorTots
Even if they did pay, I would imagine that most wouldn't want to hold a commodity ETF long enough to receive a yearly dividend.
I'm just going to exchange for VGENX in February within my Roth and be done with it. That'll be the extent of my fun with this oil play.
I'm just going to exchange for VGENX in February within my Roth and be done with it. That'll be the extent of my fun with this oil play.
quote:Damn. I bet you have. 3x leveraged...
DWTI has made me a killin the past month. Will switch to UWTI when oil bottoms.
This post was edited on 12/15/14 at 5:00 pm
Posted on 12/15/14 at 5:04 pm to CrackingCodes
These are the ones I'm eyeing for long term
IXC - 3.3% yield with 93 total companies (global picture)
XLE- 2.4% yield with 44 companies (domestic picture)
IYE- 2.15% yield with 94 companies (domestic)
VDE- 2.1% yield with 164 companies (domestic)
If I go the route of an etf, I will likely jump into IXC. A 3.3% yield in an etf is crazy
IXC - 3.3% yield with 93 total companies (global picture)
XLE- 2.4% yield with 44 companies (domestic picture)
IYE- 2.15% yield with 94 companies (domestic)
VDE- 2.1% yield with 164 companies (domestic)
If I go the route of an etf, I will likely jump into IXC. A 3.3% yield in an etf is crazy
This post was edited on 12/15/14 at 5:07 pm
Posted on 12/15/14 at 5:56 pm to TigerTatorTots
It seems that VDE is the better option. I haven't done the math on the dividend yields, expense ratios, and rate of return....but VDE hits $30,000 on the ten year chart IXC peaks at $25k (assuming one starts with 10k).
Posted on 12/15/14 at 6:08 pm to bayoubengals88
I will need to look at that closer. Didn't catch that
Posted on 12/15/14 at 6:16 pm to TigerTatorTots
What do yall think about RYE?
I can get it commission free through Schwab
I can get it commission free through Schwab
Posted on 12/15/14 at 6:44 pm to white perch
RYE just isn't as good as the others I've mentioned. Just look at the holdings...I want XOM, CVX, and RDS in the top five of an energy ETF.
The top five holdings in RYE are
1) Tesoro
2) Kinder Morgan
3) Marathon Petroleum
4) Valero
5) Cabot
Not terrible, but not XOM, CVX, RDS, TOT etc.
Other than that it has a high p/e (16) for an energy ETF, which is a reflection of its poor selection of holdings. It also has a high expense ratio and a very low div yield. I know how appealing commission free is, but I wouldn't touch it.
The top five holdings in RYE are
1) Tesoro
2) Kinder Morgan
3) Marathon Petroleum
4) Valero
5) Cabot
Not terrible, but not XOM, CVX, RDS, TOT etc.
Other than that it has a high p/e (16) for an energy ETF, which is a reflection of its poor selection of holdings. It also has a high expense ratio and a very low div yield. I know how appealing commission free is, but I wouldn't touch it.
Posted on 12/15/14 at 7:01 pm to TigerTatorTots
Ok, IXC vs. VDE.
based on a $10,000 investment, after expense ratios the dividends will net the following:
IXC-- $270
VDE--$190
Not all of the categories below are all that important, but I like high volatility more than low, so I put the higher volatility in bold.
IXC
YTD return: -17.87%
5 yr cumulative return: 19.95%
10 yr cumulative return: 88.4%
200 day volatility: 21.42%
Beta: -2.89
P/E: 12.14
Percent below 52 wk high: 29.5%
VDE
YTD return: -16.52%
5 yr cumulative ret: 47.94%
10 yr cumulative ret: 140.6%
200 day volatility: 23.66%
Beta: -3.10
P/E: 13.01
Percent below 52 wk high: 28.5%
ETA: Holdings (the eye test)
IXC
Exxon- 15%
Chevron- 8%
Total- 5%
Shell- 5%
BP- 4.65%
Schlumberger: 4.26%
RDSB: 3.21%
COP: 3.15%
KMI: 2.73%
Occidental petroleum: 2.38%
VDE
Exxon Mobil Corporation XOM: 20.44%
Chevron Corp CVX: 11.50%
Schlumberger SLB: 6.69%
ConocoPhillips COP: 4.76%
Occidental Petroleum Corp OXY: 3.82%
Halliburton HAL: 2.76%
EOG Resources EOG: 2.74%
Anadarko Petroleum APC: 2.59%
Phillips 66 PSX: 2.33%
Williams Companies WMB: 1.97%
They're definitely comparable. I'll have to double check those cumulative averages. That doesn't seem right.
based on a $10,000 investment, after expense ratios the dividends will net the following:
IXC-- $270
VDE--$190
Not all of the categories below are all that important, but I like high volatility more than low, so I put the higher volatility in bold.
IXC
YTD return: -17.87%
5 yr cumulative return: 19.95%
10 yr cumulative return: 88.4%
200 day volatility: 21.42%
Beta: -2.89
P/E: 12.14
Percent below 52 wk high: 29.5%
VDE
YTD return: -16.52%
5 yr cumulative ret: 47.94%
10 yr cumulative ret: 140.6%
200 day volatility: 23.66%
Beta: -3.10
P/E: 13.01
Percent below 52 wk high: 28.5%
ETA: Holdings (the eye test)
IXC
Exxon- 15%
Chevron- 8%
Total- 5%
Shell- 5%
BP- 4.65%
Schlumberger: 4.26%
RDSB: 3.21%
COP: 3.15%
KMI: 2.73%
Occidental petroleum: 2.38%
VDE
Exxon Mobil Corporation XOM: 20.44%
Chevron Corp CVX: 11.50%
Schlumberger SLB: 6.69%
ConocoPhillips COP: 4.76%
Occidental Petroleum Corp OXY: 3.82%
Halliburton HAL: 2.76%
EOG Resources EOG: 2.74%
Anadarko Petroleum APC: 2.59%
Phillips 66 PSX: 2.33%
Williams Companies WMB: 1.97%
They're definitely comparable. I'll have to double check those cumulative averages. That doesn't seem right.
This post was edited on 12/15/14 at 7:09 pm
Posted on 12/15/14 at 7:11 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
$10,000 investment
I'm not looking at a long term play here, just buy the dip and then sell once it gets back to baseline
Posted on 12/15/14 at 7:18 pm to white perch
Here's the list of what I can get commission free:
RYE
ENFR
ZMLP
MLPA
Some of these are pretty high dividend
RYE
ENFR
ZMLP
MLPA
Some of these are pretty high dividend
Posted on 12/15/14 at 7:24 pm to white perch
quote:
I'm not looking at a long term play here, just buy the dip and then sell once it gets back to baseline
Well look at DBO then. It should go up as crude goes up. Maybe not the same percentage, but it should track pretty closely.
Buy it when crude gets into the 40s.
Posted on 12/15/14 at 7:30 pm to white perch
quote:
ENFR
ZMLP
MLPA
ENR- brand new ETF. Extremely low volume. Stay away.
ZMLP- not good.
MLPA- new ETF, low volume, little known holdings. Stay away.
Schwab doesn't have any good commission free ETF's?
This post was edited on 12/15/14 at 7:31 pm
Posted on 12/15/14 at 7:37 pm to bayoubengals88
Schwab has some that are very good but they lack in commission free specialty ETFs.
SCHG
SCHD
SCHX
LGILX ( a mutual fund)
SCHG
SCHD
SCHX
LGILX ( a mutual fund)
Posted on 12/15/14 at 7:42 pm to white perch
What about USL
Posted on 12/15/14 at 7:44 pm to white perch
Also, USO has lost about 50% since its 52 week high
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