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Will jealously and sports in private schools kill Louisiana school vouchers?
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:07 pm
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:07 pm
There is a perception in some private schools that vouchers are being used to recruit athletes from public schools. I don't doubt some of that is going on.
Unfortunately in some of the private schools every black child is thought to be receiving a voucher. I don't think it is racism so much as just the fact that very few black kids could afford tuition until vouchers came along and it is obvious. Most people do not necessarily mind that black kids are in the school but many people resent welfare vouchers for people when they are working hard to pay tuition.
As a very strong proponent of school vouchers I wish Jindal would stay home and champion more vouchers. I am afraid if vouchers are not made available to everybody the welfare they represent will simply rally more people to oppose vouchers.
We should divide the MFP funds by the number of school aged children in the state and disperse them to the families. The families would have the choice of where to use them and there finally be real competition among schools to provide education services.
We should give government schools systems the opportunities to go private. They could eliminate millions of overhead and operate the way the should with the freedom to run their schools as they see fit.
Nothing could do more for Jindal's presidential bid than to move Louisiana to a total choice school system.
No question in my mind five years into such a system and no one would want to go back to our arcane government operated school system.
Unfortunately in some of the private schools every black child is thought to be receiving a voucher. I don't think it is racism so much as just the fact that very few black kids could afford tuition until vouchers came along and it is obvious. Most people do not necessarily mind that black kids are in the school but many people resent welfare vouchers for people when they are working hard to pay tuition.
As a very strong proponent of school vouchers I wish Jindal would stay home and champion more vouchers. I am afraid if vouchers are not made available to everybody the welfare they represent will simply rally more people to oppose vouchers.
We should divide the MFP funds by the number of school aged children in the state and disperse them to the families. The families would have the choice of where to use them and there finally be real competition among schools to provide education services.
We should give government schools systems the opportunities to go private. They could eliminate millions of overhead and operate the way the should with the freedom to run their schools as they see fit.
Nothing could do more for Jindal's presidential bid than to move Louisiana to a total choice school system.
No question in my mind five years into such a system and no one would want to go back to our arcane government operated school system.
6
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:17 pm to I B Freeman
You have a few problems here. First, blacks have less to do with the issue than the lower class, and please don't create an issue by turning it into a race play. Second, I think you unaware that a lot of private schools don't want voucher users. Look at the schools that have accepted them. Not many. If you have an influx of lower class students, it will drive the actual paying families out to other schools that won't accept vouchers.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:27 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
There is a perception in some private schools that vouchers are being used to recruit athletes from public schools.
Where are you getting this from?
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:35 pm to GhostofJackson
quote:
First, blacks have less to do with the issue than the lower class, and please don't create an issue by turning it into a race play.
That is true but there is no denying when parents look at their school that had one or two black students pre voucher and now have 20 they know how they got there.
quote:
Second, I think you unaware that a lot of private schools don't want voucher users.
I am very aware of it. Nevertheless there are many that do. Surely you are aware of that. There are more than a few that charge less tuition than the voucher is worth.
quote:
If you have an influx of lower class students, it will drive the actual paying families out to other schools that won't accept vouchers.
That may be true to some extent and speaks to my exact point. Everybody should get vouchers--EVERYBODY. You can pick your own school. Contrary to what you believe, it seems, I don't not think many people select schools based on the economic backgrounds of the students. I do believe people select schools based on their performance, their ability to provide a disciplined, safe school, and the academic and extracurricular activities offered by the school.
Would you move your children from a school because a poor kid enrolled?? Of course not as long as the things that school offers your children does not change.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:37 pm to Antonio Moss
quote:
quote:
There is a perception in some private schools that vouchers are being used to recruit athletes from public schools.
Where are you getting this from?
Personal observation. I would rather not give you the exact example but I know two absolutely outstanding athletes that attend a private school after the coach encouraged the parents to seek vouchers to attend his school. It is well known in the community BTW.
This post was edited on 8/10/14 at 8:39 pm
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:45 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
Would you move your children from a school because a poor kid enrolled?? Of course not as long as the things that school offers your children does not change.
You missed the point. I'm not talking one kid. If a school of 500 middle class kids suddenly had 100 new students from lower income families coming in, gradually the middle class families would move on to schools that don't. Teachers may also choose to leave as well.
I use the mall analogy. There have been several decent malls around the city of NOLA in the past few decades, but several eventually shut down or became geared solely towards low income customers. The fact is middle class and especially upper class families don't mind a little group of hardworking lower class kids around their kids, but when that group of lower class kids becomes too big the fact is the middle and upper class families move on to something else. It always happens, and will continue to happen.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:51 pm to GhostofJackson
quote:
You missed the point. I'm not talking one kid. If a school of 500 middle class kids suddenly had 100 new students from lower income families coming in, gradually the middle class families would move on to schools that don't. Teachers may also choose to leave as well.
I use the mall analogy. There have been several decent malls around the city of NOLA in the past few decades, but several eventually shut down or became geared solely towards low income customers. The fact is middle class and especially upper class families don't mind a little group of hardworking lower class kids around their kids, but when that group of lower class kids becomes too big the fact is the middle and upper class families move on to something else. It always happens, and will continue to happen
Nobody is leaving schools because of the economic levels of students.
They are leaving schools because of discipline and academics AND more often than not in government schools consisting mostly of poor children discipline and academics are lacking.
All you have to do to see the error of your thesis to look at charter schools in New Orleans. People are not leaving charter schools in New Orleans where discipline exists and academics are better.
Ending government operation of schools will give schools administrators the freedom private schools have to kick kids out and discipline kids. It will also create incentives to create schools to cater to kids that need vocational training and have discipline problems ect.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 8:55 pm to I B Freeman
Charters are horrible examples of your thesis. Charters don't have to accept anyone. They are basically private schools with public checks. They hawk the best public kids in the city (and even some private ones) but can turn anyone away they want. You think they are letting in kids with bad grades, discipline issues, etc.? Some of these schools are more elitist than the private schools.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:00 pm to GhostofJackson
quote:
Charters don't have to accept anyone
Exactly and if everyone had vouchers and everyone had incentives to start schools NO school would have to accept anyone.
Do you think a kid with $16000 attached to him is going to go unschooled???
quote:
They are basically private schools with public checks
All schools should have the same opportunity. There should be no government operated schools.
quote:
You think they are letting in kids with bad grades, discipline issues, etc.
Yes and they are in many instances so long as the families agree to the rules of the school.
But I will put you down as thinking the s*** that existed pre Katrina was better.
This post was edited on 8/10/14 at 9:01 pm
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:08 pm to I B Freeman
Ok tough guy.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:08 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
Personal observation. I would rather not give you the exact example but I know two absolutely outstanding athletes that attend a private school after the coach encouraged the parents to seek vouchers to attend his school. It is well known in the community BTW.
Do you understand how vouchers work in this state? The school is very limited on the selection of students. You are basically a slave to the lottery.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:11 pm to I B Freeman
Good to see you're back to your Jindal hating ways. I was starting to worry
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:12 pm to Antonio Moss
quote:
Do you understand how vouchers work in this state? The school is very limited on the selection of students. You are basically a slave to the lottery.
Yes I understand completely. If there is only one private school in a community their chances of getting the athlete is pretty good if he wins the lottery. Also in this particular area there are probably very few voucher applicants because the public school is pretty popular.
Look Antonio I want every family to get the vouchers and to have choice. I am telling you vouchers are being used to get athletes in some areas and it is just a fact.
This post was edited on 8/10/14 at 9:13 pm
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:15 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
Look Antonio I want every family to get the vouchers and have choice. I am telling you vouchers are being used to get athletes in some areas and it is just a fact.
I'm sure there are some cases just like there are a plethora of public schools that violate LHSAA recruiting rules. This just seems a foolish way because once more than the allotted space apply, everyone goes into the lottery.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:18 pm to Antonio Moss
quote:
I'm sure there are some cases just like there are a plethora of public schools that violate LHSAA recruiting rules.
It's almost always the public schools. And I would love to know these voucher athletes private schools are getting, especially considering most private LHSAA schools aren't accepting vouchers.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:21 pm to GhostofJackson
quote:
It's almost always the public schools. And I would love to know these voucher athletes private schools are getting, especially considering most private LHSAA schools aren't accepting vouchers.
Is there a Catholic school within the archdiocese of Baton Rouge that does not take vouchers??
I doubt it very seriously.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:25 pm to Antonio Moss
quote:
You are basically a slave to the lottery.
There's a joke here somewhere
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:26 pm to Antonio Moss
quote:
This just seems a foolish way because once more than the allotted space apply, everyone goes into the lottery
There is a pretty good bit of money in high school football. Good football programs attract students, donations and ticket sales. This particular school charges $10 admission and sometimes has 1500 fans at games.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:26 pm to Antonio Moss
1. Do ALL kids who attend public schools have close access to alternative schools like private schools? The answer is NO in many places in this state.
2. Do MOST high schieving private schools actually want poor, underachieving kids who are very hard to discipline? And I mean those kinds of kids in large numbers and not in 5-10-15 numbers. I do not think so, in most cases in this state.
2. Do MOST high schieving private schools actually want poor, underachieving kids who are very hard to discipline? And I mean those kinds of kids in large numbers and not in 5-10-15 numbers. I do not think so, in most cases in this state.
Posted on 8/10/14 at 9:27 pm to I B Freeman
quote:This sounds like a very specific example, so I won't as you about it... but...
If there is only one private school in a community their chances of getting the athlete is pretty good if he wins the lottery. Also in this particular area there are probably very few voucher applicants because the public school is pretty popular.
quote:What are the rules for a family to get a voucher in La?
I want every family to get the vouchers and to have choice
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