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Crumbling Empires
Posted on 2/18/14 at 3:59 pm
Posted on 2/18/14 at 3:59 pm
5
Posted on 2/18/14 at 4:21 pm to JawjaTigah
The downfall of the Soviet Union was not an instantaneous thing. I told friends for a period of four years that the walls ere going to crumble. I didn't know the day but it was inevitable so I was only mildly shocked when the reports started flowing out of Russia(Moscow) on the day that Gorbachev was being held hostage in Odessa and that tanks were in the streets of Moscow. It was at least to me a fun thing to watch as it was what should have happened in Tienamen Square just a year or so earlier with a hell of a lot of blood being shed by those that revolted. The games playing out in Venezuela now will definitely become a severe game changer in Latin America.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 4:31 pm to CITWTT
The Soviet Union was a totalitarian state, so it fell with a crash. The United States, if it falls, will die a slower death unless it tries to take complete control. It is a different system. It will be more like Ancient Rome with a series of falls/failures over a period of time. 9/11 was the first blow. The Iraq War/Afghanistan was the second. The deterioration of Constitutional protections during this time was the third. The housing/financial crisis of 2007-08 was the fourth. Obama's presidency and all that has gone along with it has been one long weakening with too many events to name.
We will have a lot more. We have not had a single strengthening of our position since 9/11 that I can think of. It has been a bad 12-13 years for America.
We will have a lot more. We have not had a single strengthening of our position since 9/11 that I can think of. It has been a bad 12-13 years for America.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 4:56 pm to JawjaTigah
America's done. It's over.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 4:56 pm to AlaTiger
I believe a gigantic part of the decline is the crushing of the economic engine that was once the middle class.
My wife and I make substantially more than my parents made, even accounting for inflation and we do not have the financial agility that they had when I was growing up.
The middle class has shrunk due to the collapse of manufacturing and what is left is getting bloodletted.
Makes me even more bitter because all of the money we work for that gets withheld will not be there for us on the backside. Couple of thousand at least a month that is withheld that we could do so much with and when we are 65, none of it is gonna be there.
Thievery.
My wife and I make substantially more than my parents made, even accounting for inflation and we do not have the financial agility that they had when I was growing up.
The middle class has shrunk due to the collapse of manufacturing and what is left is getting bloodletted.
Makes me even more bitter because all of the money we work for that gets withheld will not be there for us on the backside. Couple of thousand at least a month that is withheld that we could do so much with and when we are 65, none of it is gonna be there.
Thievery.
This post was edited on 2/18/14 at 4:58 pm
Posted on 2/18/14 at 5:14 pm to Scoop
quote:Ultimately it was the Soviet economy that collapsed, trying to keep up with the US weapons program. Reagan was hailed as brilliant, and rightly so. Unfortunately, for somewhat different (yet similar) reasons, the US economy is staggering against the ropes right now. The middle class is really under siege and there is no leadership in the White House or Congress that could give a single flip about it.
a gigantic part of the decline is the crushing of the economic engine
Posted on 2/18/14 at 5:15 pm to Scoop
quote:
I believe a gigantic part of the decline is the crushing of the economic engine that was once the middle class.
My wife and I make substantially more than my parents made, even accounting for inflation and we do not have the financial agility that they had when I was growing up.
The middle class has shrunk due to the collapse of manufacturing and what is left is getting bloodletted.
Makes me even more bitter because all of the money we work for that gets withheld will not be there for us on the backside. Couple of thousand at least a month that is withheld that we could do so much with and when we are 65, none of it is gonna be there.
Thievery.
Well stated Sir !
Posted on 2/18/14 at 5:32 pm to AlaTiger
quote:
9/11 was the first blow. The Iraq War/Afghanistan was the second. The deterioration of Constitutional protections during this time was the third. The housing/financial crisis of 2007-08 was the fourth. Obama's presidency and all that has gone along with it has been one long weakening with too many events to name.
This shite started long before 9/11
Posted on 2/18/14 at 5:41 pm to 91TIGER
Just watch what Obamacare does to medical professionals, which represent a gigantic portion of middle class incomes.
Drying up.
In the last 18 months or so I've seen things I could not previously have imagined.
I've seen my company lay off physical therapists and my company is stable and well established. Never in my life did I ever think I'd see a physical therapist laid off. Even 2 or 3 years ago a PT could name their price. Getting into physical therapy school just a couple of years ago was impossible because so many people were applying and the money was unreal.
Once Obamacare takes out the middle class funded by medical jobs, it's gonna be much worse than when the unions took down manufacturing.
Drying up.
In the last 18 months or so I've seen things I could not previously have imagined.
I've seen my company lay off physical therapists and my company is stable and well established. Never in my life did I ever think I'd see a physical therapist laid off. Even 2 or 3 years ago a PT could name their price. Getting into physical therapy school just a couple of years ago was impossible because so many people were applying and the money was unreal.
Once Obamacare takes out the middle class funded by medical jobs, it's gonna be much worse than when the unions took down manufacturing.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 5:50 pm to JawjaTigah
This presupposes that empires are good things.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 9:19 pm to Scoop
quote:
My wife and I make substantially more than my parents made, even accounting for inflation and we do not have the financial agility that they had when I was growing up.
You really don't make more than your parents did though. Real wages have gone slightly down since 1975. The inflation number our government gives out is a complete farce. Look into the "basket of goods" it's based on. You'll be astonished to find that it doesn't include the bulk of what you spend money on. What it does include is a lot of consumer goods that are made in China, which deflates the price. So not only is the inflation number not based on stuff you do spend money on, the stuff it is based on are things that have artificially depressed prices. It's a sham. Even "good" jobs these days aren't really paying shite. That's why we all work now and back in the day a factory man could support his whole family with a high standard of living - highest in the world at the time, actually.
This post was edited on 2/18/14 at 9:21 pm
Posted on 2/18/14 at 9:22 pm to JawjaTigah
It's already happening here, has been for years.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 9:25 pm to Scoop
quote:
I believe a gigantic part of the decline is the crushing of the economic engine that was once the middle class.
My wife and I make substantially more than my parents made, even accounting for inflation and we do not have the financial agility that they had when I was growing up.
The middle class has shrunk due to the collapse of manufacturing and what is left is getting bloodletted.
Makes me even more bitter because all of the money we work for that gets withheld will not be there for us on the backside. Couple of thousand at least a month that is withheld that we could do so much with and when we are 65, none of it is gonna be there.
Thievery.
So true. And you can blame both parties. The dems for having no conscience with regards to budgets/spending/corruption, and the republicans for letting them do what they wanted with no check.
Posted on 2/19/14 at 12:22 am to Scoop
quote:You would if you lived like they did.
and we do not have the financial agility that they had when I was growing up.
Posted on 2/19/14 at 12:31 am to Tigah in the ATL
quote:
You would if you lived like they did.
bullshite.
The majority of households in the 50's and 60's were single income.
Now, we're working more than ever to keep onto that vanishing American Dream.
Posted on 2/19/14 at 4:29 am to JawjaTigah
quote:
The middle class is really under siege and there is no leadership in the White House or Congress that could give a single flip about it.
What is truly sad about the decline of the middle class is that the middle class does not seem to care either...until it is them and then they suddenly become aware. This is completely inexplicable to me....but there is a large number of people in the middle class who are completely obsessed with helping the poor and another huge group in the middle class who is obsessed with making certain that the top 1% are treated fairly. At the end of the day the number of people who are concerned about the middle class...the economic engine of the economy...is miniscule.
Part of the reason is that middle class issues aren't sexy. It is easy to pander to emotions and claim that poor kids won't eat if they don't get free lunches and it is easy to pander to emotions by suggesting that a rising tide will lift all ships. What isn't sexy is promoting the idea that investment in education pays a huge ROI and everyone benefits from a sound middle class.
Posted on 2/19/14 at 4:32 am to CherryGarciaMan
quote:
Bull shite.
The majority of households in the 50's and 60's were single income.
Now, we're working more than ever to keep onto that vanishing American Dream.
And up until recently borrowing to keep up the pace.....that has slowed somewhat probably due more in part to scarcity of credit for borrowers on the margin than any knew found fiscal responsibility on the part of borrowers.....
Posted on 2/19/14 at 5:20 am to CherryGarciaMan
quote:The majority of middle-class households in the 50's and 60's were single income. They were also single car and single TV (60's) households. They lived in 983 sqft homes in the 1950s vs 2300 square feet in the 2000s. Those homes had linoleum floors, formica counters, thin walls, carports or single car garages, cheap fixtures, single ovens, small refrigerators, etc.
The majority of households in the 50's and 60's were single income.
As for "single income", the percentage of children living in single-parent households has doubled over the past 50 yrs. Yet the market is much more female friendly, thus the following observation:
So where median inflation adjusted income is flat over the last 50 yrs, dual income homes are doing proportionately better.
Posted on 2/19/14 at 6:13 am to germandawg
quote:
What is truly sad about the decline of the middle class is that the middle class does not seem to care either..
Apathy at all levels is why this country is in steep decline. I'm so saddened by this. Would have never dreamed we would be in this shape when I was a kid.
Posted on 2/19/14 at 7:00 am to kywildcatfanone
quote:Seems as much a problem with social antipathy as apathy.
Apathy at all levels is why this country is in steep decline
A societal perception that the other guy's "grass is greener" serves as kindling.
Duplicitous political rhetoric claiming our citizenry to be far worse off, is the flame.
Listening to leftists, one would never in a million years dream US poverty rates have been cut in half since 1960 as welfare benefits are factored in. One would never assume that while inflation adjusted median single income household is very stable, dual earner households have nearly tripled their inflation adjusted income since 1960.
Why would ANYone assume those things when we know Mitt has a car elevator, and Ann has a horse?
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