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NFA Trust and moving

Posted on 3/2/17 at 11:56 am
Posted by Orphan
south of nowhere
Member since Aug 2008
952 posts
Posted on 3/2/17 at 11:56 am
I am moving within the state(Louisiana). What do I need to stay legal with my trust.

It holds my suppressors.

I also have another trustee listed.

TIA
Posted by 4WHLN
Drinking at the Cottage Inn
Member since Mar 2013
7581 posts
Posted on 3/2/17 at 2:38 pm to
I would contact whoever drew up the trust for you and have them change it for you. The guy I used will update mine for free for the lifetime of the trust.
Posted by atom1505
Member since Aug 2016
284 posts
Posted on 3/2/17 at 3:49 pm to
Are you moving in Louisiana from somewhere else?

edit: can someone tell me what to do if I'm moving to another state? Thanks!
This post was edited on 3/2/17 at 3:56 pm
Posted by bluemoons
the marsh
Member since Oct 2012
5513 posts
Posted on 3/2/17 at 3:54 pm to
quote:

I am moving within the state(Louisiana)


Call your (Louisiana) lawyer. I am an attorney that does gun trusts. I am not your attorney and I did not do your gun trust. This is not legal advice.

That said, if this were legal advice, I would tell you that if you currently live in Louisiana, and you are moving somewhere else in Louisiana, all you are "required" to do is notify the ATF via 5320.20.
Posted by jbgleason
Bailed out of BTR to God's Country
Member since Mar 2012
18905 posts
Posted on 3/2/17 at 5:16 pm to
quote:

That said, if this were legal advice, I would tell you that if you currently live in Louisiana, and you are moving somewhere else in Louisiana, all you are "required" to do is notify the ATF via 5320.20.


5320.20 is for INTERstate transport. This is INTRAstate if you are moving from address to address within Louisiana. As far as NFA goes, no notification is required. THAT BEING SAID, I have zero clue how moving addresses applies to the validity of the trust. That is a question for an attorney. If the trust becomes invalid, then you have an NFA issue.*

*I am a NFA guy and not a trust guy so take that FWIW. As far as the intrastate move portion of the question, I am sure of that. But the Trust thing throws it off for me. Back in the day, you still had to notify LSP but thankfully they did away with that mess. NFA will gladly file a notice of change of address in the form of a letter if you really want to send them one. They will accept it but it isn't required.
Posted by bluemoons
the marsh
Member since Oct 2012
5513 posts
Posted on 3/2/17 at 5:53 pm to
Incorrect. I put "required" in quotations, because you're required to notify the ATF, and the notification they want is 5320.20. The ATF wants written notification of any permanent change in address, whether in state or out of state. I have personally seen a submitted written notification of a permanent change of address be returned, stating that the only proper form for changing an address (even intra-state) is via 5320.20.

That's about as far as I'm going to get into legal issues on the interwebs, but my best advice to you (or any of you) is to contact your attorney.
Posted by Orphan
south of nowhere
Member since Aug 2008
952 posts
Posted on 3/3/17 at 6:27 am to
Thanks guys.

I am going to speak with the one who did my trust.
Posted by jbgleason
Bailed out of BTR to God's Country
Member since Mar 2012
18905 posts
Posted on 3/3/17 at 7:56 am to
quote:

The ATF wants written notification of any permanent change in address, whether in state or out of state.


We are mincing words here. What ATF "wants" and what is legally required are two different things. Crazy as that may be. Unless someone can find it, I am not aware of a statutory or regulatory requirement for notice of an intrastate address change. I specifically contacted the Chief of NFA on this issue, i knew him, and that was his guidance. Seems he would know but, given that it is ATF, maybe not. LoL. He was also the one who said they would accept a letter providing notice. If you know NFA Branch then you know that a single instance of a rejection and request for a 5320 means nothing. The Examiners up there literally make up the rules as they go from day to day. Just to prove the point, I once called up there and requested guidance on an issue and then called back to a different Examiner and asked the same question just to receive a different answer.

EDIT: Contacted my guy and confirmed the intrastate notice is desired but not required. However, as of two years ago (since we last spoke on the issue) they have decided that they will no longer take letters and are now taking the 5320.20 for this notification. No word on if they will update the title of the form.
This post was edited on 3/3/17 at 8:04 am
Posted by BFIV
Virginia
Member since Apr 2012
7721 posts
Posted on 3/3/17 at 8:06 am to
quote:

I once called up there and requested guidance on an issue and then called back to a different Examiner and asked the same question just to receive a different answer.


Sounds just like the IRS.
Posted by Orphan
south of nowhere
Member since Aug 2008
952 posts
Posted on 3/3/17 at 4:25 pm to
I talked to several people and got different answers.

My stamp paperwork has my trust with current address.
Does changing trust's address to a new address render that stamp's paperwork (with old address) void. If if voids it, does that mean I have to resubmit everything and wait again?

This is getting to be real headache........Thanks guys......
This post was edited on 3/3/17 at 4:29 pm
Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
20448 posts
Posted on 3/3/17 at 5:22 pm to
quote:

jbgleason


How are you arguing with a guy that says he is an attorney and does this type of law?

To the op, why do so many people freak out about this gun law stuff? The ATF is no different than the IRS, do your due diligence with good intentions in mind and legally you will be fine. As said, half the time they don't even know what's right.
Posted by Orphan
south of nowhere
Member since Aug 2008
952 posts
Posted on 3/3/17 at 5:32 pm to
I really not freaking out.

I just want to get this right the first time around.
Posted by jbgleason
Bailed out of BTR to God's Country
Member since Mar 2012
18905 posts
Posted on 3/4/17 at 6:08 am to
quote:



How are you arguing with a guy that says he is an attorney and does this type of law?


Ummm. Because he was incorrect? He said "required" in the post which isn't true. Later explaining that "required" doesn't actually mean "required" because of the quotes. I was just explaining that ATF "wants" but doesn't "require" notification for intrastate moves. I checked my Blacks Legal dictionary and couldn't find his definition of "required". Not arguing, clarifying.
This post was edited on 3/4/17 at 6:13 am
Posted by bluemoons
the marsh
Member since Oct 2012
5513 posts
Posted on 3/4/17 at 9:13 am to
The Form 4 (that you sign under penalty of perjury) specifically requires that an applicant notify the ATF of any change in address...not just an interstate change of address. Do not confuse an interstate transfer of a Class III item with a change in address. This is not provided by the NFA via statute, but is covered by the federal criminal code statute providing that it is a felony to provide false information required to be kept with the federal government relative to firearms. You can look up the cite. This means that the federal government could pursue legal action against you for not notifying them of a change of address. So, if you want to be legal, you need to notify the ATF of an address change, whether interstate or intrastate, and you need to do so via 5320.20.

You seem like one of those guys that enjoys arguing with people on the internet, and I am not, so I'll leave it at that. Maybe you misunderstood my earlier post, but I thought it was pretty clear. I will say that this is particularly frustrating, because misinformation spread over internet message boards is a major reason people remain so confused about firearms law. I'm certainly not going to fight you over your choices though. I'm sure you could take whether or not notification an actual (NFA) statutory requirement up with the government in court. I typically try to keep my clients out of court.



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