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Message
Freshwater and Sediment Diversions - Do you agree with these guys?
Posted on 3/20/13 at 3:50 pm
Posted on 3/20/13 at 3:50 pm
quote:
TODAY'S FISHING REPORT!!
It was another tough day! Tried Four Horse Lake, Lake Robin, Round Lake, Bay Lafourche, Oak River Bay, caught no trout. Tried for Reds and caught 2, but the big blue freshwater Catfish were cooperating, caught 6 in the 10 to 20 pound range.
This is not a real report, but may be the kind of fishing reports you read here in the not so distant future if something is not done about the Caernarvon Diversion!
This morning, Mike Lane, Myself, and Capt. Jody Donewar had a great meeting with Plaquemines Parish President Billy Nungesser. It was great to find out that Mr. Nungesser is on the same page when it comes to the detrimental effects of the freshwater diversions at Caernarvon and Bayou Lamuque. I had Google Earth photos of Caernarvon and the Delacroix area that shows the devisatation the diversion has caused over the years, along with scientific studies done on the effects the freshwater has on our saltwater species. But, It was not needed. He is a great guy and came out to say he was totally against the diversion, and would help to get it shut down.
At noon, we also had a meeting with David Cressone, President of the CCA. It was the first time I had met David, and he was a very nice guy, but unfortunately, would not take a stand either way, for or against the diversions. I was frustrated, because I got the opinion that he thought we couldn't win the fight, so there was no point in throwing a punch! We did come out of the meeting with him promising to look into the evidence a little more, and maybe coming out with an opinion. Quote from their website: "CCA Louisiana is a non-profit oraganization dedicated to the conservation of Louisiana's marine resources." The diversion at Caernarvon is hurting our saltwater marine resource.
It's like this guys, I make my living catching saltwater fish, yes, and I care about us losing our coastline. But, Caernarvon is a disaster. To me, it's causing more harm to the oysters, brown shrimp, speckled trout, and blue crabs than the oil spill. What it is doing is pumping mass volumes of fresh water into the estuary at the peak times the brown shrimp are coming in. Something has to be done, and now. Time is running out.
If you want to see for yourself, go to Google Earth and get the satellite photos of the area from the Caernarvon diversion to Delacroix. Look on the Google toolbar top left and click on the clock. You can go back as far as 1998, year by year and see the changes. It's mind boggling how anyone can say that Caernarvon has produced any land. There is one spot right at the Big Mar where it put a couple of acres of silt, but that's it. What's amazing is, the closer you get to the diversion, the worse the land loss.
I know some naysayers are gonna start bombarding the site, but guess what? The old saying about a picture is worth a thousand words, check for yourself.
If you want your children and grandchildren to enjoy the type of fishing we've had in Delacroix over the years, join us in this fight to get Caernarvon shut down. We have the Oyster fishermen, commercial fishermen, and charter boat captains preparing to get up in arms to fight this thing, and we need you recreational fishermen to express your feelings to the powers at be in St. Bernard and Plaquemines.
If any of you want to ask questions, or think I don't know what I'm talking about, I'll show you the facts. Feel free to get in touch with me. (985)630-2923
GET-AWAY CHARTERS, WHERE NOTHING GETS AWAY!!!
quote:
Mike Lane New Orleans, LA USA Great factual report Captain George Ricks!!!! We have been interviewing lots of people that are "in the know"' about diversions vs dredging. Louisiana is in big trouble! As a saltwater fisherman you are going to have to find a new sport. There are three of us now, myself, Jody Donewar and George Ricks starting to fight to save our fishing, oysters, crabs and shrimp. 3 weeks ago I didn't have an opinion about the existing and worse yet the additional diversions already planned. - We will attempt to share what we are learning with everyone. I absolutely believe that left to their plans these politicians and scientists will knowingly destroy all our salt water activities. We are dedicated to saving the Louisiana marsh. We need thousands of concerned fisherman to help us with our fight. I have been told that we can't win. Well, that's what they told me about LNG. With thousands of rodnreeler's we did win and we can do it again. Please let us share what we have learned and then make an informed decision, then fight against the side you disagree with. I invite anyone to call me at (504) 858-0484. With your opinions and ask any questions. Call me and Captain George Ricks at 985-630-2923, we are dying to talk to you. Mike Lane
To me it sounds like these guys are mad that they have to run their boats an extra 30 minutes to catch fish/oysters/shrimp. If they get their wish, eventually they'll be able to catch these off their front porch, if they still have a front porch.
This post was edited on 3/20/13 at 4:04 pm
11
Posted on 3/20/13 at 3:57 pm to lsufishnhunt
If you want ANY of SE louisiana to be left in the next 50 years freshwater diversion needs to happen. Hell, or better yet, open Bayou Lafourche, open Bayou Terrebonne. We need to keep the arteries that created Louisiana alive.
Because of our own selfishness, we have the coastal erosion problems.
We shouldn't be catching Redfish up in Houma and Larose....
Because of our own selfishness, we have the coastal erosion problems.
We shouldn't be catching Redfish up in Houma and Larose....
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:06 pm to mylsuhat
I agree and disagree. We need the diversions, but the diversions are causing issues more than they're helping. The diversions do not pump sediment...they pump fresh water. Sediment is needed. The "land" created since diversions have been in play is flotant...not marsh.
But there's SO MANY FACTORS!
While in Reggio Sunday, I came around a turn in my canoe and saw something moving to my left. It was a nutria. In about one minute, there were ELEVEN nutria swimming around, and I could literally see where they'd eaten their little marsh islands down. Because I was in my canoe, I had left my pistol in my truck, or a couple would've been crab food.
Pipeline canals. They aren't even used for their intended purpose anymore. They're just paths for recs and commercials to traverse. They, like the MRGO, changed current flow, caused erosion, and are being silted in with every hurricane.
Speaking of hurricanes...ouch. They haven't been helping the last decade either.
People have mentioned blowing the levees below NOLA, and I've even heard below BR. Got news for ya...even that wouldn't be enough. The river is leveed up north, too. Why does that matter? Changed the flow. The river is too fast and deep now. Sediment is in it, but it's sparsely broadcast due to deep, fast moving water.
I only know this. Something DRASTIC needs to be done, and it needs to involve sediment...not just fresh water. But I fully agree that trout and redfish shouldn't be the targets in Houma, or even upper Lafitte. Bass and catfish should.
But there's SO MANY FACTORS!
While in Reggio Sunday, I came around a turn in my canoe and saw something moving to my left. It was a nutria. In about one minute, there were ELEVEN nutria swimming around, and I could literally see where they'd eaten their little marsh islands down. Because I was in my canoe, I had left my pistol in my truck, or a couple would've been crab food.
Pipeline canals. They aren't even used for their intended purpose anymore. They're just paths for recs and commercials to traverse. They, like the MRGO, changed current flow, caused erosion, and are being silted in with every hurricane.
Speaking of hurricanes...ouch. They haven't been helping the last decade either.
People have mentioned blowing the levees below NOLA, and I've even heard below BR. Got news for ya...even that wouldn't be enough. The river is leveed up north, too. Why does that matter? Changed the flow. The river is too fast and deep now. Sediment is in it, but it's sparsely broadcast due to deep, fast moving water.
I only know this. Something DRASTIC needs to be done, and it needs to involve sediment...not just fresh water. But I fully agree that trout and redfish shouldn't be the targets in Houma, or even upper Lafitte. Bass and catfish should.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:08 pm to lsufishnhunt
THIS IS WHY WE CANT HAVE NICE THINGS!
Seriously, they need to get their heads out of their asses and wake up and realize that freshwater SEDIMENT diversions are the only way to have a coast in 50-100 years. I know I'm preaching to the choir, and I'm so far north it doesn't directly affect me anymore, but it still pisses me off.
Seriously, they need to get their heads out of their asses and wake up and realize that freshwater SEDIMENT diversions are the only way to have a coast in 50-100 years. I know I'm preaching to the choir, and I'm so far north it doesn't directly affect me anymore, but it still pisses me off.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:09 pm to lsufishnhunt
Wah wah wah. Everyone is always gonna be bitching about something. In the end, these guys are wrong no matter who they are.
Just because it is a little more tough for them to fish for a few species, they want to shut down the rest of SELA's diversions.
I find it extremely interesting though, the balance of flow that they use for these diversions. Like goldilocks and the three bears managing this stuff
Just because it is a little more tough for them to fish for a few species, they want to shut down the rest of SELA's diversions.
I find it extremely interesting though, the balance of flow that they use for these diversions. Like goldilocks and the three bears managing this stuff
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:13 pm to Hammertime
quote:
freshwater SEDIMENT diversions are the only way to have a coast in 50-100 years
This is true. They are in the works, but who knows how long till the construction actually begins. The thing is, these guys are wanting to put an end to ALL diversions. Ignorance, and I hope someone puts them in their place before they convince their minions to follow them.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:14 pm to lsufishnhunt
I do have to respect that they just want to present their side. It is a very confusing issue, and most people haven't a clue what they're talking about. I study it, but I am NO scientist. I'm just using what I consider to be common sense. I could be wrong about the whole thing. I just know what I've seen in the last 25+ years in the Delacroix/Reggio area. It's scary. I have seen new marsh develop, especially immediately before Katrina. But it wasn't true solid marsh. It's literally floating, and surge moves it more than it destroys it. Bayou Terre Aux Boeufs, right in front of Reggio Marina and all the way to Serigne's in Delacroix, was filled with chunks of marsh 20' wide after Katrina. It floated there and settled in the bayou when the surge receded. It's ridiculous.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:15 pm to lsufishnhunt
quote:
f you want to see for yourself, go to Google Earth and get the satellite photos of the area from the Caernarvon diversion to Delacroix. Look on the Google toolbar top left and click on the clock. You can go back as far as 1998, year by year and see the changes. It's mind boggling how anyone can say that Caernarvon has produced any land. There is one spot right at the Big Mar where it put a couple of acres of silt, but that's it. What's amazing is, the closer you get to the diversion, the worse the land loss.
How many big m-frickin' hurricanes have hit there in that time period dude?
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:20 pm to lsufishnhunt
Moronic. Louisiana is in its current state because of people like them. Davis Pond and Caernarvon weren't even designed or built for sediment, they just skim freshwater off the top of the river.
2. Most wetland loss in the upper Breton basin is from hurricanes. Look at USGS land loss studies. This isn't scientifically disputed.
3. These morons, especially Nungesser, can never answer the question to the following problem: they talk and talk about only dredging but it costs orders of magnitude more to dredge and pump than it does to build land with a diversion like the Wax Lake outlet. The state and the Feds have very limited money. Land isn't going to stop sinking and sea level isn't going to stop rising. Dreding and pumping is a one time fix that we can't currently afford so how the fuk is it supposed to be a permanent solution? Hope for another oil spill and miraculous fines to pay for it into perpetuity? We need a continuous solution for a continuous problem.
The only answer is to reengineer the lower river as we know it and adapt. We are at a point where the decision is to move the oysters and shrimp or move the people.
2. Most wetland loss in the upper Breton basin is from hurricanes. Look at USGS land loss studies. This isn't scientifically disputed.
3. These morons, especially Nungesser, can never answer the question to the following problem: they talk and talk about only dredging but it costs orders of magnitude more to dredge and pump than it does to build land with a diversion like the Wax Lake outlet. The state and the Feds have very limited money. Land isn't going to stop sinking and sea level isn't going to stop rising. Dreding and pumping is a one time fix that we can't currently afford so how the fuk is it supposed to be a permanent solution? Hope for another oil spill and miraculous fines to pay for it into perpetuity? We need a continuous solution for a continuous problem.
The only answer is to reengineer the lower river as we know it and adapt. We are at a point where the decision is to move the oysters and shrimp or move the people.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:20 pm to tenfoe
quote:Sorry, but they're right about that. Hurricanes didn't just right at Caenarvon. They hit all the way up TO Caenarvon. That's the point I was trying to make. THAT is where all the floating marsh is/was/will be again given a break from 'canes. That isn't what we need. Need REAL marsh.
f you want to see for yourself, go to Google Earth and get the satellite photos of the area from the Caernarvon diversion to Delacroix. Look on the Google toolbar top left and click on the clock. You can go back as far as 1998, year by year and see the changes. It's mind boggling how anyone can say that Caernarvon has produced any land. There is one spot right at the Big Mar where it put a couple of acres of silt, but that's it. What's amazing is, the closer you get to the diversion, the worse the land loss.
How many big m-frickin' hurricanes have hit there in that time period dude?
Go do that same google earth search over the Biloxi Marsh. Almost unscathed following all those hurricanes. But it's a different kind of marsh. It's real solid marsh, and it can take a beating. That crap the diversion helped create cannot.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:21 pm to lsufishnhunt
quote:
lsufishnhunt
Could you direct me to the source of this information? I am working with a group right now that would be VERY interested in this.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:22 pm to Tigerlaff
It was posted on rodnreel.com today or yesterday, reports section.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:26 pm to Fishhead
Surge passes over the Biloxi marsh because there is nothing to stack it up. Surge stacks up in the levees at Caernarvon magnifying the problems.
Secondly, Biloxi marsh has always been salt marsh in our lifetimes. Salt marsh has deeper root structure and is stronger. Comparing it to Fresh and brackish marsh at caernarvon isn't apples to apples geographically or biologically.
Secondly, Biloxi marsh has always been salt marsh in our lifetimes. Salt marsh has deeper root structure and is stronger. Comparing it to Fresh and brackish marsh at caernarvon isn't apples to apples geographically or biologically.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:26 pm to Fishhead
I may be wrong on this, but I think you're comparing apples with oranges. The Biloxi Marsh is a saltwater marsh that is more resilient to the power of a hurricane. The "flotant" marsh is a freshwater marsh that should be protected by a salt marsh. The problem is that you need sediment to build this salt marsh.... where does that sediment come from in the quantities that are needed?
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:33 pm to lsufishnhunt
I don't disagree with either of you. Biloxi Marsh is MOSTLY salt marsh. But the lower sections near Hopedale, say below Stump Lagoon to the MRGO, that's more fresh than the upper part. It just isn't subject to the diversion due to a bit of distance and large separating bodies of water.
Not to argue, because I'd LOVE to see the healthiest marsh possible, and I don't care if I catch bass and catfish in Reggio instead of trout and reds. But I'm 45, and have literally been fishing that area (specifically Reggio) since I was 15 years old by myself. In that timespan, the marsh has literally changed from one type to another, and in that same time frame, has literally been destroyed. NO DOUBT Katrina had a HUGE impact, but the marsh wasn't so 'buoyant' back in the 80s and 90s. I am simply making a slightly educated guess when I say Caenarvon created the floating marsh. But I'd say it's a high likelihood.
Not to argue, because I'd LOVE to see the healthiest marsh possible, and I don't care if I catch bass and catfish in Reggio instead of trout and reds. But I'm 45, and have literally been fishing that area (specifically Reggio) since I was 15 years old by myself. In that timespan, the marsh has literally changed from one type to another, and in that same time frame, has literally been destroyed. NO DOUBT Katrina had a HUGE impact, but the marsh wasn't so 'buoyant' back in the 80s and 90s. I am simply making a slightly educated guess when I say Caenarvon created the floating marsh. But I'd say it's a high likelihood.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:38 pm to Fishhead
quote:
THAT is where all the floating marsh is/was/will be again given a break from 'canes. That isn't what we need. Need REAL marsh.
Agreed, but none of these projects are set up correctly to build marsh. They are freshwater diversions. Build a freshwater diversion and you create floating marsh. There are plenty good plans out there, but anytime you talk about taking water out of the river it's met with resistance. The COE can't dredge the river because they don't have any money, so now I think you are going to see them shooting down even more projects taking water from the river.
To the OP. That sucks for whoever the guide is, but any good plan to rebuild any marsh is going to inconvenience people in the short-term.
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:41 pm to lsufishnhunt
tldr
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:41 pm to lsufishnhunt
If you want your grand kids o fish in SELA we need freshwater diversions. My area of concentration is coastal engineering here at lsu
Barring that is brings in new sediment, which is likely
Barring that is brings in new sediment, which is likely
This post was edited on 3/20/13 at 4:44 pm
Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:44 pm to jimbeam
quote:
My area of concentration is coastal engineering here at lsu
How long till you graduate? Posted on 3/20/13 at 4:45 pm to lsufishnhunt
1 year 
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