re: The best explanation of what’s going on at Boeing

Airbus needs to buy Boeing if they really want things straightened out, but that's obvious antitrust and can't happen.

John Oliver (love or hate him) shows some interesting information about Boeing's stock and how they might have been more concerned about manipulating their stock prices than the safety of their products.

Youtube.com

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There’s no part of me that believes that union workers are more skilled, motivated, or produce a higher quality product.

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Except for the fact that we have 50 plus years of history that says they did just that.

Unions are ruining education and the post office, but unions still do a very good job with skilled labor.

You can trace a big portion of the multi-decade fall of General Motors to the shift in power from their Detroit HQ to their NYC Treasury Department. Like Boeing's move of the HQ to Chicago, this was done for no reason other than powerful non-engineering execs liked being in NYC. That, combined with accountant Roger Smith becoming CEO, was the beginning of a very long end for GM.

Problem with Boeing is that their fall would be a national security issue, rather than just an economic disaster. I wonder if the government will step in, even with no immediate threat of bankruptcy, if Boeing keeps dropping the ball?

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Unions are ruining education and the post office, but unions still do a very good job with skilled labor.

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I have worked in both union and non union jobs. It is nice that the union could prevent me from working unlimited 20 plus hour shifts due to short staffing however it did hurt that I wouldn't make more money than a person who was less productive.

Had unions not become 'political' and also seem to keep bad employees rather than realizing that getting rid of a shite worker helps both the union and the company....more people would probably support a union.

Nonsense. The free market regulates itself perfectly - Boeing's problems are DEI and woke, whatever that means.

This happens in almost every major and minor company that is bought and sold in our country. But some bad decisions are worse than others especially when these bad decisions center around making commercial airplanes. Cutting corners and outsourcing never works long term. It's all cooking the books bullshite and it usually ruins a company to the core.

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I see a lot of Boeing’s problems being blamed on the merger with McDonnell Douglas and the management takeover by MBA’s, but their planes are just as safe today as they have ever been. The 737 rudder design issue in the 90s happened before McDonnell Douglas

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There is so much talk everywhere now about how Boeing was a perfect company that always did right before the merger. These seem to come from documentaries that completely ignore how when it came to accidents Boeing before the merger consistently tried to either blame pilots, generally obfuscate investigations and downplay design flaws.

You mentioned the 737 rudder issues, add to that the 767 thrust reversers deploying in flight, and downplaying the potential for the creation of flammable conditions in the fuel tanks both before and after TWA 800.

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There is so much talk everywhere now about how Boeing was a perfect company that always did right before the merger. These seem to come from documentaries that completely ignore how when it came to accidents Boeing before the merger consistently tried to either blame pilots, generally obfuscate investigations and downplay design flaws. You mentioned the 737 rudder issues, add to that the 767 thrust reversers deploying in flight, and downplaying the potential for the creation of flammable conditions in the fuel tanks both before and after TWA 800.

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Pan Am had 5 fatal 707 accidents in a 9 month period in the early 70’s.

July 22, 1973
Flight 816, operated by Boeing 707-321B Clipper Winged Racer, crashed on takeoff from Faa'a International Airport for reasons unknown, killing 78 of 79 on board. The accidents remains the deadliest in French Polynesia.
November 3, 1973
Flight 160, operated by Boeing 707-321C N458PA Clipper Titian, crashed while attempting to return to Boston due to smoke in the cockpit, killing the three crew.[17]
December 17, 1973
Flight 110, operated by Boeing 707-321B (N407PA) Clipper Celestial was firebombed while parked at Fiumicino Airport by Palestinian terrorists, killing 30 of 177 on board; the terrorists then killed a guard and hijacked Lufthansa Flight 303, a Boeing 737, to Kuwait.
January 30, 1974
Flight 806, operated by Boeing 707-321B Clipper Radiant, crashed on approach to Pago Pago after encountering windshear from a microburst, killing 96 of 101 on board.
April 22, 1974
Flight 812, operated by Boeing 707-321B Clipper Climax struck the side of Mesehe Mountain (42 miles northwest of Denpasar) due to a navigation error caused by instrument failure, killing all 107 on board.

I am all for reducing the power and influence of unions, especially skilled tradesman’s unions - this isn’t 1910 with coal miners being paid in scrip.

However, there is no questioning that Boeing’s Charleston facility has been shitting the bed. From finding wrenches in the the aircraft after delivery to wiring issues and just the inability to complete and deliver aircraft on time, Charleston has been bad. Boeing had to bring workers from Seattle to clean up their mess and retrain them in the late 2010s.

That said, it’s a result of their management being overzealous trying to move quickly on non-union labor. If done methodically it could have been a smashing success, unfortunately they used the 787 program as the excuse to “diversify” their manufacturing base and unfortunately that aircraft was already behind schedule so they had to rush everything.

Let’s not even start on the KC-46 Pegasus shitshow.

Tl;dr - Boeing has been a shite show for years.