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Started By
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re: How jacked up was the Brown v Board decision on desegregation?
Posted on 7/30/17 at 9:57 am to RogerTheShrubber
Posted on 7/30/17 at 9:57 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
For the most part, the black teachers I had were damn good classroom managers
The black teachers at our school were poorly educated and spoke ebonics.
3
Posted on 7/30/17 at 9:59 am to Revelator
quote:
The ironic part is that now, many blacks are seeking to segregate themselves on college campuses and with groups like BLM.
My first thought as well. What a crazy time we live in where black and white separatists are in agreement on a plan of action (even though their reasons are diametrically opposed).
Posted on 7/30/17 at 9:59 am to SuperSaint
I'm pretty sure you're
quote:or at least very obtuse.
psychologically cripple
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:07 am to jeff5891
quote:
Were they harmed for not being around white kids or bc black public schools were overwhelmingly underfunded compared to white public schools.
Use your head next time
But, the OP's (and my) point was that was NOT the fundamental basis of the decision. If it was, the Court would have never gotten into those weeds and merely said that unequal funding was contrary to Plessy and the 14th Amendment and declared any such formula unconstitutional.
That is not what the Court did. In fact, the Court noted that even if everything was truly equal, if there were laws that required segregation, they were "inherently unequal."
The fact that this was NOT the basis for its ruling is reflected in later cases, where the Court ordered forced integration (merely eliminating de jure segregation was not enough).
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:08 am to SuperSaint
Wait, you mean Plessey vs, Furgeson wasn't 'settled law'?
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:11 am to SuperSaint
quote:
I'm no law guru, but am I offbase and reading some of the actual decision wrong?
You don't say?
[/quote]
quote:
The Supreme Court held that “separate but equal” facilities are inherently unequal and violate the protections of the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.
Think of funding, staffing, facilities, materials, teacher qualifications, the longstanding ramifications of not being allowed to attend a public school strictly because of the color of your skin.
This post was edited on 7/30/17 at 10:21 am
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:12 am to GurleyGirl
quote:
The black teachers at our school were poorly educated and spoke ebonics.
Ours weren't well spoken but could paddle an arse when they needed. One would twist the hell out of your ear.
Several ended up as vice principal. Back in the day it was jive, not ebonics.
This post was edited on 7/30/17 at 10:13 am
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:30 am to Grandioso
quote:I understand this..... but what I'm saying is that Mr Brown said that the all black school his child was attending was actually a really good school and he found the education his child got afterward at the all white school was pretty much the same..... but in the decision the court's language was pretty damn racist in stating that the black kids just couldn't possibly be able to get the same education and their education had been 'retarded' due to the fact it was all black school.... I just never realized how racist their opinion was.
Think of funding, staffing, facilities, materials, teacher qualifications, the longstanding ramifications of not being allowed to attend a public school strictly because of the color of your skin.
Sorry for the thread if it's that big of an issue to some of you.... sheesh
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:31 am to SuperSaint
quote:
The Supreme Court held that “separate but equal” facilities are inherently unequal
Never understood their rationale on this.
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:35 am to udtiger
quote:
But, the OP's (and my) point was that was NOT the fundamental basis of the decision. If it was, the Court would have never gotten into those weeds and merely said that unequal funding was contrary to Plessy and the 14th Amendment and declared any such formula unconstitutional.
That is not what the Court did. In fact, the Court noted that even if everything was truly equal, if there were laws that required segregation, they were "inherently unequal."
This.
They just threw out the baby with the bath water.
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:36 am to GurleyGirl
quote:
The black teachers at our school were poorly educated and spoke ebonics.
And?
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:38 am to udtiger
quote:
That is not what the Court did. In fact, the Court noted that even if everything was truly equal, if there were laws that required segregation, they were "inherently unequal."
That's completely true. If you are brought up to think you are better in every way from a kid at the all black school, that is going to have a negative impact on blacks later on. Who do you think got the "good" jobs in the 50s and 60s after high school and college?
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:40 am to 4cubbies
quote:to go even further with the decision, if you read it, it doesn't mention teachers at all, which is fricked up.
4cubbies
You take black kids that been going to a black school with all black teachers and automatically throw them in a school with all white teachers (and vice versa), this could easily handicap the education of the child.. they tried to make it seem all about the kids but seriously went about it the complete wrong way imo
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:42 am to airfernando
quote:
There are many all white schools
not in America
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:42 am to recruitnik
Actually, the decision drew a great deal of heat at the time.
The opinion relied a great deal on sociology instead of actual constitutional law. That tact was very controversial.
The opinion relied a great deal on sociology instead of actual constitutional law. That tact was very controversial.
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:44 am to prplhze2000
quote:
The opinion relied a great deal on sociology instead of actual constitutional law. That tact was very controversial.
Not the first, or last, time for the Warren Court.
This post was edited on 7/30/17 at 10:44 am
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:47 am to SuperSaint
This was a classic case of the government trying to rule against human nature
It's fairly obvious that people naturally segregate into their own groups, feel more comfortable and therefore perform better
It's fairly obvious that people naturally segregate into their own groups, feel more comfortable and therefore perform better
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:48 am to SuperSaint
Please next start a thread on how Jim Crowe laws were not detrimental or racist to blacks.
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:49 am to Collegedropout
quote:
not in America
I went to one for 10 years
Posted on 7/30/17 at 10:53 am to SuperSaint
quote:
I understand this..... but what I'm saying is that Mr Brown said that the all black school his child was attending was actually a really good school and he found the education his child got afterward at the all white school was pretty much the same..... but in the decision the court's language was pretty damn racist in stating that the black kids just couldn't possibly be able to get the same education and their education had been 'retarded' due to the fact it was all black school.... I just never realized how racist their opinion was.
Is Oliver Brown the end all be all in judging the educational standards of schools? Even if the school was perfectly adequate, it is only one fricking school out of thousands that were not likely up to standard! Upon that, think of being told year after year that you cannot attend a certain school strictly due to your skin. Do you really think that'll have a positive, long-standing impact on students?
The court found
quote:
segregation in public education has a detrimental effect upon Negro children, but denied relief on the ground that the Negro and white schools were substantially equal with respect to buildings, transportation, curricula, and educational qualifications of teachers
Look at:Gebhart v. Belton -
quote:
judgment for the plaintiffs and ordered their immediate admission to schools previously attended only by white children, on the ground that the Negro schools were inferior with respect to teacher training, pupil-teacher ratio, extracurricular activities, physical plant, and time and distance involved in travel.
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