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The "No Safety" Play
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:06 pm
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:06 pm
Sorry if already posted.
Why was that play not a safety? It looked like Kaep was inside the hash marks when he threw the ball and didn't appear to be a 49er's receiver anywhere close.
What did I miss?
11
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:07 pm to s_i5
quote:
What did I miss?
Not a damn thing.
edt: I just looked at the play again several times and I think Kap was indeed just outside the tackle box so good no call.
This post was edited on 11/18/13 at 7:19 pm
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:07 pm to s_i5
Because of where the ball was spotted pre-snap. He was outside of where the RT lined up.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:07 pm to s_i5
Hash marks don't have anything to do with it, he had gotten outside the tackle box. Just barely.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:11 pm to s_i5
quote:
It looked like Kaep was inside the hash marks
so?
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:12 pm to s_i5
He was pretty much right at where the RT started the play (which is what matters, not the hash marks). Sure as hell wasn't "well outside" as the ref claimed, and I've seen further outside called grounding when they are near that edge.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:15 pm to bigpapamac
the OL is usually as wide, and more times than not, wider than the hash marks when the ball is spotted in the middle of the field like I believe it was. So the hash marks are generally a decent spot to start.
i dont think it was a safety but if Drew's pass was intentional grounding, so was this one.
i dont think it was a safety but if Drew's pass was intentional grounding, so was this one.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:21 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
So the hash marks are generally a decent spot to start.
Not really. Just look where the RT was lined up on the play and where he threw the ball from. Refs got it right. Not sure why you'd start by looking at the hashes when the call comes down to the tackle box on a any one play.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:21 pm to s_i5
The "tackle box" is fluid throughout a play. Pre-snap, the borders of the tackle box are where the left and right tackles line up. During a play, the edges of the pocket are wherever the outside hip of the two outermost linemen are.
So if, during a play, a tackle moves inside, and a guard pulls to the outside beyond the tackle, the edge of the pocket is now wherever the outside hip of the guard is.
Or if, during a play, the tackle runs laterally 10 yards to the outside, the edge of the pocket is now 10 yards from where it started at the beginning of the play.
So, the non-call last night was the correct call, although he was certainly not "well outside" the pocket, like it was suggested by the ref. He just said that in an attempt to minimize the chances of a riot happening.
Hashmarks simply exist as a reference for spotting the ball.
So if, during a play, a tackle moves inside, and a guard pulls to the outside beyond the tackle, the edge of the pocket is now wherever the outside hip of the guard is.
Or if, during a play, the tackle runs laterally 10 yards to the outside, the edge of the pocket is now 10 yards from where it started at the beginning of the play.
So, the non-call last night was the correct call, although he was certainly not "well outside" the pocket, like it was suggested by the ref. He just said that in an attempt to minimize the chances of a riot happening.
Hashmarks simply exist as a reference for spotting the ball.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:24 pm to s_i5
Eh, wouldn't be much of an issue if the official didn't say 'WELL OUTSIDE.' He was outside, but barely. It was a good no-call.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:27 pm to Unknown_Poster
What would you do if you had an arena full of drunk asshats yelling at you how to do your job? 
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:27 pm to AmosMosesAndTwins
Get on the bus as fast as possible. Hey, in New Orleans worst that would happen is he'd have a beer thrown at him. In San Fran he would have been shanked and have his throat cut.
Hey, in New Orleans worst that would happen is he'd have a beer thrown at him. In San Fran he would have been shanked and have his throat cut. Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:30 pm to Fontainebleau Dr.
quote:
The "tackle box" is fluid throughout a play. Pre-snap, the borders of the tackle box are where the left and right tackles line up. During a play, the edges of the pocket are wherever the outside hip of the two outermost linemen are.
Are you sure about that? Every time it's looked at, they seem to look based on where the play starts, not where the players move during the play.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:30 pm to AmosMosesAndTwins
quote:
Because of where the ball was spotted pre-snap. He was outside of where the RT lined up.
Ok, I see now. Thanks.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:32 pm to s_i5
"The quarterback was well outside of the pocket"
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:38 pm to Eternalmajin
I"m pretty sure. That's how it was explained to me a couple of years ago.
Could be wrong.
Could be wrong.
This post was edited on 11/18/13 at 7:40 pm
Posted on 11/18/13 at 7:40 pm to s_i5
Besides not being intentional grounding, I don't even think he was in the end zone when he threw it. So even if it would have been intentional grinding, it wouldn't have been a safety.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 8:27 pm to bigpapamac
quote:
. Not sure why you'd start by looking at the hashes when the call comes down to the tackle box on a any one play.
Because if the ball is centered, which it was, the tackles are usually right on or wider than the hash marks. And Kaep clearly threw it inside the hash.
You don't need to pretend to know where the OT was lines up in that case. The hash is a fool proof marker.
Posted on 11/18/13 at 8:41 pm to s_i5
quote:
The "No Safety" Play
I read this and thought wow.... How bad-arse is Rob Ryan that he's designed a defensive alignment with no safeties! It must have worked! I gotta read about this... [opens thread]
Totally forgot about the safety no call.
This post was edited on 11/18/13 at 8:43 pm
Posted on 11/18/13 at 8:46 pm to Lester Earl
quote:The ref and announcer said it was lined up on the left hash mark and not in the center. I haven't seen the replay yet so idk but that's what I remember them saying which would mean he was probably outside the pocket
Because if the ball is centered, which it was, the tackles are usually right on or wider than the hash marks. And Kaep clearly threw it inside the hash.
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