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re: Carr willing to restructure his contract
Posted on 1/4/24 at 10:49 am to Midget Death Squad
Posted on 1/4/24 at 10:49 am to Midget Death Squad
quote:
tell that to Saints Talk. One week he's the demon and the next the savior. This place is a treasure trove of hilarious inconsistency, and I am here for the comedy.
The only people who say Derek Carr is a terrible QB are the ones that grew up Saints fans watching Drew Brees.
Carr is what he has always been, a middle tier QB, that has upper middle tier talent but needs a scheme designed to minimize his deficiencies to reach that potential. He didn't have that in Oakland/LV now it appears after this season he won't have that here in NOLA unless changes are made to the offensive side of the staff.
Asking Carr to be a player that can put a team on his back and win games for you is a receipt for failure. The good news is, in the right system, Carr doesn't have to be asked to do that for the team to have a lot of success. Hopefully the Saints management and DA are smart enough to see that and ballsy enough to correct it. I think they are. I hope they are.
1
Posted on 1/4/24 at 10:49 am to msstate7
quote:
It's ok to admit Carr is neither great, nor terrible.
Which is why paying him a good chunk of money for average qb okay when we’re already cash strapped kinda sucks.
Posted on 1/4/24 at 10:51 am to Snipe
quote:
Carr is what he has always been, a middle tier QB, that has upper middle tier talent but needs a scheme designed to minimize his deficiencies to reach that potential. He didn't have that in Oakland/LV now it appears after this season he won't have that here in NOLA unless changes are made to the offensive side of the staff.
So he has upper middle tier talent but it’s been everyone else’s fault over the course of a fairly long career as to why he hasn’t reached it?
Posted on 1/4/24 at 10:55 am to St Augustine
quote:
Which is why paying him a good chunk of money for average qb okay
He's paid average (13th) and he is ranked mostly on par with guys making $5-10mm more than him. Even if his play felt average over the course of the season due to line play, injuries, receiver player and his own mistakes
he's paid exactly as he should be
Posted on 1/4/24 at 10:59 am to Proximo
quote:
Does the restructure include only that guaranteed money or is some of it the future signing bonus? Do we know that for sure?
If we're restructuring for cap purposes, it will convert base salary/roster bonuses to signing bonuses. Other than a straight paycut (which we can all agree isn't going to happen for the purposes of this thread), conversion to signing bonuses is how you kick the cap can.
The problem is that by moving more money via signing bonus, we're making the dead cap so large it limits our ability to move on from him.
24: $35.7M cap number, largely due to a $30M base salary
25: $45.7M cap number. Same structure as 24 with an additional $10M roster bonus (which becomes guaranteed if on the roster in March of 2024, so it's going to hit). His 2025 salary of $30M is guaranteed if on the roster in March of 2024 also.
This would effectively be a 3/111.4M deal.Per OTC, we would only have $11.4M in dead cap in 2026 if we cut him pre-June 1, and that could basically be split up if we did it post June 1 (to kick $5.7M to 2026)
That $28.5M iniital signing bonus is broken up into 5 (2027 is a void year) $5.7M cap hits. If we tinker with that $30M salary for 2024 (to restructure for cap relief), the dead cap (which is only $11.4M after 2025 now) will increase by that amount. So if we convert $25M to signing bonus, we just made him uncuttable in 2025 (with a guaranteed base salary, which likely makes the cap carousel spin another 1-2 years).
Posted on 1/4/24 at 10:59 am to St Augustine
quote:
So he has upper middle tier talent but it’s been everyone else’s fault over the course of a fairly long career as to why he hasn’t reached it?
I mean, yes and no. He's not the level of player that can put a team on his back and carry them. He's not an elite QB who makes everyone else around him better. He's the player that needs great play around him to elevate his game and help him reach his potential. The list of SB winning QBs I posted up the thread are very similar players. Yes he has faults mainly due to his not controlling his emotions and lettings this get in his head but that's who he is.
Posted on 1/4/24 at 10:59 am to Proximo
quote:
he's worth the full $37.5mm per year ($150mm) based on the contracts of other veterans around the league.
That AAV is going to be much closer to $50M/year moving forward if we restructure him this offseason.
Posted on 1/4/24 at 11:04 am to SlowFlowPro
For cap purposes, yes the number will balloon. I just think it’s a fact of life and unavoidable no matter who is playing QB for us unless it’s someone on a rookie deal.
If Mahomes was QB, it’s the same outcome just a larger figure based on how we maneuver to get under it
If Mahomes was QB, it’s the same outcome just a larger figure based on how we maneuver to get under it
Posted on 1/4/24 at 11:07 am to BigPerm30
quote:
Extend him a year. Give him a bit more guaranteed money
Wtf are you smoking. I want some
Posted on 1/4/24 at 11:18 am to Proximo
quote:
For cap purposes, yes the number will balloon. I just think it’s a fact of life and unavoidable no matter who is playing QB for us unless it’s someone on a rookie deal.
I truly do not think this was the plan, but our 2 can kicking sacred cows (Ram and Latt's contracts) may be disrupted this offsesason.
Loomis is likely moving to plan B or C right now.
Ram still has around $34M in dead cap and Latt has, assuming the bonus isn't triggered by us, something like $32M in dead cap remaining. Clearly we can't cut both pre-June 1 and get under the 2024 cap, which is going to move a TON of dead money into 2025.
And this is before we do the 2024 shuffle and push money back.
Can we address Taysom Hill's shitty contract finally?
What about Mathieu and Maye?
We can shift all of those issues to 2025 to help us in 2024, but is that wise?
Posted on 1/4/24 at 11:34 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
We can shift all of those issues to 2025 to help us in 2024, but is that wise?
Nope but its called Loomising.
Posted on 1/4/24 at 12:05 pm to SlowFlowPro
At the time, Carr was not a mistake.
There wasn’t much of a list of potential qbs
There wasn’t much of a list of potential qbs
Posted on 1/4/24 at 12:40 pm to Proximo
quote:
JMO but this was due to the injuries/ribs and our shite o-line play earlier in the season. I think it’ll level out next year if we can get rid of Maronne
No doubt that played a part but watching a few of the All22 films showed he missed reads often, and that's not including the ones where he rushed himself for fear of getting hit (early season bad pass protection OL) even when he had time
Posted on 1/4/24 at 1:24 pm to paulbeasy
quote:
Carr’s career td per season average is 24. He’s on close pace for it. Matt ryan, big Ben, Eli Manning, Dak Prescott, matt Stafford are examples of qb’s whose average tds per year are in the mid 20’s (24/25/26).
The problem with macro comparisons like this is you are counting guys who played many more seasons and most fall off at the end, also some did not play full seasons. Dak played 5 games in 2020, take that year out and he’s at 27 for example.
Compare their peak seasons. Carr has thrown more than 30 TDs once (32) and over 25 twice (28,27) Ryan has 3 over 30 (38,35,32) Stafford has 2 with 41. Dak has 3 over 30 and he’s 2 years behind Carr plus missed 3/4 of 1
Carr has 4 4000 yd seasons only 1 over 4200. Ryan threw for 4000 10 years in a row His lowest total was 4177 that would be Carr’s 2nd best season. Stafford had 7 straight over 4200 including a 5000 season. At their peaks all the guys you listed are easily better than Carr
This post was edited on 1/4/24 at 1:32 pm
Posted on 1/4/24 at 1:53 pm to Townedrunkard
quote:Agreed. And many contracts have that written into them at the teams' discretion without having to redo the contract. He is acting like he is doing us a favor by taking more money upfront in order to defer the cap hit. Unfortunately, we have no choice but to restructure his contract.
Lol. He’s not taking a pay cut. They just push money years down the line for csp relief now.
Basically what Loomis is known for.
Posted on 1/4/24 at 1:53 pm to H-Town Tiger
Career passer rating for those involved...
Ryan - 93.6
Ben - 93.5
Eli - 84.1
Dak - 98.7
Carr - 92.0
Stafford - 91.0
I think these are all good comparisons for carr. Stafford esp. with stafford taking more chances (tds and ints).
Ryan - 93.6
Ben - 93.5
Eli - 84.1
Dak - 98.7
Carr - 92.0
Stafford - 91.0
I think these are all good comparisons for carr. Stafford esp. with stafford taking more chances (tds and ints).
This post was edited on 1/4/24 at 1:55 pm
Posted on 1/4/24 at 2:03 pm to msstate7
If you think Derek Carr belongs in that group- passer ratings aside, I don’t know what to tell you. All those guys besides Prescott have been to a superbowl or won a superbowl. Prescott himself has won 2 playoff games. Carr has been to one playoff game and lost it.
But lets keep dreaming Carr belongs in this group- its the exact crap DA and Loomis will sell this fanbase on this offseason.
But lets keep dreaming Carr belongs in this group- its the exact crap DA and Loomis will sell this fanbase on this offseason.
Posted on 1/4/24 at 2:20 pm to Pels_Yaz
By your reasoning, Milroe is better than Jayden daniels.
Posted on 1/4/24 at 2:22 pm to msstate7
The fact you’re comparing how college qbs perform on their teams to judging how 30 year old NFL qbs perform on their professional teams is exactly why you don’t get it.
Posted on 1/4/24 at 2:25 pm to Pels_Yaz
Sure, everyone knows that Trent dilfer and Doug Williams are better Dan Marino.
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