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Message
re: This is Buddy's chance.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 11:19 am to TotesMcGotes
Posted on 12/6/16 at 11:19 am to TotesMcGotes
You do realize Buddy turns 23 next week. Otto Porter just turned 23 in June.
Pels took Buddy BC he was already developed and a safe pick.
Pels took Buddy BC he was already developed and a safe pick.
2
Posted on 12/6/16 at 11:28 am to Toula
Yes I understand how age works. I also understand that you can be 29 coming out of college and will need time to adjust to the pro game.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:10 pm to ihometiger
quote:
Can we please sign Austin Daye please as he is available and is better that 90% of what we have.
No thanks... we already have enough scrubs
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:18 pm to Toula
quote:
You do realize Buddy turns 23 next week. Otto Porter just turned 23 in June.
Pels took Buddy BC he was already developed and a safe pick.
IDK why people keep repeating this?
Yes relatively speaking he is more developed then most guys coming out of the draft and that likely played a part in Demps decision making....But he is still a rookie.
Most rookies, seniors, juniors, sophomores or freshman, they struggle. Especially in the first half of the season.
- Draymond was not an all defensive facilitating 3 and D guy his rookie campaign.
- David West barely did anything his first two seasons and arguably regressed his second season in some ways.
- CJ McCollum was derided by hot take experts as a disappointment after his first two lackluster seasons after four years in college.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 4:27 pm
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:47 pm to NOLA Bronco
Draymond: 35th overall
David West: 18th overall
CJ McC: 10th overall
You can take guys in those spots and let them develop. All the high upside freshman are gone by then.
The only way to justify Buddy at 6 is Demps believed in his "development" and immediate impact. It's been Dell's MO since drafting AD.
If he wanted long-term upside, Murray or Chriss were the pick. B/c of this, I hold Buddy to a higher standard as a rookie, and Demps accountable for another terrible win-now decision to save his job.
We haven't had a high-upside rookie since the AD pick, and that was 5 1st rd picks ago.
David West: 18th overall
CJ McC: 10th overall
You can take guys in those spots and let them develop. All the high upside freshman are gone by then.
The only way to justify Buddy at 6 is Demps believed in his "development" and immediate impact. It's been Dell's MO since drafting AD.
If he wanted long-term upside, Murray or Chriss were the pick. B/c of this, I hold Buddy to a higher standard as a rookie, and Demps accountable for another terrible win-now decision to save his job.
We haven't had a high-upside rookie since the AD pick, and that was 5 1st rd picks ago.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 4:48 pm
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:49 pm to NOLA Bronco
quote:
- CJ McCollum was derided by hot take experts as a disappointment after his first two lackluster seasons after four years in college.
I think this was the biggest thing.
McCollum's 1st two seasons: 100 games played, 14.5 MPG
42.9/38.8/69.2
6.3 PPG, 1.4 RPG, 0.9 APG
Since then: 102 games played, 34.7 MPG
45.2/42.2/84.6
21.1 PPG, 3.4 RPG, 4.1 APG
Compare it to those other SG/SFs: Shabazz, KCP, McLemore, and Oladipo -- look who started better than him, look who's the best now.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:52 pm to NOLA Bronco
not sure why this is so hard for some to grasp.
Hield is more physically developed at 23. his game is not NBA ready. the Pels sold that, but they were wrong to do so. and fans were foolish to buy that logic.
post prep to pros and age limit, there is little evidence (if any at all) to suggest staying in college helps players have more success in the NBA.
the guy most compared Hield to was JJ Redick. he averaged 14.8mpg (and about 1000 mp) his first 2 years in the league. he didn't score 10ppg until his 5th year in the league.
Hield is more physically developed at 23. his game is not NBA ready. the Pels sold that, but they were wrong to do so. and fans were foolish to buy that logic.
post prep to pros and age limit, there is little evidence (if any at all) to suggest staying in college helps players have more success in the NBA.
the guy most compared Hield to was JJ Redick. he averaged 14.8mpg (and about 1000 mp) his first 2 years in the league. he didn't score 10ppg until his 5th year in the league.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:57 pm to NOLA Bronco
quote:
IDK why people keep repeating this?
Because the FO that everybody wants fired appears to have made a mistake in assuming how NBA ready Buddy would be. This is hate on Demps as much as Buddy.
quote:
he is still a rookie.
I'm not going to say him being bad at what he was drafted for isn't concerning, but Buddy fixed his shot in college, no reason to think he can't fix it in the pros. Also, Denzel Valentine, another senior who was nearly as prolific and accurate as Buddy from 3 is also shooting just 27.3% from 3. We're talking about 2 players that averaged about 45% on 8 3 pointers per game. I'm going to assume the shooting will get there eventually, even if it's not until next year.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:57 pm to htran90
quote:
McCollum's 1st two seasons: 100 games played, 14.5 MPG
42.9/38.8/69.2
6.3 PPG, 1.4 RPG, 0.9 APG
15 minutes per game on a deep and seasoned Blazer team.
Per 36s are 6 pts off from what he's doing now.
Did you expect him to get minutes behind Batum, Mo Williams, Dorell Wright, Barton and Wesley Matthews as a rook?
Had Blazers had a roster made up of D'leaguers and guys off the street, safe to say McCollum would have broken out sooner.?
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:58 pm to corndeaux
Heck I am not sure the Pels did sell Hield as that. I think the media has and fans.
Going back pretty far Gentry has been very clear that Hield is a rookie. He will take time. He will struggle. People need to get their expectations in check.
When Demps was interviewed he pointed to his steady improvement, his work ethic, and his character as being the major selling points outside of normal talent evaluation. Then echoing Gentry in cautioning that Hield will have a learning curve like most rookies.
Going back pretty far Gentry has been very clear that Hield is a rookie. He will take time. He will struggle. People need to get their expectations in check.
When Demps was interviewed he pointed to his steady improvement, his work ethic, and his character as being the major selling points outside of normal talent evaluation. Then echoing Gentry in cautioning that Hield will have a learning curve like most rookies.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 5:06 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
Because the FO that everybody wants fired appears to have made a mistake in assuming how NBA ready Buddy would be. This is hate on Demps as much as Buddy.
Well said.
I like Buddy, am a fan and hope he succeeds in the NBA.
I just view it as another short sided decision by Demps in an effort to win now. Not one of these decisions have worked out.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 5:06 pm to Toula
quote:
15 minutes per game on a deep and seasoned Blazer team.
Per 36s are 6 pts off from what he's doing now.
Did you expect him to get minutes behind Batum, Mo Williams, Dorell Wright, Barton and Wesley Matthews as a rook?
Had Blazers had a roster made up of D'leaguers and guys off the street, safe to say McCollum would have broken out sooner.?
Context does matter Toula, so lets keep it in mind.
CJ's first season he sat on the bench 36 games and got to watch. Came in and had a rocky first month, despite as you say, a deep and strong roster to take pressure off. Not the shite show we have. His first 13 games shot 39% from the field and barely 30% from three.
If your argument is to take the position that through a quarter of his rookie season Buddy is a bust or a clear error in drafting, you are basing it more on fantasy then evidence. Wanting something to be true and cherry picking your arguments to frame it as such, instead of seeing reality.
Rookies struggle. Them not struggling is the exception, not the rule. And Buddy is trending up. In the last six games since his abysmal Portland game, he is shooting 44.4% from three. Best on the team for that stretch. Most rebounds per 36 of any guard and Solomon Hill.
But you know, that may dip again and he will have ugly shooting stretches again. Because he is a rookie and I keep that in mind.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 5:15 pm
Posted on 12/6/16 at 5:22 pm to TigerinATL
quote:How about Kris Dunn? Another senior whos struggling in the NBA. People were in love with him on this board.
. Also, Denzel Valentine, another senior
People need to realize, the jump between college hoops and the NBA is huge.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 7:13 pm to NOLA Bronco
quote:
Heck I am not sure the Pels did sell Hield as that. I think the media has and fans
His "polish" and "NBA ready shot" were the selling points over taking a freshman, though. Demps never came out and said it directly, but going w an etwaun more type lends me to think they planned on relying on buddy heavily.
Obviously it's still early - just saying the only reason to go senior over freshman at 6 is bc that guy is ready to play in the NBA, historically
Posted on 12/7/16 at 12:04 am to GynoSandberg
quote:
Obviously it's still early - just saying the only reason to go senior over freshman at 6 is bc that guy is ready to play in the NBA, historically
Don't get me wrong, I think his polish was likely on the positive side of Demp's t-chart. But I think it is a bit of a false choice that it is one or the other. More like all of the above IMO. Several teams, including the Lakers, flirted heavily with taking Buddy before us. Minnesota was also supposedly intrigued with Buddy.
And Demps own rationale has not suggested he expected Buddy to be this unique exception that can come in and be a major positive contributor year one.
As you even say, it is something you have to assume was the case without ever having direct evidence to prove it.
Moore can signal any number of things. Including, a less expensive stop gap between Buddy's early career and the point when he is ready to take over. Who can then move into a comfortable bench role with a price tag that justifies it.
This post was edited on 12/7/16 at 12:07 am
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