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Takeaways from the first preseason game
Posted on 10/4/17 at 8:42 am
Posted on 10/4/17 at 8:42 am
Since the game thread was surprisingly active, a separate thread discussing what we saw would be good for those that didn't get to watch the game.
The Good:
- AD/DC are unstoppable for most teams and should get teams in foul trouble early every quarter.
- Dante was the only starter with a positive +/- (+3) because he was limited to 15 minutes and only played in the first half. I do not think that's a coincidence at all that the team's play fell off after he was sidelined. Dante doesn't put up a lot of stats but he's an active guy that knows where to be. The drop off between Dante and a still trying to get comfortable Miller was pretty noticeable.
- Diallo looked like he MIGHT be ready enough to play. I emphasize the might because while he made some good plays and had a good stat line of 5/6 in just 12 minutes, he also had 5 fouls and made a bunch of rookie mistakes. If he looks as good against more veteran and capable bigs at OKC then I think he's got a chance at the rotation which will be important if they need Dante at SF.
- Rondo had 8 assists and didn't really dominate the ball to do it because many times AD/DC brought the ball up after they rebounded it. When Rondo did get the ball he usually made the right play. My main complaint was he took 1 3 too many (was 1 of 3). But his passing was as good as advertised and if the other guys will keep moving he'll get them easy scores.
- Moore did his usual thing. He had a nice game but it wasn't flashy.
- Ian Clark. I saw some complaints about Clark in the game thread, but from what I saw he brings a lot of the same things to the floor that Moore does.
The Bad:
- The 2nd half. This team's strength is attacking with AD/DC. They even started the 3rd quarter like that as AD and Boogie both drew fouls 18+ feet away from the basket in the first 2 minutes of the 3rd. And then they just kind of stopped doing what had made them successful. It was like in years past where we'd go for long stretches without getting AD any touches, only this time Boogie wasn't getting touches either. I don't care if they each average 40 points a game, they need to ride AD/DC as much as they can. Everyone else should consider themselves a finisher. If you aren't AD/DC and you have the ball you should pass it unless you have a layup or open 3, if you don't have the ball you should be moving.
- Darius Miller. The only times he looked comfortable was when he was spotting up for 3. He didn't get any rebounds and he was moving very tentatively on offense and defense. He was just tentatively shuffling his feet both when setting screens and guarding guys off ball. I was also keeping an eye on 2 way rookie Charles Cooke and the body language, confidence and activity level was night and day. That's what Miller needs to look like. Hopefully as he gets more comfortable he'll get more active. He needs to stop thinking and start doing.
- The defense. The Bulls made more 3s than you'd expect but they also were wide open for most of them. There are a lot of new faces in new roles but Hill was the guy they brought in to be the vocal leader of the defense because they didn't have anyone else doing that. It's too early to panic over the defense with so many new guys, and we still have the Tony Allen card to play, but they need to get their act together on defense.
The Good:
- AD/DC are unstoppable for most teams and should get teams in foul trouble early every quarter.
- Dante was the only starter with a positive +/- (+3) because he was limited to 15 minutes and only played in the first half. I do not think that's a coincidence at all that the team's play fell off after he was sidelined. Dante doesn't put up a lot of stats but he's an active guy that knows where to be. The drop off between Dante and a still trying to get comfortable Miller was pretty noticeable.
- Diallo looked like he MIGHT be ready enough to play. I emphasize the might because while he made some good plays and had a good stat line of 5/6 in just 12 minutes, he also had 5 fouls and made a bunch of rookie mistakes. If he looks as good against more veteran and capable bigs at OKC then I think he's got a chance at the rotation which will be important if they need Dante at SF.
- Rondo had 8 assists and didn't really dominate the ball to do it because many times AD/DC brought the ball up after they rebounded it. When Rondo did get the ball he usually made the right play. My main complaint was he took 1 3 too many (was 1 of 3). But his passing was as good as advertised and if the other guys will keep moving he'll get them easy scores.
- Moore did his usual thing. He had a nice game but it wasn't flashy.
- Ian Clark. I saw some complaints about Clark in the game thread, but from what I saw he brings a lot of the same things to the floor that Moore does.
The Bad:
- The 2nd half. This team's strength is attacking with AD/DC. They even started the 3rd quarter like that as AD and Boogie both drew fouls 18+ feet away from the basket in the first 2 minutes of the 3rd. And then they just kind of stopped doing what had made them successful. It was like in years past where we'd go for long stretches without getting AD any touches, only this time Boogie wasn't getting touches either. I don't care if they each average 40 points a game, they need to ride AD/DC as much as they can. Everyone else should consider themselves a finisher. If you aren't AD/DC and you have the ball you should pass it unless you have a layup or open 3, if you don't have the ball you should be moving.
- Darius Miller. The only times he looked comfortable was when he was spotting up for 3. He didn't get any rebounds and he was moving very tentatively on offense and defense. He was just tentatively shuffling his feet both when setting screens and guarding guys off ball. I was also keeping an eye on 2 way rookie Charles Cooke and the body language, confidence and activity level was night and day. That's what Miller needs to look like. Hopefully as he gets more comfortable he'll get more active. He needs to stop thinking and start doing.
- The defense. The Bulls made more 3s than you'd expect but they also were wide open for most of them. There are a lot of new faces in new roles but Hill was the guy they brought in to be the vocal leader of the defense because they didn't have anyone else doing that. It's too early to panic over the defense with so many new guys, and we still have the Tony Allen card to play, but they need to get their act together on defense.
This post was edited on 10/4/17 at 8:44 am
10
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:41 am to TigerinATL
Diallo runs the floor like a fricking gazelle. His rolling ability off the pick is very hard to stop- lightening fast. I really wanted to see him get a touch or 2 at the elbow and knock down a shot like he was doing all summer league.
We really need Diallo to come into his own this year- it gives us a nice trade asset at the least. Even if he's struggling big time on the defensive end I still think you continue to give him minutes. He needs real NBA experience to improve- and I think he will.
We really need Diallo to come into his own this year- it gives us a nice trade asset at the least. Even if he's struggling big time on the defensive end I still think you continue to give him minutes. He needs real NBA experience to improve- and I think he will.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:41 am to TigerinATL
Thanks for recap didn't get to watch it
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:47 am to TigerinATL
quote:
The Bulls made more 3s than you'd expect but they also were wide open for most of them.
this is going to be a season long issue i'm afraid
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:01 am to TigerinATL
Diallo stacked on some muscle. Fingers crossed.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:05 am to Solo
I'm a little worried Jrue put on too much muscle to guard bigger players. Looked slow last night.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:15 am to TigerinATL
AD and Cousins looked great in the first half.
I will say that at times you could tell there was lackluster effort, but that's expected in a preseason game.
Dante looked like Dante, and as you said Miller did not look that good. big difference between the two as far as last night goes.
Diallo has the ability to be a good player, i think he's just too stupid and/or immature to be one.
They have got to get some help down low. You cannot rely on Diallo and Ajinca all season as your backup bigs.
Rondo looked good, as did Moore. I didn't catch the 4th quarter and didn't see much of Clark or Crawford to say how they did. I mainly watched the 2nd & 3rd quarters.
Watching AD and Cousins draw fouls was great, and hopefully that's a trend that will continue, which i think will. We made twice as many free throws as the Bulls attempted. Usually when you do that, you win.
My biggest takeaway was Jrue. If this team is going to make it to the playoffs and make some noise, he has got to be better. His brother looked better than him last night. You can't play 30 minutes as our $25M/yr SG and only take 7 shots, and get to the line once, especially when most of the game we were in the penalty. With his defense, he should outscore the opponents SG more often than not, even if he's only scoring 18ppg. 11 ain't gonna cut it, especially with shotty defense.
We need to get at least 60 a night from our big 3. Jrue not scoring will make it difficult for us to win most nights.
Last year we were 13-5 when Jrue scored 20+.
We were 9-14 when Jrue scored in between 13-19.
We were 10-16 when Jrue scored less than 12.
We were 2-13 when Jrue didn't play.
As you can see, Jrue playing well offensively makes a huge difference in if we win or lose. he can't play 20+ games this year where he scores single digits. It's just too much to overcome for us to win.
I will say that at times you could tell there was lackluster effort, but that's expected in a preseason game.
Dante looked like Dante, and as you said Miller did not look that good. big difference between the two as far as last night goes.
Diallo has the ability to be a good player, i think he's just too stupid and/or immature to be one.
They have got to get some help down low. You cannot rely on Diallo and Ajinca all season as your backup bigs.
Rondo looked good, as did Moore. I didn't catch the 4th quarter and didn't see much of Clark or Crawford to say how they did. I mainly watched the 2nd & 3rd quarters.
Watching AD and Cousins draw fouls was great, and hopefully that's a trend that will continue, which i think will. We made twice as many free throws as the Bulls attempted. Usually when you do that, you win.
My biggest takeaway was Jrue. If this team is going to make it to the playoffs and make some noise, he has got to be better. His brother looked better than him last night. You can't play 30 minutes as our $25M/yr SG and only take 7 shots, and get to the line once, especially when most of the game we were in the penalty. With his defense, he should outscore the opponents SG more often than not, even if he's only scoring 18ppg. 11 ain't gonna cut it, especially with shotty defense.
We need to get at least 60 a night from our big 3. Jrue not scoring will make it difficult for us to win most nights.
Last year we were 13-5 when Jrue scored 20+.
We were 9-14 when Jrue scored in between 13-19.
We were 10-16 when Jrue scored less than 12.
We were 2-13 when Jrue didn't play.
As you can see, Jrue playing well offensively makes a huge difference in if we win or lose. he can't play 20+ games this year where he scores single digits. It's just too much to overcome for us to win.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:53 am to TeddyPadillac
The thing I noticed about Jrue was 3 of his 4 made FGs were Rondo feeding him easy layups on cuts. I was surprised when Rondo said Jrue was one of the best cutters he's ever played with but it immediately showed last night. You're right that he needs to score more, but I think he's going to have to accomplish that by being aggressive off ball rather than with the ball in his hands. If there were only some way to have gotten Cousins and kept Buddy.
This post was edited on 10/4/17 at 10:55 am
Posted on 10/4/17 at 11:05 am to TigerinATL
I think we'd be better if we had Buddy instead of Jrue right now.
I did see the nice cuts Jrue had, and Rondo finding him. I expect to see that a good bit this year.
I want to see the Jrue that came in as a sub late in the season during the playoff run year. That Jrue was aggressive and wanted to score. That's what we gave him this big contract for. He needs to be a scorer, not a facilitator. I could care less how many assists he has. That's Rondo's job. WHen Jrue gets the ball, the first thing that should go through his mind is "am i open" if so, shoot it. if not, then drive pass your defender and get in the paint. Use your body and get a foul and/or finish at the rim. If either of those two options doesn't present itself immediately, then pass the ball back and move.
Jrue is a good free throw shooter, and i expect us to be in the bonus in every quarter. He needs to take advantage of that. You can't draw fouls if you don't penetrate.
If he's making this switch to SG, then he should be taking at least 5 free throws a game. He shot terrible last year from the line, but i know he's an 80+% free throw shooter.
Jrue should be taking at least 12 shots a game. Make 2 threes, make 4 baskets, and make 4 free throws. There's 18 points. That doesn't seem that difficult if your attempting 12-16 shots a game.
I did see the nice cuts Jrue had, and Rondo finding him. I expect to see that a good bit this year.
I want to see the Jrue that came in as a sub late in the season during the playoff run year. That Jrue was aggressive and wanted to score. That's what we gave him this big contract for. He needs to be a scorer, not a facilitator. I could care less how many assists he has. That's Rondo's job. WHen Jrue gets the ball, the first thing that should go through his mind is "am i open" if so, shoot it. if not, then drive pass your defender and get in the paint. Use your body and get a foul and/or finish at the rim. If either of those two options doesn't present itself immediately, then pass the ball back and move.
Jrue is a good free throw shooter, and i expect us to be in the bonus in every quarter. He needs to take advantage of that. You can't draw fouls if you don't penetrate.
If he's making this switch to SG, then he should be taking at least 5 free throws a game. He shot terrible last year from the line, but i know he's an 80+% free throw shooter.
Jrue should be taking at least 12 shots a game. Make 2 threes, make 4 baskets, and make 4 free throws. There's 18 points. That doesn't seem that difficult if your attempting 12-16 shots a game.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 11:12 am to TigerinATL
I really didn't watch most of the 2nd half because they looked so incredible in the 1st half. Exactly like I imagined they would play.
I put on a little of the 2nd half and it looked like a different team, playing different sets. Its the preseason so I'm not going to panic about it too much.
Jrue does need to be better. Getting paid that much money, he needs to be more aggressive and better offball.
I put on a little of the 2nd half and it looked like a different team, playing different sets. Its the preseason so I'm not going to panic about it too much.
Jrue does need to be better. Getting paid that much money, he needs to be more aggressive and better offball.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 11:36 am to TigerinATL
A major fault for Jrue has always been his lack of getting to the line. You look at all the good guards in the NBA, they get to the line. 2.3 FTA per game average for his career. He needs to be more aggressive. Having Rondo feed him on cuts could definitely help. If he can get his FTA to 4 that would be nice.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 11:45 am to TigerinATL
Defense was bad throughout except for AD's ability to contest shots at the rim. The biggest problem seemed to be getting lost in rotations and Boogie's refusal to come out on his man. The fact the team has plenty of solid individual defenders makes me believe they will figure it out.
The beginning of the game had Finch's fingerprints all over it. All 5 guys constantly moving; getting into offensive sets quickly and making lots of quick passes; getting AD and Boogie the ball in positions where the can attack the rim. The second half was similar to what we have come to expect from this Gentry coached team. A guard holding the ball on the perimeter trying to figure out what to do with AD and Boogie simply standing around saying wtf occasionally jacking up threes. In my opinion, Gentry should be banned from calling any plays because he keeps coaching like Nash or Curry is on his team. It is only the first game, but old habits die hard. I just hope Demps pulls the plug on the Gentry experiment quickly if things are not working, or else I hope Rondo and Cousins stage a mutiny. There is too much talent on this team to have another year with a coach that can't figure things out.
I liked Moore and Diallo's aggressiveness. Despite his fouls, Diaollo gives this team instant energy off the bench. I am hoping that Gentry keeps giving him minutes because he has tremendous upside.
For Jrue's sake, I hope he doesn't play any point this year. The difference between him and Rondo is night and day. Rondo knows how to bend the defense whereas Jrue simply reacts to what he sees in front of him.
The beginning of the game had Finch's fingerprints all over it. All 5 guys constantly moving; getting into offensive sets quickly and making lots of quick passes; getting AD and Boogie the ball in positions where the can attack the rim. The second half was similar to what we have come to expect from this Gentry coached team. A guard holding the ball on the perimeter trying to figure out what to do with AD and Boogie simply standing around saying wtf occasionally jacking up threes. In my opinion, Gentry should be banned from calling any plays because he keeps coaching like Nash or Curry is on his team. It is only the first game, but old habits die hard. I just hope Demps pulls the plug on the Gentry experiment quickly if things are not working, or else I hope Rondo and Cousins stage a mutiny. There is too much talent on this team to have another year with a coach that can't figure things out.
I liked Moore and Diallo's aggressiveness. Despite his fouls, Diaollo gives this team instant energy off the bench. I am hoping that Gentry keeps giving him minutes because he has tremendous upside.
For Jrue's sake, I hope he doesn't play any point this year. The difference between him and Rondo is night and day. Rondo knows how to bend the defense whereas Jrue simply reacts to what he sees in front of him.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 12:21 pm to TigerinATL
Problem with Diallo is he's SO lost on defense right now. Its one thing to be bad defensively. But, Diallo looks completely lost. Like he has no clue whats even going on.
I went back and re watched the first half and starting with his first defensive possession, when he gave up a Mirotic 3, he was bad.
He has no idea how to guard a pick and roll, and off-ball has the urge to dive in the paint to block shots. Thats particularly a problem when he's guarding jump shooters like Mirotic.
A few plays later, I guess after realizing Mirotic can shoot, he's clearly 100% focused on not giving up another 3 attempt. So he basically hugs him, and instead gives up a 3 to Valentine because he was oblivious of an easy switch situation.
I went back and re watched the first half and starting with his first defensive possession, when he gave up a Mirotic 3, he was bad.
He has no idea how to guard a pick and roll, and off-ball has the urge to dive in the paint to block shots. Thats particularly a problem when he's guarding jump shooters like Mirotic.
A few plays later, I guess after realizing Mirotic can shoot, he's clearly 100% focused on not giving up another 3 attempt. So he basically hugs him, and instead gives up a 3 to Valentine because he was oblivious of an easy switch situation.
This post was edited on 10/4/17 at 12:29 pm
Posted on 10/4/17 at 1:38 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
we still have the Tony Allen card to play, but they need to get their act together on defense.
I'm assuming he didn't play because he's older and they didn't feel the need to play him in a preseason game? I feel like I'd much rather have him in the game, than Miller (who didn't do shite and probably won't add much outside of an occasional 3).
Posted on 10/4/17 at 1:46 pm to Epic Cajun
Mason with a shot chart comparing last year's shot selection to what we saw through the first 3 quarters last night.
Assistant Coach Jamelle McMillan replied crediting Finch with the changes.
quote:
Mason Ginsberg? @MasonGinsberg 1 hour ago
#Pelicans' shot chart through 3 quarters last night (before the scrubs came in) compared to their full preseason opener last season:
One preseason game is not enough to know anything is changing for sure, but there is a lot to like here. Major difference in shot selection.
Assistant Coach Jamelle McMillan replied crediting Finch with the changes.
quote:
Jamelle McMillan? @JamelleMac 29 minutes ago
Replying to @MasonGinsberg
Game is going to look different this year when it comes to shots. Coach Finch implementing some great stuff here on the offensive end
This post was edited on 10/4/17 at 1:47 pm
Posted on 10/4/17 at 1:51 pm to TigerinATL
Wow. You have got to love that.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 1:55 pm to TigerinATL
That is how it should look. That is what you call efficient basketball. Those are high percentage looks.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 5:25 pm to TigerinATL
To me the team looked exactly like we hoped it might and exactly like we feared it might. Streaky shooters spitting flame? Unstoppable. Streaky shooters sucking? Really, really, realllllly bad.
I'm more optimistic than pessimistic based on the fact that Dante didn't play in the 2nd half as I thought coach was just trying out both guys with the starters.
I did like seeing the team stay active through the drought. That 3rd was BAD, but two of the rare buckets came on Holiday cuts from Rondo passes. That was not a sight I thought I'd see.
I'm more optimistic than pessimistic based on the fact that Dante didn't play in the 2nd half as I thought coach was just trying out both guys with the starters.
I did like seeing the team stay active through the drought. That 3rd was BAD, but two of the rare buckets came on Holiday cuts from Rondo passes. That was not a sight I thought I'd see.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 6:26 pm to ShamelessPel
Nm
This post was edited on 10/4/17 at 6:29 pm
Posted on 10/5/17 at 7:45 am to CelticDog
Mavs beat the Bulls by 50 last night
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