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The infamous "Martha" scene in Batman v. Superman
Posted on 6/4/17 at 12:46 am
Posted on 6/4/17 at 12:46 am
I'm gonna be the first to tell you that I was a fan of Batman v. Superman (especially when it comes to the Ultimate Edition), but even I will admit the execution of the "Martha" scene was fairly sub-par. But I think people may be hating it for the wrong reasons.
I came across CinemaWins's video concerning Batman v. Superman and his explanation for the Martha scene made me think about it in a new light. Essentially what he said was this:
Batman does not spare Superman because their mothers share the same name. Batman has spent 18 months obsessing over killing this alien who can destroy the Earth. It isn't until Superman uses the name that the alien becomes humanized. At first Batman becomes enraged because he thinks it's another trick. Once he realizes it's Clark's mom's name he starts to understand that maybe they're not so different. He never considered the evil alien had a human mother or let alone would be willing to die for her.
Bruce couldn't save his mother. No matter how many goons he brands, he was a helpless kid when she was killed just like Clark is now. He'll never be able to bring his Martha back. Now he has an opportunity for redemption. It literally has nothing to do with their mother's having the same name, that was just the spark (that you can see snapping Bruce out of his kill-rage) that showed him Superman wasn't pure evil. With potentially his last breath he asked his killer to save someone else.
It's the entire reason we were shown the murder of the Wayne's one more time.
Yeah, I agree the way they wrote it was hammy, but I disagree with the notion that Bruce decided to spare Clark simply because their mothers shared the same name.
I came across CinemaWins's video concerning Batman v. Superman and his explanation for the Martha scene made me think about it in a new light. Essentially what he said was this:
Batman does not spare Superman because their mothers share the same name. Batman has spent 18 months obsessing over killing this alien who can destroy the Earth. It isn't until Superman uses the name that the alien becomes humanized. At first Batman becomes enraged because he thinks it's another trick. Once he realizes it's Clark's mom's name he starts to understand that maybe they're not so different. He never considered the evil alien had a human mother or let alone would be willing to die for her.
Bruce couldn't save his mother. No matter how many goons he brands, he was a helpless kid when she was killed just like Clark is now. He'll never be able to bring his Martha back. Now he has an opportunity for redemption. It literally has nothing to do with their mother's having the same name, that was just the spark (that you can see snapping Bruce out of his kill-rage) that showed him Superman wasn't pure evil. With potentially his last breath he asked his killer to save someone else.
It's the entire reason we were shown the murder of the Wayne's one more time.
Yeah, I agree the way they wrote it was hammy, but I disagree with the notion that Bruce decided to spare Clark simply because their mothers shared the same name.
This post was edited on 6/4/17 at 12:47 am
Posted on 6/4/17 at 12:56 am to RollTide1987
I grew up a huge DC comics fan. It really never occurred to me that Batman and Superman's mothers shared the same first name, although in retrospect I did know it the entire time upon hearing it. It was a great little coincidence that had never really been used to tie the characters together before. Where it got sloppy for me in the movie was Affleck's reaction. It was so bewildered, staggering, and violently over-acted. Batman's eyes would have narrowed and he would have given a hard 5 or 6 second stare...then get right in Superman's face and ask him why he said that name. The reaction really blew the whole trick for me. It takes you out of the narrative, just like when he had Jimmy Olsen executed and Superman pushed Batman about 40 yards after Batman replied "I understand" during their standoff.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 1:14 am to RollTide1987
I'm sorry, but if I were in the writers room when Snyder asked us why Batman wouldn't kill Superman, I would very sarcastically spit that off, knowing it was the single worst idea possible. I can't believe they went with it.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 1:19 am to RollTide1987
How long has this movie been out?
It's obvious that's what the intent was. Their moms having the same name is just low hanging fruit for making fun of a sloppy movie
It's obvious that's what the intent was. Their moms having the same name is just low hanging fruit for making fun of a sloppy movie
Posted on 6/4/17 at 1:27 am to Jor Jor The Dinosaur
I think most realized that's what they were trying to imply. The problem is the idea that Batman had never considered that before. He obviously knew that Superman had lived among people of Earth. It would have been news if he had done something to threaten Earth by that time. Also Batman became worried after watching him fight Zod yet the whole point is Superman was risking his own life to save Earth.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 7:41 am to RollTide1987
You are 100% correct (or rather, Cinemawins is).
The problem is that the execution was ham handed.
If BVS had a much better Luthor, no Doomsday and a happier Superman, it would have been a much better film
The problem is that the execution was ham handed.
If BVS had a much better Luthor, no Doomsday and a happier Superman, it would have been a much better film
Posted on 6/4/17 at 7:59 am to RollTide1987
Did they explain how the "master detective" fell for the hokey note that basically said "Superman is bad"?
Forget the details of the scene, because it was so asinine, but Batman, in this movie, is more gullible than a 2 year old.
Forget the details of the scene, because it was so asinine, but Batman, in this movie, is more gullible than a 2 year old.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 8:19 am to udtiger
BvS is one of the very, very few films that I literally turned off when attempting to watch. What I could get thru was god awful.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 8:20 am to RollTide1987
You wrote all that for one of the worst movies ever made?
Posted on 6/4/17 at 8:51 am to RollTide1987
I don't know what's worse, the fact that you like BvS, or the fact that you needed someone to explain to you that Batman didn't spare him solely because their mothers shared the same name
Posted on 6/4/17 at 12:35 pm to craigbiggio
quote:
I don't know what's worse, the fact that you like BvS, or the fact that you needed someone to explain to you that Batman didn't spare him solely because their mothers shared the same name
Posted on 6/4/17 at 3:23 pm to RollTide1987
First off, Batman shouldn't be trying to kill anyone. He's Batman. I don't care how you rationalize it, Batman isn't the Punisher.
Second, it's not that he called out for Batman to save his mom, it's that he used her first name. Why the frick would he do that? Who refers to their mother by their first name?
Third, IF Batman WAS a killer, and he was deadset on capping a fool, hearing his mom's name would not even slow him down. Batman is a very strong-willed individual, and when he sets his sights on accomplishing something he always gets it done. He would not have even blinked when he heard his mother's name come from Superman's mouth.
Second, it's not that he called out for Batman to save his mom, it's that he used her first name. Why the frick would he do that? Who refers to their mother by their first name?
Third, IF Batman WAS a killer, and he was deadset on capping a fool, hearing his mom's name would not even slow him down. Batman is a very strong-willed individual, and when he sets his sights on accomplishing something he always gets it done. He would not have even blinked when he heard his mother's name come from Superman's mouth.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 4:38 pm to RollTide1987
No message
This post was edited on 6/5/17 at 8:41 pm
Posted on 6/4/17 at 7:04 pm to RollTide1987
Tried to re-watch last night..
If they would have not rushed this and given each character another movie to hash out a better story before going toe to toe..
And if they would have given batfleck some time to show why he is an old pessimistic hero now..
And if.. and if.. and if..
This was just a poor excuse of rushing for money
If they would have not rushed this and given each character another movie to hash out a better story before going toe to toe..
And if they would have given batfleck some time to show why he is an old pessimistic hero now..
And if.. and if.. and if..
This was just a poor excuse of rushing for money
Posted on 6/4/17 at 7:12 pm to RollTide1987
quote:
But I think people may be hating it for the wrong reasons.
Superman is an invulnerable super hero with super strength, laser vision, xray vision, and super hearing.
Instead of just going and getting his mom, he goes and beats the ever living shite out of Batman and then trusts Batman to go save his mom for him instead of doing it himself.
Is that enough of a reason?
Posted on 6/4/17 at 9:05 pm to udtiger
If BVS had a much better Luthor, no Doomsday and a happier Superman, it would have been a much better film
Pretty much agree. I'm one of the biggest defenders of BvS on here (it has the best action/fight scenes of any comic superhero movie). In fact, it's one of my favorite in the genre for the dark tone, action scenes and WW's arrival. The two biggest changes I would have made were Luther (obviously) and get rid of a couple of the dream sequences.
Pretty much agree. I'm one of the biggest defenders of BvS on here (it has the best action/fight scenes of any comic superhero movie). In fact, it's one of my favorite in the genre for the dark tone, action scenes and WW's arrival. The two biggest changes I would have made were Luther (obviously) and get rid of a couple of the dream sequences.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 9:16 pm to SoFla Tideroller
quote:
it has the best action/fight scenes of any comic superhero movie
Well that's just wrong:
Winter Soldier Fight
Batman vs Bane
Spider-Man vs Doc Ock
Captain America and Winter Soldier vs Iron Man
And hell why not:
Superman vs Zod
Posted on 6/4/17 at 9:18 pm to flvelo12
quote:
BvS is one of the very, very few films that I literally turned off when attempting to watch. What I could get thru was god awful.
I tried watching it the other night. Holy cow what a shitshow. Even the opening credits looked like cheap made for TV. I felt like I had missed the first half hour. No narrative flow whatsoever. Just a series of scenes picked up off the cutting room floor and stitched together. I lasted about 15 minutes.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 10:12 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Well that's just wrong: Winter Soldier Fight Batman vs Bane Spider-Man vs Doc Ock Captain America and Winter Soldier vs Iron Man And hell why not: Superman vs Zod
Yeah, it was a decent fight scene but I found others much more entertaining... these.... if not for just the "dialogue" and sound effects alone.
Iron Man & Rhodey vs. Drones: "I think you should lead with that next time"
Rhodey vs. drunk Tony Stark: "Sorry pal...but Iron Man doesn't have a side-kick."
And as best action sequence(s) ever: The Avengers split team fight and Avengers in the battle of New York are both in a class of their own.
Posted on 6/4/17 at 10:41 pm to DelU249
quote:
You wrote all that for one of the worst movies ever made?
The OP is one of the most shameless apologists for the flaming bag of crap that's called the DCEU.
He's just starting to come out of his shell a little bit since they finally have something that's not terrible in Wonder Woman and he's peacocking like a motherfricker now.
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