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The infamous "Martha" scene in Batman v. Superman

Posted on 6/4/17 at 12:46 am
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65086 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 12:46 am
I'm gonna be the first to tell you that I was a fan of Batman v. Superman (especially when it comes to the Ultimate Edition), but even I will admit the execution of the "Martha" scene was fairly sub-par. But I think people may be hating it for the wrong reasons.

I came across CinemaWins's video concerning Batman v. Superman and his explanation for the Martha scene made me think about it in a new light. Essentially what he said was this:

Batman does not spare Superman because their mothers share the same name. Batman has spent 18 months obsessing over killing this alien who can destroy the Earth. It isn't until Superman uses the name that the alien becomes humanized. At first Batman becomes enraged because he thinks it's another trick. Once he realizes it's Clark's mom's name he starts to understand that maybe they're not so different. He never considered the evil alien had a human mother or let alone would be willing to die for her.

Bruce couldn't save his mother. No matter how many goons he brands, he was a helpless kid when she was killed just like Clark is now. He'll never be able to bring his Martha back. Now he has an opportunity for redemption. It literally has nothing to do with their mother's having the same name, that was just the spark (that you can see snapping Bruce out of his kill-rage) that showed him Superman wasn't pure evil. With potentially his last breath he asked his killer to save someone else.

It's the entire reason we were shown the murder of the Wayne's one more time.

Yeah, I agree the way they wrote it was hammy, but I disagree with the notion that Bruce decided to spare Clark simply because their mothers shared the same name.
This post was edited on 6/4/17 at 12:47 am
Posted by BigAppleTiger
New York City
Member since Dec 2008
10384 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 12:56 am to
I grew up a huge DC comics fan. It really never occurred to me that Batman and Superman's mothers shared the same first name, although in retrospect I did know it the entire time upon hearing it. It was a great little coincidence that had never really been used to tie the characters together before. Where it got sloppy for me in the movie was Affleck's reaction. It was so bewildered, staggering, and violently over-acted. Batman's eyes would have narrowed and he would have given a hard 5 or 6 second stare...then get right in Superman's face and ask him why he said that name. The reaction really blew the whole trick for me. It takes you out of the narrative, just like when he had Jimmy Olsen executed and Superman pushed Batman about 40 yards after Batman replied "I understand" during their standoff.
Posted by OMLandshark
Member since Apr 2009
108360 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 1:14 am to
I'm sorry, but if I were in the writers room when Snyder asked us why Batman wouldn't kill Superman, I would very sarcastically spit that off, knowing it was the single worst idea possible. I can't believe they went with it.
Posted by Jor Jor The Dinosaur
Chicago, IL
Member since Nov 2014
6579 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 1:19 am to
How long has this movie been out?

It's obvious that's what the intent was. Their moms having the same name is just low hanging fruit for making fun of a sloppy movie
Posted by bcoop199
Kansas City, MISSOURI
Member since Nov 2013
6667 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 1:27 am to
I think most realized that's what they were trying to imply. The problem is the idea that Batman had never considered that before. He obviously knew that Superman had lived among people of Earth. It would have been news if he had done something to threaten Earth by that time. Also Batman became worried after watching him fight Zod yet the whole point is Superman was risking his own life to save Earth.
Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
98782 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 7:41 am to
You are 100% correct (or rather, Cinemawins is).

The problem is that the execution was ham handed.

If BVS had a much better Luthor, no Doomsday and a happier Superman, it would have been a much better film
Posted by theunknownknight
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2005
57313 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 7:59 am to
Did they explain how the "master detective" fell for the hokey note that basically said "Superman is bad"?

Forget the details of the scene, because it was so asinine, but Batman, in this movie, is more gullible than a 2 year old.
Posted by flvelo12
Palm Harbor, Florida
Member since Jan 2012
3318 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 8:19 am to
BvS is one of the very, very few films that I literally turned off when attempting to watch. What I could get thru was god awful.
Posted by DelU249
Austria
Member since Dec 2010
77625 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 8:20 am to
You wrote all that for one of the worst movies ever made?
Posted by craigbiggio
Member since Dec 2009
31805 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 8:51 am to
I don't know what's worse, the fact that you like BvS, or the fact that you needed someone to explain to you that Batman didn't spare him solely because their mothers shared the same name
Posted by Carson123987
Middle Court at the Rec
Member since Jul 2011
66419 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 12:35 pm to
quote:

I don't know what's worse, the fact that you like BvS, or the fact that you needed someone to explain to you that Batman didn't spare him solely because their mothers shared the same name
Posted by Shiftyplus1
Regret nothing that made you smile
Member since Oct 2005
13348 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 3:23 pm to
First off, Batman shouldn't be trying to kill anyone. He's Batman. I don't care how you rationalize it, Batman isn't the Punisher.

Second, it's not that he called out for Batman to save his mom, it's that he used her first name. Why the frick would he do that? Who refers to their mother by their first name?

Third, IF Batman WAS a killer, and he was deadset on capping a fool, hearing his mom's name would not even slow him down. Batman is a very strong-willed individual, and when he sets his sights on accomplishing something he always gets it done. He would not have even blinked when he heard his mother's name come from Superman's mouth.
Posted by OMLandshark
Member since Apr 2009
108360 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 4:38 pm to
No message
This post was edited on 6/5/17 at 8:41 pm
Posted by vilma4prez
Lafayette, LA
Member since Jan 2009
6431 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 7:04 pm to
Tried to re-watch last night..
If they would have not rushed this and given each character another movie to hash out a better story before going toe to toe..
And if they would have given batfleck some time to show why he is an old pessimistic hero now..
And if.. and if.. and if..

This was just a poor excuse of rushing for money
Posted by Breesus
House of the Rising Sun
Member since Jan 2010
66982 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 7:12 pm to
quote:

But I think people may be hating it for the wrong reasons.



Superman is an invulnerable super hero with super strength, laser vision, xray vision, and super hearing.

Instead of just going and getting his mom, he goes and beats the ever living shite out of Batman and then trusts Batman to go save his mom for him instead of doing it himself.

Is that enough of a reason?
Posted by SoFla Tideroller
South Florida
Member since Apr 2010
30106 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 9:05 pm to
If BVS had a much better Luthor, no Doomsday and a happier Superman, it would have been a much better film

Pretty much agree. I'm one of the biggest defenders of BvS on here (it has the best action/fight scenes of any comic superhero movie). In fact, it's one of my favorite in the genre for the dark tone, action scenes and WW's arrival. The two biggest changes I would have made were Luther (obviously) and get rid of a couple of the dream sequences.
Posted by OMLandshark
Member since Apr 2009
108360 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 9:16 pm to
quote:

it has the best action/fight scenes of any comic superhero movie


Well that's just wrong:

Winter Soldier Fight
Batman vs Bane
Spider-Man vs Doc Ock
Captain America and Winter Soldier vs Iron Man

And hell why not:

Superman vs Zod
Posted by Speedy G
Member since Aug 2013
3900 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 9:18 pm to
quote:

BvS is one of the very, very few films that I literally turned off when attempting to watch. What I could get thru was god awful.

I tried watching it the other night. Holy cow what a shitshow. Even the opening credits looked like cheap made for TV. I felt like I had missed the first half hour. No narrative flow whatsoever. Just a series of scenes picked up off the cutting room floor and stitched together. I lasted about 15 minutes.
Posted by TurkeysAndBees
Member since Jan 2017
651 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 10:12 pm to
quote:

Well that's just wrong: Winter Soldier Fight Batman vs Bane Spider-Man vs Doc Ock Captain America and Winter Soldier vs Iron Man And hell why not: Superman vs Zod



Yeah, it was a decent fight scene but I found others much more entertaining... these.... if not for just the "dialogue" and sound effects alone.

Iron Man & Rhodey vs. Drones: "I think you should lead with that next time"

Rhodey vs. drunk Tony Stark: "Sorry pal...but Iron Man doesn't have a side-kick."

And as best action sequence(s) ever: The Avengers split team fight and Avengers in the battle of New York are both in a class of their own.
Posted by Sentrius
Fort Rozz
Member since Jun 2011
64757 posts
Posted on 6/4/17 at 10:41 pm to
quote:

You wrote all that for one of the worst movies ever made?



The OP is one of the most shameless apologists for the flaming bag of crap that's called the DCEU.

He's just starting to come out of his shell a little bit since they finally have something that's not terrible in Wonder Woman and he's peacocking like a motherfricker now.
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