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Where to invest for income

Posted on 1/30/16 at 1:49 pm
Posted by oldtimefootball
Winnfield La
Member since Feb 2013
434 posts
Posted on 1/30/16 at 1:49 pm
I have $475,000 in a 5 year CD with 4 years to maturity. It earns 2.25% annually. The penalty for early withdrawal is 2 quarters of interest. I would like to have more income off of this amount of money. I have been waiting for interest rates on tax
free municipal bonds to go up but it looks like that might not happen anytime soon. What do you smart investors suggest? I can't afford much risk. Is there anything better than what I have now?
Posted by ell_13
Member since Apr 2013
85067 posts
Posted on 1/30/16 at 2:37 pm to
quote:

I can't afford much risk. Is there anything better than what I have now?
Define "much risk".
Posted by makersmark1
earth
Member since Oct 2011
15892 posts
Posted on 1/30/16 at 2:43 pm to
quote:

I can't afford much risk. Is there anything better than what I have now?


There is no free lunch.

Depending on your risk tolerance, you might consider putting some of the cash in blue chip stocks that have a history of increasing dividends. However, even the best stocks go up and down 30-50% in a 3 year period.
Posted by SonofDye
Jawga
Member since Jan 2015
1709 posts
Posted on 1/30/16 at 3:14 pm to
Head to the casino and put it all on 00. One way or the other you won't be worrying about risk and interest anymore.
Posted by SmackoverHawg
Member since Oct 2011
27350 posts
Posted on 1/30/16 at 3:34 pm to
quote:

I have $475,000 in a 5 year CD with 4 years to maturity. It earns 2.25% annually. The penalty for early withdrawal is 2 quarters of interest. I would like to have more income off of this amount of money. I have been waiting for interest rates on tax free municipal bonds to go up but it looks like that might not happen anytime soon. What do you smart investors suggest? I can't afford much risk. Is there anything better than what I have now?


Or if you don't have to touch the principle for awhile, look at some solid dividend paying stocks.
Just depends. Can get income from rental properties, but may be some expenses to be incurred if you can't do routine maintenance yourself. Not to mention pain in arse. If you don't overpay for the properties, you get to depreciate them even if they gain value with time. Not hard to beat 2.25% especially after you pay income tax on it. Could look at tax free muni's and compare your after tax return against what you'd get.
This post was edited on 1/30/16 at 4:46 pm
Posted by Fat Bastard
coach, investor, gambler
Member since Mar 2009
72734 posts
Posted on 1/30/16 at 10:51 pm to
That's a terrible rate of return. Two rental properties can give you that amount in dollars annually that you're getting off almost half a million dollars.

Buy turn key real estate if you don't want to manage.
Posted by Shepherd88
Member since Dec 2013
4590 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 8:07 am to
Investing in CD's for the long term is a lot like going too slow in the fast lane, it's just as risky.
Posted by WiscyTiger
Bear Lake, WI
Member since Nov 2008
1415 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 8:35 am to
quote:

5 year CD


FDIC insurance only covers $250K, if it's only with one bank. Go to a certified financial planner. You can spread it around in different stuff so you don't risk the whole thing in one investment.

Some examples are (other than dividend paying stocks): mutual funds, real estate income trusts, business development companies. A combination of all those things plus whatever else your CFP knows about would be best.

CDs don't make enough right now to make it worth keeping them. Neither do municipal bonds.
Posted by white perch
the bright, happy side of hell
Member since Apr 2012
7138 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 10:35 am to
The biggest question we need to know is do you need to principle amount ($475000) for anything?
Posted by OceanMan
Member since Mar 2010
20027 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 10:43 am to
quote:

If you don't overpay for the properties, you get to depreciate them even if they gain value with time.


What does this mean?
Posted by SmackoverHawg
Member since Oct 2011
27350 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 10:55 am to
quote:

What does this mean?




Poorly written sentence. Regardless of the price you pay, you can depreciate the properties. And they can appreciate in real value. For instance, I bought one a few years back and have made little improvements here and there over the years. I got it when the market crashed so it is worth far more than it was then, but since it is a rental/income property, you can depreciate some of the value each year just like other commercial properties. I'm no expert on it by any means. But many of those improvements can be written off as repairs and immediately deducted. Meanwhile, your property goes up in value. I only have a couple of properties and am trying to learn more about it. But a good rental property will preserve your principle, grow in value, and produce income. Not to mention other ways to run certain expenses through there that can help your tax bill. There are others on here much more educated in this area, but that's where I would start if you can find a good property...that's the hard part.

Posted by Porker Face
Eden Isle
Member since Feb 2012
15346 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 12:20 pm to
SDIV
Posted by white perch
the bright, happy side of hell
Member since Apr 2012
7138 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 1:29 pm to
$100000 XOM
$100000 COP
$100000 RDS.B

$175000 rental home
Posted by oldtimefootball
Winnfield La
Member since Feb 2013
434 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 7:04 pm to
Too old (81) to manage real property. Too old to try to recover from risky investment losses - not enough time left. I don't trust CFP's. We (my wife and I) have a recently widowed friend who told me she was being charged $500.00 per month in management fees by her CFP.

Our CD is in both names in JROS so we have full $500K FDIC protection. We absolutely have to invest in something that has as little risk as possible.

So, considering the volatility of stocks currently,
would stocks from financially strong companies that have dividend yields greater than 2.25% be a viable option?

I appreciate serious responses because we really could use more income. We are savers, not spenders, so the current fiscal policy of the Federal Reserve of holding interest rates down to benefit spenders really ticks me off.















Posted by WiscyTiger
Bear Lake, WI
Member since Nov 2008
1415 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 7:34 pm to
quote:

being charged $500.00 per month in management fees by her CFP.




I would check around with different ones and get pricing like with anything else. Don't pick one that charges a monthly fee! Mine charges $200 per hour (and nothing when I don't use him), but I usually don't have to pay as I've got several things with him. I don't trust stock brokers or bank financial advisers as they are trying to make money off commissions. Make sure your CFP has fraud protection (SIPC).

To answer your question about what kind of interest stuff pays, here is some stuff I have (some through a CFP, some though my bank, some I trade by myself on TD Ameritrade):

Mutual Funds: about 3.5% (through my bank).

REITs: about 6-7% (WPC, Lightstone, Inland).

BDCs: about 7-11% (FSIC 11%, Corp. Capital Trust 7%).

Dividend paying stocks:

COP: 7.5%

I would say $200 for an hour of time is money well spent to come up with a plan. You can lose big if you buy stuff without researching first and getting good advice. Good luck

ETA: a good first step may be to go through your bank for a financial adviser. They won't charge you for an initial consult and you can ask what mutual funds pay. I wouldn't put more than 1/4th of your investments in these however, as they don't pay that well (but pay better than CDs or municipal bonds).

This post was edited on 1/31/16 at 7:51 pm
Posted by Fat Bastard
coach, investor, gambler
Member since Mar 2009
72734 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 7:44 pm to
quote:

oo old (81) to manage real property.


you don't have to manage. I said this above.
Posted by WiscyTiger
Bear Lake, WI
Member since Nov 2008
1415 posts
Posted on 1/31/16 at 7:56 pm to
quote:

you don't have to manage


I have a property manager for a rental house and this is true... but yes buying real estate can be too much to deal with for some people. Also I don't like having to deal with repairs, tenant problems, etc. (rental company deals with it but they still ask me whenever something comes up and to pay for whatever is needed). Rental income vs. money spent on investment is good however.
Posted by Jag_Warrior
Virginia
Member since May 2015
4112 posts
Posted on 2/1/16 at 12:19 pm to
Personally, at your age, I would stay away from putting too much into equities at this point, just to capture a dividend. I mean, you said you were looking to avoid risk/loss of capital. And while that means different things to different people (the relative risk level, I mean), maybe debt is something that would fit the bill better for you. MAYBE.

I'll toss an idea out that I'm looking at for yield/income. I'm looking at senior, medium term debt (bonds) on larger cap oil companies that have reasonably healthy balance sheets - but they've been beaten down in price. I don't know where the economy, interest rates, the stock market or the price of oil are going to be over the medium term. But I do know that firms will pay their interest obligations on senior debt before they'll pay dividends, if it comes down to that. Even if rates go up and the price of the bonds continues to fall, that's no different than the real value of your CDs being lower if rates rise, if you could sell them before maturity. But by staying with bonds that I'll hold to maturity (just like your CDs), I'll get the face value at maturity. If I pay less than face value now, then all the better.

The trick is to choose carefully (I don't want any speculative dogs that are already gasping for air) and I'm enlisting an adviser to help with this. I'm not going to plow all of my cash into this strategy, but I'll probably put 15-20% of my cash toward this. Then when I'm paid off in 4 or 5 years, I'll see what the landscape looks like then.

BTW, I'm also a great believer in real estate as a great creator of wealth and income. It's been the single best investment vehicle over the course of my life. But I fully understand your point. Most of my properties are several hours away from where I live now and they're all under management. But even then, there have been times when I've had to step in to address management issues. In the worst case, several apartments (that I never had a problem renting) kept getting reported as vacant. I found out that the manager, who I'd known for years and trusted, was skimming the money. I was in my 30's back then and at 6'3", still looked like I ate steroids for breakfast. After a surprise visit, that involved me taking two days off from work and making a longish drive, I told the manager about the corrective actions that I was considering, ranging from legal action and going after his license to "other things"... he decided to write me a rather large check and sign off on a contract cancellation. I didn't file legal action but I did have to hire a new manager... who got to hear how the last character was dealt with. She did OK, but I've had two more managers since her (people retire, move, die, etc.). Would I be in the mood to drive three hours and try to pull the Don Vito Corleone tough guy routine now? No. Would I want to do it at 80? Hell no! It wouldn't work anyway. So maybe the risk/reward of a sizable rental real estate investment isn't there for you. I don't have children to help me (having a sociopathic kid named Michael might be handy), so I'll probably sell out within the next ten years. I won't want the hassle either. But it has been a good ride.

So much for my "cool story, bro" diatribe. So anyway, maybe think about that bond/senior debt idea and tell me what you think. I'd like to hear from others who are thinking about income investments now too. What are your thoughts on looking at medium term senior debt in this environment?
Posted by VABuckeye
Naples, FL
Member since Dec 2007
35570 posts
Posted on 2/1/16 at 12:24 pm to
At 81 I'd be more concerned with enjoying what I have rather than growing income. Investing means risk and loss could be catastrophic financially at your age.
Posted by foshizzle
Washington DC metro
Member since Mar 2008
40599 posts
Posted on 2/1/16 at 12:46 pm to
Keep in mind also that munis as an asset class aren't as safe as they traditionally were. Some are still okay but others have been bitten by the underfunded pension bug.
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