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Message
How did monetary policy work before the Federal Reserve?
Posted on 5/15/17 at 11:59 am
Posted on 5/15/17 at 11:59 am
As you know, there is lots of talk on the libertarian side about doing away with the Federal Reserve.
Can someone who is well versed in the history and inner workings of the Center Bank (LSURussian et al.) tell me how the US government implemented monetary policy and controlled inflation before the Federal Reserve was formed?
Hypothetically, if we did away with the Federal Reserve, can the US Government go back to the previous setup without a Central Bank and still be able to do the things they do currently in terms of monetary policy given the presumably more complex modern economy?
Can someone who is well versed in the history and inner workings of the Center Bank (LSURussian et al.) tell me how the US government implemented monetary policy and controlled inflation before the Federal Reserve was formed?
Hypothetically, if we did away with the Federal Reserve, can the US Government go back to the previous setup without a Central Bank and still be able to do the things they do currently in terms of monetary policy given the presumably more complex modern economy?
Posted on 5/15/17 at 12:45 pm to Street Hawk
This is the 3rd iteration of an american central bank.
controlled inflation is stealth taxation.
controlled inflation is stealth taxation.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 12:57 pm to autodd03
quote:
controlled inflation is stealth taxation
My man. So true
Posted on 5/15/17 at 1:19 pm to Street Hawk
You had rich dudes like J.P. Morgan bailing out the government.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 1:22 pm to Street Hawk
In before LSURussian states that the Federal Reserve will save us from ourselves.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 1:47 pm to Street Hawk
quote:Say goodbye to whatever senator, congressman or president that tries that.
As you know, there is lots of talk on the libertarian side about doing away with the Federal Reserve.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 3:25 pm to autodd03
quote:
controlled inflation is stealth taxation.
Thoughts on uncontrolled deflation?
This post was edited on 5/15/17 at 3:25 pm
Posted on 5/15/17 at 3:43 pm to Lou Pai
I have some thoughts on it, but you didn't ask me, so I'll let the other guy answer. But generally I'm not opposed to uncontrolled deflation, or inflation. Let the strongest, wisest, and most nimble survive. Let everyone else fend for themselves. As was intended. And later bastardized. No one bailed me out when I got in over my head in South Florida real estate. And I did the right thing. And I survived, and even thrived. I get tired of so called free market people defending government intervention at every level. There are bankruptcy laws. Several varieties. Some more unethical and immoral than others. Let people and entities sink and rise to their own level of equilibrium. And depending on whether they worship government, science or God, they can answer for their own decisions at some point, to whomever is their to answer to.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 4:07 pm to Iowa Golfer
You're free market? Do you believe the US should have a mint?
Posted on 5/15/17 at 4:17 pm to Lou Pai
Are you asking me if we should do away with coinage? I had thought there was some recent legislation introduced to do away with pennies. I had also thought it was fairly expensive to do so. I honestly didn't pay a lot of attention. I'm not sure what my position on US coinage has to do with the topic? Eventually this is going to happen.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 6:34 pm to Iowa Golfer
Well you made the insinuation that being oriented toward pro-free market implies that one doesn't want any type of centralized authority or intervention. Why not have competing currencies and let it all play out?
Posted on 5/15/17 at 6:58 pm to Lou Pai
It somewhat worked when we did that before I beleive.
So I'm assuming your previous reference to coinage has now morphed into centralized authority or intervention?
I think we do have competing currencies currently. Not to the point you suggest, which is of course a pretty drastic measure. But we we could get to point by unwinding some things, and it would take some time.
There would be some chaos. Some would profit from this. I don't have a problem giving it a go. It would be fun.
So I'm assuming your previous reference to coinage has now morphed into centralized authority or intervention?
I think we do have competing currencies currently. Not to the point you suggest, which is of course a pretty drastic measure. But we we could get to point by unwinding some things, and it would take some time.
There would be some chaos. Some would profit from this. I don't have a problem giving it a go. It would be fun.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 7:48 pm to Street Hawk
A number of different ways.
(For what it's worth, we had a thread a couple of weeks ago on the PT Board where I posted some thoughts on the last couple of pages related to my preference for classical 19th century monetary policy in the U.S. But that only referenced the previous era of monetary policy obliquely, so...)
Before the 2nd Bank of the United States (BUS), I'd say that the USA barely even had a monetary policy, other than to authorize coinage backed by gold and silver. The American colonies used money that was mostly backed by hard-money foreign coins (such as the Germanic thaler or the Spanish piece-of-eight), and the post-Revolution USA coined its own money, but stuck to hard money. The 1st BUS (1791-1811) was mostly just a government subsidy for commercial loans to industry, rather than being what we would think of as a modern central bank.
From Jackson's Specie Circular EO in 1836 to the passage of the Gold Standard Act in 1900 under McKinley, there were quite a lot of dramatic political battles in the U.S. over monetary policy, mostly related to the complicated and confusing topic of "bimetallism."
Of course Jackson famously had a bitter conflict with the 2nd BUS, and the resulting attacks on the bank led to a monetary panic in 1837, and a deflationary monetary "depression" that lasted until 1844. In one of the fascinating little side notes of American history, William Henry Harrison kept strictly silent on the heated issue of bimetallism during the 1840 campaign (playing it safe, because the Whigs knew they would win), and he seemed to reference a definite hostility to hard money policy in his inaugural address (which also includes an approving nod to the spirit of Helvetic Confederacy):
But then he caught pneumonia and died 31 days into his term. And the U.S. pretty much kept on a hard gold standard path until 1933, albeit with some occasional flare-ups with legislation favoring silver. There were events like the (then) unprecedented step of Lincoln & Chase to issue the greenback in 1862 (legal tender paper totally unbacked by silver or gold), but that was more of a war-time, temporary-redeemability-restriction type of event rather than a solid break.
You can check out "primers" like this one from FEE, but probably the best starting point to study the monetary policy battles of the 19th century would be with the Coinage Act of 1873, consistently referred to as the "Crime of '73" by Silverite Progressives like William Jennings Bryan. The Bland-Allison Act in 1878 was a near turning point for the silverites who advocated bimetallism, but the gold standard still narrowly held the day, and become solidly entrenched in 1900.
The Federal Reserve from 1913-1933 was still operating on a strong gold standard, and so was not really the same thing as the Fed from 1933-1971 or 1971-present, but it did pursue its own monetary policy to maintain proper balance (in its view) between interest rates and gold reserves (albeit in a somewhat haphazard and uncoordinated manner).
Before 1913, monetary policy was mostly just a matter of letting prices spike during war-time (with prices sharply correcting a year or two after), and letting general deflation take hold due to hard money policy over the longer term. After 1913, monetary policy became more inflationary, and indeed the Bureau of Labor did not even track consumer prices before then.
Of course I'm leaving out a bunch of stuff about banking regulation and federal and state charters, and the regulation of bank notes and other forms of paper money, but I just wanted to give a brief outline of the core, "hard money" monetary policy stuff.
P.S. -- If 90proof is reading, I came across an interesting article published last Friday by the long-winded Jeffrey Snider, who made arguments somewhat related to my references to the neo-Fisherites of the present day.
(For what it's worth, we had a thread a couple of weeks ago on the PT Board where I posted some thoughts on the last couple of pages related to my preference for classical 19th century monetary policy in the U.S. But that only referenced the previous era of monetary policy obliquely, so...)
Before the 2nd Bank of the United States (BUS), I'd say that the USA barely even had a monetary policy, other than to authorize coinage backed by gold and silver. The American colonies used money that was mostly backed by hard-money foreign coins (such as the Germanic thaler or the Spanish piece-of-eight), and the post-Revolution USA coined its own money, but stuck to hard money. The 1st BUS (1791-1811) was mostly just a government subsidy for commercial loans to industry, rather than being what we would think of as a modern central bank.
From Jackson's Specie Circular EO in 1836 to the passage of the Gold Standard Act in 1900 under McKinley, there were quite a lot of dramatic political battles in the U.S. over monetary policy, mostly related to the complicated and confusing topic of "bimetallism."
Of course Jackson famously had a bitter conflict with the 2nd BUS, and the resulting attacks on the bank led to a monetary panic in 1837, and a deflationary monetary "depression" that lasted until 1844. In one of the fascinating little side notes of American history, William Henry Harrison kept strictly silent on the heated issue of bimetallism during the 1840 campaign (playing it safe, because the Whigs knew they would win), and he seemed to reference a definite hostility to hard money policy in his inaugural address (which also includes an approving nod to the spirit of Helvetic Confederacy):
quote:
Connected with this subject is the character of the currency. The idea of making it exclusively metallic, however well intended, appears to me to be fraught with more fatal consequences than any other scheme having no relation to the personal rights of the citizens that has ever been devised. If any single scheme could produce the effect of arresting at once that mutation of condition by which thousands of our most indigent fellow-citizens by their industry and enterprise are raised to the possession of wealth, that is the one. If there is one measure better calculated than another to produce that state of things so much deprecated by all true republicans, by which the rich are daily adding to their hoards and the poor sinking deeper into penury, it is an exclusive metallic currency. Or if there is a process by which the character of the country for generosity and nobleness of feeling may be destroyed by the great increase and neck toleration of usury, it is an exclusive metallic currency.
But then he caught pneumonia and died 31 days into his term. And the U.S. pretty much kept on a hard gold standard path until 1933, albeit with some occasional flare-ups with legislation favoring silver. There were events like the (then) unprecedented step of Lincoln & Chase to issue the greenback in 1862 (legal tender paper totally unbacked by silver or gold), but that was more of a war-time, temporary-redeemability-restriction type of event rather than a solid break.
You can check out "primers" like this one from FEE, but probably the best starting point to study the monetary policy battles of the 19th century would be with the Coinage Act of 1873, consistently referred to as the "Crime of '73" by Silverite Progressives like William Jennings Bryan. The Bland-Allison Act in 1878 was a near turning point for the silverites who advocated bimetallism, but the gold standard still narrowly held the day, and become solidly entrenched in 1900.
The Federal Reserve from 1913-1933 was still operating on a strong gold standard, and so was not really the same thing as the Fed from 1933-1971 or 1971-present, but it did pursue its own monetary policy to maintain proper balance (in its view) between interest rates and gold reserves (albeit in a somewhat haphazard and uncoordinated manner).
Before 1913, monetary policy was mostly just a matter of letting prices spike during war-time (with prices sharply correcting a year or two after), and letting general deflation take hold due to hard money policy over the longer term. After 1913, monetary policy became more inflationary, and indeed the Bureau of Labor did not even track consumer prices before then.
Of course I'm leaving out a bunch of stuff about banking regulation and federal and state charters, and the regulation of bank notes and other forms of paper money, but I just wanted to give a brief outline of the core, "hard money" monetary policy stuff.
P.S. -- If 90proof is reading, I came across an interesting article published last Friday by the long-winded Jeffrey Snider, who made arguments somewhat related to my references to the neo-Fisherites of the present day.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 9:10 pm to Street Hawk
I would encourage you to read books on the Federal Reserve or find some YouTube videos.
It is no question that the Fed is the worst part of our economy.
The Fed came in existence in the early 1900s (1913) and they came as independent to the government.
They came to be the largest central bank in our country and globally.
It's too much to get in on here, but I believe our economy would be better if 3 things happened:
1) Privatize Banking
2) Link our currency to gold again
3) End The Federal Reserve.
YouTube can share a lot.,,
It is no question that the Fed is the worst part of our economy.
The Fed came in existence in the early 1900s (1913) and they came as independent to the government.
They came to be the largest central bank in our country and globally.
It's too much to get in on here, but I believe our economy would be better if 3 things happened:
1) Privatize Banking
2) Link our currency to gold again
3) End The Federal Reserve.
YouTube can share a lot.,,
Posted on 5/15/17 at 9:13 pm to Street Hawk
This post was edited on 5/15/17 at 9:15 pm
Posted on 5/16/17 at 6:08 am to Street Hawk
Before the Federal Reserve, or before the gold standard?
BTW, those of you who believe inflation is a tax don't quite understand what's going on. Inflation is only a tax if you hoard money. If you invest it then you shouldn't care so much. That's precisely the argument for having a low and reasonably predictable inflation rate - it keeps people from taking their cash out of the money supply. This stimulates the economy.
BTW, those of you who believe inflation is a tax don't quite understand what's going on. Inflation is only a tax if you hoard money. If you invest it then you shouldn't care so much. That's precisely the argument for having a low and reasonably predictable inflation rate - it keeps people from taking their cash out of the money supply. This stimulates the economy.
Posted on 5/16/17 at 10:56 pm to Doc Fenton
quote:
Doc Fenton
Great post. I have seen your commentary here before and have enjoyed them. Are you an economist or some kind of economics teacher, because you sure sound like one.
Do you have any thoughts on the effect on the economy and inflation if the government did away with the Fed?
Posted on 5/17/17 at 8:48 am to Street Hawk
quote:
there is lots of talk on the libertarian side about doing away with the Federal Reserve.
People often conflate identifying a problem with identifying the solution. Unfortunately, longstanding and unsustainable excesses permeate the global economy. This won't be resolved by human planning, but by forces that can best be described as Mother Nature.
Posted on 5/17/17 at 10:23 am to Lou Pai
quote:
Thoughts on uncontrolled deflation
price of inputs going down?
or purchasing power of existing money increasing?
how do you interpret it?
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