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85 or 125 as roster limit?
Posted on 1/13/24 at 1:59 pm
Posted on 1/13/24 at 1:59 pm
Everyone keeps quoting the 85 scholarship limit but does it even matter anymore?
In the age of NIL can't they just work around this and focus on the 125 cap? Just tack on extra NIL to cover tuition etc.
Hell set up scholarship fund Called 5stars In Need if you want the scholarship angle.
Is there wording in the actual rules that prevent this?
In the age of NIL can't they just work around this and focus on the 125 cap? Just tack on extra NIL to cover tuition etc.
Hell set up scholarship fund Called 5stars In Need if you want the scholarship angle.
Is there wording in the actual rules that prevent this?
12
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:04 pm to SpartanSoul
you have to have 85 at the start of training camp. I wish we could post a thread with ubiquitous dumb questions and answers
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:12 pm to geauxnavybeatbama
quote:
you have to have 85 at the start of training camp. I wish we could post a thread with ubiquitous dumb questions and answers
It is not a ridiculous statement. What is to stop a school from bringing in a player and saying, "You won't be on scholarship, but your NIL will be ten times the scholarship amount."
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:13 pm to geauxnavybeatbama
quote:
you have to have 85 at the start of training camp. I wish we could post a thread with ubiquitous dumb questions and answers
85 scholarship players, correct?
I'm saying just have all of the other players you want covered by NIL. Why can't the rest be well compensated walk-ons?
Are you saying the 85 limit counts walk-ons too?
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:15 pm to geauxnavybeatbama
quote:
I wish we could post a thread with ubiquitous dumb questions and answers
A) You actually can post that thread. Nobody is stopping you.
B) Why not answer the guys question instead of being a dick?
ETA: I was wondering the same thing about walk-ons. What's stopping schools from having as many NIL paid walk-ons as they want? Jeez I don't even recognize college football anymore.
This post was edited on 1/13/24 at 2:19 pm
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:16 pm to Locoguan0
quote:
It is not a ridiculous statement. What is to stop a school from bringing in a player and saying, "You won't be on scholarship, but your NIL will be ten times the scholarship amount."
Exactly.
And the scholarship limit is 85. There can be more than 85 players receiving scholarships since the scholarships can be split up.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:18 pm to geauxnavybeatbama
quote:It's actually a pretty good question.
you have to have 85 at the start of training camp. I wish we could post a thread with ubiquitous dumb questions and answers
It asks whether LSU can avoid the 85 scholarship limit issue by giving NIL money to athletes in lieu of scholarships.
I know the NCAA counts any football athlete that receives scholarship money or tuition assistance from the school in the 85-scholarship athlete limit. Bear Bryant was prohibited from giving tennis scholarships to football players.
I don't recall if the NCAA counts outside money (non-school sourced funds) that pays tuition in calculating the 85-scholarship athlete limit.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:20 pm to SpartanSoul
quote:
And the scholarship limit is 85. There can be more than 85 players receiving scholarships since the scholarships can be split up.
nope, not in football.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:22 pm to Salviati
quote:
I don't recall if the NCAA counts outside money (non-school sourced funds) that pays tuition in calculating the 85-scholarship athlete limit.
It would seem that the NIL ruling would mean that the NCAA couldn't do anything about it except piss and moan.
That's why I was asking if there was something buried in the rules. I don't think there is.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:24 pm to Curtis Lowe
quote:
nope, not in football.
I stand corrected. It seems the FCS schools can but not FBS.
This post was edited on 1/13/24 at 2:49 pm
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:26 pm to SpartanSoul
quote:I would agree with you except that I doubt the OP is the first time anyone thought of it. Not to say that your not a very bright person, but there are a lot of folks at every football program bound by the limit that would have incredible incentives to not be bound by it. In other words, hard to believer that no one else has ever thought of it.
It would seem that the NIL ruling would mean that the NCAA couldn't do anything about it except piss and moan.
That's why I was asking if there was something buried in the rules. I don't think there is.
This post was edited on 1/13/24 at 2:28 pm
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:31 pm to SpartanSoul
quote:
And the scholarship limit is 85. There can be more than 85 players receiving scholarships since the scholarships can be split up.
I know that is done in other sports but I dont know if that is football legal. A lot of these shenanigans were thougt up a long time ago by a man named Bear Bryant… now the football scholarship rules are much tighter and specific for football thanks to him. For instance if a player is on scholarship and they plan to play football they have to be on a full football scholly and are a full counter. Doesnt matter if they want to play basketball, baseball, tennis etc… I am not sure how that crosses over to academic scholarships but it must or that would be prevalent everywhere.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:32 pm to SpartanSoul
You can, but no player will actually do it.
I can imagine Caleb Williams didn’t need free tuition from USC last year, but he was on scholarship
I can imagine Caleb Williams didn’t need free tuition from USC last year, but he was on scholarship
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:33 pm to Salviati
quote:
I would agree with you except that I doubt the OP is the first time anyone thought of it. Not to say that your not a very bright person, but there are a lot of folks at every football program bound by the limit that would have incredible incentives to not be bound by it. In other words, hard to believer that no one else has never thought of it.
I'm sure people have; I'm just wondering what is actually stopping this from happening? Is there some actual rule?
How can the NCAA stop it when they basically have zero control over NIL. If the compensation is covered under NIL and not from the University then what mechanism would they use to regulate it within the confines of the NIL ruling?
I would think the NCAA would be scared shitless to have another lawsuit since they have so little power now and would be even more of a laughingstock losing another one.
Is is fear of backlash or the starting of a bidding war that would be worse than the NFL because you wouldn't even have long term contracts and no salary cap.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:33 pm to Salviati
“I don't recall if the NCAA counts outside money (non-school sourced funds) that pays tuition in calculating the 85-scholarship athlete limit.”
I think this is unprecedented. Outside money use to be against the rules.
So yes, in theory why couldn’t a player be a walk-on that’s paid more than enough to buy the same benefits as a scholarship player?
I think this is unprecedented. Outside money use to be against the rules.
So yes, in theory why couldn’t a player be a walk-on that’s paid more than enough to buy the same benefits as a scholarship player?
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:39 pm to JimTiger72
quote:
You can, but no player will actually do it.
I can imagine Caleb Williams didn’t need free tuition from USC last year, but he was on scholarship
So you're telling me that a kid is going to pass up more NIL money if he's not on scholarship? I don't think so. Money trumps all. Especially with young athletes with superstar aspirations. And these wouldn't be the top recruits but mostly the fringe guys so your Caleb Williams analogy isn't valid.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 2:45 pm to SpartanSoul
I don't think a school wants to go that route. Sooner or later, word will come out that they were hoarding players not on scholarship. Having 85 players on scholarship is plenty, I just checked LSU's roster and it looks like they have 59 if I counted all the seniors leaving right. With 33 players coming in, with maybe 20 at most being early enrollees, they will be fine for spring in regards to numbers.
LINK /
LINK /
Posted on 1/13/24 at 3:10 pm to Toadfrggy82
quote:
Sooner or later, word will come out that they were hoarding players not on scholarship.
Who cares what other people think? Also, in terms of roster numbers, there is going to have to be a lot of people processed to make way for who we bring in. LSU needed to process about 4 guys more to hit 85. Every other person we sign between now and the start of fall camp will mean another person is going to be asked to leave.
Now a further thought is, would it be illegal for highly paid athletes to "give up" their scholarship? I don't know that the NCAA would have a legal argument against this. I do think scholarships will be a thing of the past at some point soon anyway.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 3:49 pm to Toadfrggy82
quote:
With 33 players coming in, with maybe 20 at most being early enrollees, they will be fine for spring in regards to numbers.
In a perfect world this would be correct and technically it is possible. However, all Srs haven't graduated meaning those that haven't are still on scholarship until May. Scholarships are 1 year.
As for the walk on thing, I'm sure there is something preventing it's widespread abuse. Otherwise it would be extremely common. However, it has been suggested some kids are paying out of pocket this semester due to numbers(Ausberry). Walk ons have their own rules that apply in terms of time and when eligible to receive a scholarship. IndianaTiger is the trusted rules guy around here.
Posted on 1/13/24 at 4:23 pm to lsufanva
Are there benefits other than money that walk-ons can’t receive by rule?
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