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Message
Why are umpires allowed to have their "own" strike zones?
Posted on 6/22/17 at 9:51 am
Posted on 6/22/17 at 9:51 am
I find in watching a lot of baseball that most umpires try to use the correct strike zone. But many times you will hear announcers remark that this umpire has a tight strike zone, this one an expanded strike zone, this one give outside pitches, this one likes low strikes, etc.
Another common observation by announcers is that they do not care so much about the strike zone as long as the umpire is consistent and calls strikes the same way for both teams. Why should we be okay with umps that regularly miss correct calls just because they miss it both ways?
I particularly do not care for the umpire that rewards a pitcher for "hitting his spot", something you frequently hear when a catcher sets up just off the plate and the pitcher makes a great pitch, right where he wanted, just outside the zone. How about rewarding the batter who has a great eye and chooses not to swing at a pitch just outside the strike zone that would likely result in a weak grounder?
I like the human element of umpiring and the mistakes they make are part of the game. There will always be close calls that could go either way.
What I do not like is whoever supervises the umpires to allow them to have reputations for a tight or loose strike zone. Umpires should be graded. If they are calling balls that miss the plate strikes consistently, they need to correct it or work first base. There should not be pitcher friendly or hitter friendly umps.
This is not to say an ump that misses a call here or there should be fired, we would not have human umps if that happened and complaining about close calls is part of the game. This is more directed at umps who intentionally expand or contract the strike zone.
I find many umpires more likely to give low strikes below the true zone than high strikes in the zone (Poche had a couple pitches high in the strike zone called balls). The zone first of all has to be over the plate. Then it has to be at the low zone the hollow of the knees and the upper zone midway between the top of the shoulders and the belt line, just under the armpits. Umps that create their own zones need doing other jobs.
(This post is not about the pitch that ended the LSU game last night. That was a close pitch I thought just missed the plate, but the only reason that call was a big deal was it happened on the last pitch. That pitch had been called a strike on both teams on and off during the game).
Another common observation by announcers is that they do not care so much about the strike zone as long as the umpire is consistent and calls strikes the same way for both teams. Why should we be okay with umps that regularly miss correct calls just because they miss it both ways?
I particularly do not care for the umpire that rewards a pitcher for "hitting his spot", something you frequently hear when a catcher sets up just off the plate and the pitcher makes a great pitch, right where he wanted, just outside the zone. How about rewarding the batter who has a great eye and chooses not to swing at a pitch just outside the strike zone that would likely result in a weak grounder?
I like the human element of umpiring and the mistakes they make are part of the game. There will always be close calls that could go either way.
What I do not like is whoever supervises the umpires to allow them to have reputations for a tight or loose strike zone. Umpires should be graded. If they are calling balls that miss the plate strikes consistently, they need to correct it or work first base. There should not be pitcher friendly or hitter friendly umps.
This is not to say an ump that misses a call here or there should be fired, we would not have human umps if that happened and complaining about close calls is part of the game. This is more directed at umps who intentionally expand or contract the strike zone.
I find many umpires more likely to give low strikes below the true zone than high strikes in the zone (Poche had a couple pitches high in the strike zone called balls). The zone first of all has to be over the plate. Then it has to be at the low zone the hollow of the knees and the upper zone midway between the top of the shoulders and the belt line, just under the armpits. Umps that create their own zones need doing other jobs.
(This post is not about the pitch that ended the LSU game last night. That was a close pitch I thought just missed the plate, but the only reason that call was a big deal was it happened on the last pitch. That pitch had been called a strike on both teams on and off during the game).
This post was edited on 6/22/17 at 10:02 am
21
Posted on 6/22/17 at 9:53 am to paper tiger
I'm not reading a word of what you posted
Just wanted to let you know that
Just wanted to let you know that
Posted on 6/22/17 at 9:55 am to paper tiger
You said the same things like 3 times baw.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 9:55 am to paper tiger
I didn't have the patience to read all of that, but I generally agree with the implications of your rhetorical question in the thread title.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 9:58 am to paper tiger
holy wall of text. I understood your entire argument from the title alone. I assume that because I didn't read it.
This post was edited on 6/22/17 at 10:00 am
Posted on 6/22/17 at 9:59 am to paper tiger
Because the Borg haven't assimilated us yet.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:01 am to paper tiger
I was going to read your post but I cant take you seriously with that much text.
To answer your question, the strike zone is subjective. Always has been, always will be. As long as they establish it early in a game and are consistent, players know it is their job to adjust.
To answer your question, the strike zone is subjective. Always has been, always will be. As long as they establish it early in a game and are consistent, players know it is their job to adjust.
This post was edited on 6/22/17 at 10:03 am
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:04 am to paper tiger
Cause that's the game of baseball. At your job, do you do things the exact same way as other employees. Odds are probably not, as long as it is correct and consistent.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:09 am to paper tiger
I've been wondering the same thing. There is a defined strike zone. Why each umpire gets to establish his own strike zone is beyond me.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:13 am to paper tiger
Not reading all that.
Last night's game is proof that the NCAA needs to go to electronic calling of balls and strikes.
Last night's game is proof that the NCAA needs to go to electronic calling of balls and strikes.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:15 am to paper tiger
Read about half of that before realizing you are crazy.
How can you expect a person to correctly call an imaginary box floating in 3 dimensional space while paying attention to a ball moving 90 mph??? They "have their own strike zone" due to the way they personally see the pitches. No two people are going to see them exactly the same. In terms of hitting the spots, they aren't "rewarding" a pitcher. It's just that when it's close, and a catcher doesn't have to move his mitt, it "sells" it as a strike more. It's just the human nature element. Hell, a catcher can frame up a ball off the plate to make it look like it was an inch or so closer than it was. Stuff is happening way to fast to see otherwise every single time.
How can you expect a person to correctly call an imaginary box floating in 3 dimensional space while paying attention to a ball moving 90 mph??? They "have their own strike zone" due to the way they personally see the pitches. No two people are going to see them exactly the same. In terms of hitting the spots, they aren't "rewarding" a pitcher. It's just that when it's close, and a catcher doesn't have to move his mitt, it "sells" it as a strike more. It's just the human nature element. Hell, a catcher can frame up a ball off the plate to make it look like it was an inch or so closer than it was. Stuff is happening way to fast to see otherwise every single time.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:18 am to paper tiger
Paper tiger ,I am shocked at the down voters . I don't like umps controlling the game ,I believe that a lot of tiger fans think that LSU gets a benefit by that lack of rule following ! Great post !
This post was edited on 6/22/17 at 10:19 am
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:20 am to paper tiger
Because different people perceive different things.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:44 am to paper tiger
Because baseball
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:48 am to paper tiger
quote:
Why should we be okay with umps that regularly miss correct calls just because they miss it both ways?
Sounds like another gripe because it's "not fair"
Personally, and I have seen 1000 plus games, it makes the game unique and interesting.
quote:
I like the human element of umpiring and the mistakes they make are part of the game. There will always be close calls that could go either way.
Don't they have instant replay?
Posted on 6/22/17 at 10:53 am to paper tiger
Because they're human.
It's just like some NBA officials tend to call games a bit tighter than others.
It's just like some NBA officials tend to call games a bit tighter than others.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 11:14 am to paper tiger
Actually, umpires are allowed to have their own eyes and their own minds.
At the edges of the plate, the difference between balls and strikes comes down to millimeters, with the ball moving 90 miles per hour, trailing in or out and up or down. Also the strike zone adjusts based upon the height of the batter, and is as deep as home plate, meaning that it involves three dimensional space. It ain't a two dimensional rectangle added to a TV screen shot.
What the OP is actually hot about is strike three, out three against Florida State. Watch the replay. That ball was cutting in toward the plate. From the TV angle you can't tell if it cut to the back portion of the plate. From the TV angle you can't accurately call balls and strikes on the outside of the plate. What you can see is that it was very close, close enough to defend the plate.
At the edges of the plate, the difference between balls and strikes comes down to millimeters, with the ball moving 90 miles per hour, trailing in or out and up or down. Also the strike zone adjusts based upon the height of the batter, and is as deep as home plate, meaning that it involves three dimensional space. It ain't a two dimensional rectangle added to a TV screen shot.
What the OP is actually hot about is strike three, out three against Florida State. Watch the replay. That ball was cutting in toward the plate. From the TV angle you can't tell if it cut to the back portion of the plate. From the TV angle you can't accurately call balls and strikes on the outside of the plate. What you can see is that it was very close, close enough to defend the plate.
This post was edited on 6/22/17 at 11:16 am
Posted on 6/22/17 at 11:18 am to paper tiger
A strike is perception Of the umpire. Other facts play in.
Cold, hot, long game, batter delaying (stepping in and out of box may aggravate umpire) this seemed to happen last night. Before that pitch the batter stepped out of the box twice. Ump immediately told batter to get back into box and lets go. Then called a possible ball a strike. Although a few pitches earlier he called borderline strikes balls. So it's all good
Here the ump seemed pissed that one:
Batter was delaying stepping in and out of box and playing games with the pitcher.
Batter clearly had no intention to swing and was playing games to draw a walk.
Cold, hot, long game, batter delaying (stepping in and out of box may aggravate umpire) this seemed to happen last night. Before that pitch the batter stepped out of the box twice. Ump immediately told batter to get back into box and lets go. Then called a possible ball a strike. Although a few pitches earlier he called borderline strikes balls. So it's all good
Here the ump seemed pissed that one:
Batter was delaying stepping in and out of box and playing games with the pitcher.
Batter clearly had no intention to swing and was playing games to draw a walk.
Posted on 6/22/17 at 11:22 am to paper tiger
quote:
Umps that create their own zones need doing other jobs
You need posting no more things.
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