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Started By
Message
We need another impact player
Posted on 1/17/17 at 9:18 am
Posted on 1/17/17 at 9:18 am
Looking through the list of past NBA champions, one prevailing similarity is that almost all of these teams had at least 2 impact players, meaning if your star player got hurt you had another guy on deck who could take over a game on a consistent basis. Even the best NBA players needed a partner to win a title.
When we originally tried to build the team around AD, we made the mistake of spending a ton of money on a bunch of role players with limited upside, none of whom would've been considered elite talent. While that team showed that it could win games when healthy, we saw that it reached it's peak as an 8 seed in the West. After we realized that we had maxed out the talent from that team, we were stuck and it has forced us in the position we're in now. It's obvious that AD needs a 2nd fiddle; one of my biggest complaints about his game is that I haven't seen him take over late in games. I don't know if it's the pressure or what, but we desperately need that 2nd guy who gives you a chance night in and night out to win the game by himself.
The main goal of this front office should be to find someone who either is, or has the potential to be, that kind of impact player in this league. Now obviously I'm just spouting out words and that's a pretty difficult task considering our cap situation and undesirable market. But if we can somehow find that guy it will make building a team a whole lot easier.
When we originally tried to build the team around AD, we made the mistake of spending a ton of money on a bunch of role players with limited upside, none of whom would've been considered elite talent. While that team showed that it could win games when healthy, we saw that it reached it's peak as an 8 seed in the West. After we realized that we had maxed out the talent from that team, we were stuck and it has forced us in the position we're in now. It's obvious that AD needs a 2nd fiddle; one of my biggest complaints about his game is that I haven't seen him take over late in games. I don't know if it's the pressure or what, but we desperately need that 2nd guy who gives you a chance night in and night out to win the game by himself.
The main goal of this front office should be to find someone who either is, or has the potential to be, that kind of impact player in this league. Now obviously I'm just spouting out words and that's a pretty difficult task considering our cap situation and undesirable market. But if we can somehow find that guy it will make building a team a whole lot easier.
5
Posted on 1/17/17 at 9:41 am to novowels
hes riding the frickin bench atm
Posted on 1/17/17 at 9:43 am to novowels
I think if you give Buddy 2 more seasons he can be that guy
Posted on 1/17/17 at 9:45 am to MrPel
But will Anthony Davis want to give Buddy 2 more seasons to become that guy?
Posted on 1/17/17 at 9:47 am to Peregrine Laziosi
quote:
But will Anthony Davis want to give Buddy 2 more seasons to become that guy?
Theres a lot of money that says yes, yes he will.
I'm the biggest Buddy fan out there, but I don't see him becoming that guy. He'll be a good starter, and a key guy, but not that guy that takes you to the next level.
This post was edited on 1/17/17 at 9:49 am
Posted on 1/17/17 at 9:56 am to TeddyPadillac
He's shown a lot of progress so far this year, but he's still got a long way to go before he gets to that level.
They really need to look at the rest of the season and figure out the best way to get that other guy. Whether it be getting into the top 10 in a stacked draft or working up some kind of trade package.
They really need to look at the rest of the season and figure out the best way to get that other guy. Whether it be getting into the top 10 in a stacked draft or working up some kind of trade package.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 10:04 am to Peregrine Laziosi
I don't think Buddy's development arc is the problem, the problem is they'd still need another scorer in part because Hill and Cunningham are so bad on offense. If either one of them were even Ariza level that would add about 5-6 more points per game. Hill/DC are averaging 7.7/8.1 points per 36, Ariza's career average is 13. Otto Porter Jr. is scoring 15 per 36 this season. James Ennis is only averaging 11.3 per 36 for the slow paced Grizz, but for the Pels last season it was 18.3.
They tried to get 2 way players this offseason, but having adequate efficiency doesn't make you good on offense. They are stuck with Hill so they probably need to find a at least an Ennis level player to replace Cunningham (Lance Stephenson?) If they pay Cunningham this offseason and double down on the corner boys this team is in trouble. And I think that's a real possibility because we have DC's Bird Rights and he's supposedly an Erman favorite.
They tried to get 2 way players this offseason, but having adequate efficiency doesn't make you good on offense. They are stuck with Hill so they probably need to find a at least an Ennis level player to replace Cunningham (Lance Stephenson?) If they pay Cunningham this offseason and double down on the corner boys this team is in trouble. And I think that's a real possibility because we have DC's Bird Rights and he's supposedly an Erman favorite.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 10:10 am to TigerinATL
This is the problem. We're once again talking about overpaying role players and trying to make pieces fit instead of focusing on the bigger issue of getting AD some legit help. Guys like Solomon Hill and Dante Cunningham are so irrelevant if you don't have your main foundation set.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 10:28 am to novowels
quote:
Guys like Solomon Hill and Dante Cunningham are so irrelevant if you don't have your main foundation set.
Solomon Hill's offensive flaws remind me a lot of Ariza's flaws when he was a Hornet, so I do have hope for him to improve. That being said, focusing on role players wouldn't have been a problem if they had picked the right role players. Keep the guy you just discovered in James Ennis, not the guy you wish you could have drafted 3 years ago in Hill. You've got more cap space and more offense with Ennis over Hill.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 10:35 am to novowels
If your main star is a guard, like say Harden or Westbrook, you don't necessarily need a 2nd superstar in order to at least be competitive.
But your star is a PF/C. He absolutely needs another star next to him because he doesn't control the ball.
Dell should have been acquiring assets in order to get that star via draft or trade. He didn't do it.
Buddy can be a really good player but he's not going to be a superstar.
But your star is a PF/C. He absolutely needs another star next to him because he doesn't control the ball.
Dell should have been acquiring assets in order to get that star via draft or trade. He didn't do it.
Buddy can be a really good player but he's not going to be a superstar.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 10:40 am to Fun Bunch
quote:
Dell should have been acquiring assets in order to get that star via draft or trade. He didn't do it.
This. Especially after realizing the initial team build wasn't going to work.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 10:54 am to Fun Bunch
quote:
But your star is a PF/C. He absolutely needs another star next to him because he doesn't control the ball.
What he does do is bend the defense even when he doesn't have the ball. We just don't have a guard that can take advantage of that. Holiday should be averaging close to 20 a game, not 14. Holiday took 2 more shots a game last year in fewer minutes, maybe they need to run him more with the bench unit. Get him a set amount of time each game where he can be the man on offense and maybe he'll be more aggressive at the end when we need someone besides AD to show up.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 10:59 am to TigerinATL
quote:I don't see Hill's offense as being close to what Ariza was with the Hornets (and Ariza was not very good).
Solomon Hill's offensive flaws remind me a lot of Ariza's flaws when he was a Hornet, so I do have hope for him to improve. That being said, focusing on role players wouldn't have been a problem if they had picked the right role players. Keep the guy you just discovered in James Ennis, not the guy you wish you could have drafted 3 years ago in Hill. You've got more cap space and more offense with Ennis over Hill.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 11:00 am to Fun Bunch
quote:A little too early to tell IMO. However, I can see him eventually becoming similar to a Klay Thompson-type player at some point if he reaches his potential.
Buddy can be a really good player but he's not going to be a superstar.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 11:00 am to TigerinATL
Retaining Holiday would be the biggest mistake this team will make if we choose to go that route. They need to tank hard and grab fultz or Smith Jr and go hard after Hayward. Holiday is not the answer especially in this market and the money he'll probably command will probably be a lot more than he's worth.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 11:04 am to TigerinATL
quote:
They are stuck with Hill so they probably need to find a at least an Ennis level player to replace Cunningham (Lance Stephenson?) If they pay Cunningham this offseason and double down on the corner boys this team is in trouble. And I think that's a real possibility because we have DC's Bird Rights and he's supposedly an Erman favorite.
to me, Hill and Cunningham are basically the same person, except one makes a lot more than they other.
It would be nice if Hill was worth a shite, and we could resign Cunningham to something reasonable.
I know we just signed him, but it would be great to get rid of Hill in a trade, get a scoring SF in FA or trade and resign Cunningham.
Porter is restricted free agent. I'm sure Washington wants to keep him, but at what price would they say "we'll stick with Oubre instead of paying Porter that". Porter has been playing really well this year.
The Nets have said they are listening for Rondae Hollis Jefferson trades. he's got two more years at under $2M/yr. He's nothing more than Hill, except more athletic. Terrible shooter still.
The Hawks are listening to Tim Hardaway Jr trades, who will be a restricted free agent as well. he's been shooting lights out recently. He's a 3 in a small ball lineup.
Tony Snell could be had from Milwauke, and will be a restricted free agent. Shoots well enough and is a good defender.
Justin Holiday will be a unrestricted free agent. Shoots well and a decent defender. will be cheap.
All of those guys would be better than Hill at this point. They are either better and will cost the same, or will be about the same and cost less.
I would say if we keep Hill then I don't want DC back, even though I like him.
I feel confident we will make little stupid moves, like letting Reke go, resigning Jrue to something stupid, resigning DC to too much, letting DMo walk, resigning Jones to something stupid, stretching Asik and tradeing away our 2nd round pick to get rid of Ajinca, resigning Galloway, and then we will likely have a small exception to sign one FA, which we will use on a center not worth a shite like Javele Magee or Withey.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 11:11 am to TeddyPadillac
All of those small moves does nothing for us. We would be sitting in the same position at the end of the day. This team needs a impact player who can close games and not be a liability at any end of the court. That's something Demos has been chasing since he got here and the closest player he's acquired that resembles that was Holiday and he's been a disappointment for the Pelicans.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 11:12 am to supe12sta12z
They need a more dominant force at PG to pair with AD. I don't know if it is the turf toe, too much deference to AD, or just his nature, but Jrue is just not aggressive enough. I have been a Jrue supporter, but I don't think we can win with him being the starting PG. I would like to keep him as a 6th man and bring him off the bench as a backup 1/2 for 25 minutes, but unfortunately I doubt he takes a contract commensurate with that role.
As others pointed out, playing DC and Solo together makes it incredibly difficult to put together even an average offense. If Hill can become a lot more aggressive gettign to the rim maybe it works or if they acquire a more aggressive PG. Otherwise they need to trade DC or let him walk.
ETA- They also need to start developing the young guys. Play Cheick and buddy big minutes. See what you have with D-Mo. Explore any and all trades wherein we receive picks. Give AD ample time to heal. Aim for a top 5 pick.
As others pointed out, playing DC and Solo together makes it incredibly difficult to put together even an average offense. If Hill can become a lot more aggressive gettign to the rim maybe it works or if they acquire a more aggressive PG. Otherwise they need to trade DC or let him walk.
ETA- They also need to start developing the young guys. Play Cheick and buddy big minutes. See what you have with D-Mo. Explore any and all trades wherein we receive picks. Give AD ample time to heal. Aim for a top 5 pick.
This post was edited on 1/17/17 at 11:16 am
Posted on 1/17/17 at 11:18 am to NOSHAU
quote:
I don't see Hill's offense as being close to what Ariza was with the Hornets
Hornet Ariza and Hill both got to the basket better than you'd think but it was always cringe worthy the moment they started the drive because they rarely finished well. Hornet Ariza took 3 3 pointers per game and hit at 31%. Hill is taking 2.8 per game and hitting at 32.7%. I don't know if Ariza has improved his driving any, but I do know he's become a good high volume 3 point shooter. If Hill can get to 6 3PA per game at 38% that's 4 more points per game from him and he's closer to what you need out of him.
This post was edited on 1/17/17 at 11:22 am
Posted on 1/17/17 at 11:20 am to NOFOX
quote:
They also need to start developing the young guys. Play Cheick and buddy big minutes. See what you have with D-Mo. Explore any and all trades wherein we receive picks. Give AD ample time to heal. Aim for a top 5 pick.
No chance this happens because the inmates are running the asylum.
Dell and Gentry desperately need to win enough, even if its a shitty 8 seed, to keep their jobs (honestly that might not even be true with as shitty as ownership is).
So they aren't going to tank or play young players that will develop for the next guys.
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