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Started By
Message
re: Baseball base running ruling: dropped 2nd strike/throw to first/steal
Posted on 4/25/16 at 2:51 pm to Coon
Posted on 4/25/16 at 2:51 pm to Coon
quote:
Was it handled correctly (E2, catcher should have been aware of the situation)? If not, what should the ruling have been.
Also, if the play stands, it would be a SB, not an E2. No different than if the runner took home on the throw back to the pitcher.
Unless the C overthrew 1B and the runner didn't break for home until then.
1
Posted on 4/25/16 at 2:52 pm to Coon
Sounds like a great trick play for coaches to use in high school lol.
Posted on 4/25/16 at 3:07 pm to LSUBoo
quote:
Unless the C overthrew 1B and the runner didn't break for home until then.
It wouldn't be an error to throw the ball to the wrong player/base?
Posted on 4/25/16 at 3:13 pm to KosmoCramer
quote:
It wouldn't be an error to throw the ball to the wrong player/base?
It's a mental mistake, but those don't go down as errors.
Posted on 4/25/16 at 3:29 pm to Coon
It's not interference of any kind. Nor is it an error. Just the opposing team being punished for not being aware of the situation.
This post was edited on 4/25/16 at 3:30 pm
Posted on 4/25/16 at 3:42 pm to ShaneTheLegLechler
quote:Except you're allowed to try to get to first if the catcher drops strike 3...
there should be where another strike is assessed (and you're out if it would be strike 3)
Posted on 4/25/16 at 3:42 pm to ShaneTheLegLechler
quote:Except you're allowed to try to get to first if the catcher drops strike 3...
there should be where another strike is assessed (and you're out if it would be strike 3)
Posted on 4/25/16 at 3:44 pm to Coon
I thought I remembered reading a rule about baserunners deceiving the defense? Not sure if that rule applies to a batter though.
Kind of like a little league kid playing SS yelling at a baserunner to RUN!! while he is holding the ball in his glove. I saw this in Little league once and the SS tagged the runner when he took off for 3rd. They called the baserunner out... haha.
Kind of like a little league kid playing SS yelling at a baserunner to RUN!! while he is holding the ball in his glove. I saw this in Little league once and the SS tagged the runner when he took off for 3rd. They called the baserunner out... haha.
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:30 pm to reggo75
quote:
I thought I remembered reading a rule about baserunners deceiving the defense? Not sure if that rule applies to a batter though.
There is one, and it doesn't apply to a batter, but it does set some precedence for the overall nature of the situation. A batter/runner definitely isn't allowed to intentionally interfere with a play in progress outside of their attempt to legally advance bases.
If I was umpiring I think I'd let the first one go and chalk it up to not knowing the count, but if a team started trying to use that as a strategy I'd tell the coach to knock it off or I was going to start calling them out.
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:36 pm to Coon
Correct call. Catcher has to know the count
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:37 pm to LSUBoo
quote:
If I was umpiring I think I'd let the first one go and chalk it up to not knowing the count, but if a team started trying to use that as a strategy I'd tell the coach to knock it off or I was going to start calling them out.
So would you call it dead ball and reset the runner at 3rd or allow the run to count?
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:38 pm to poochie
quote:
So would you call it dead ball and reset the runner at 3rd or allow the run to count?
I'd let it play out as they did, and the run would count and the batter would still be up with two strikes.
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:41 pm to Drewbie
quote:
Except you're allowed to try to get to first if the catcher drops strike 3...
I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying. It should be treated similarly to how a balk is assessed for a pitcher because it's the same principle
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:45 pm to ShaneTheLegLechler
quote:I don't see your train of thought at all. A balk awards a base, this is the complete opposite. If we were to assess it like a balk, it would be called exactly like it was in this situation.
It should be treated similarly to how a balk is assessed for a pitcher because it's the same principle
I don't see the need to protect the defense in this situation. Keep your head out of your arse and know the count. If they try this shite and you're on top of what you're supposed to be, it's a free out.
This post was edited on 4/25/16 at 4:48 pm
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:48 pm to Drewbie
quote:
I don't see your train of thought at all
It's no different to me than a pitcher faking a pickoff to an unoccupied base, which is a balk
quote:
If we were to assess it like a balk, it would be called exactly like it was in this situation.
Except you wouldn't reward the batter, you would penalize him pretty much the only way you can in that situation.
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:50 pm to Drewbie
quote:
I don't see the need to protect the defense in this situation. Keep your head out of your arse and know the count. If they try this shite and you're on top of what you're supposed to be, it's a free out.
Except if they are smart the runner on third doesn't go anywhere unless the C throws to first, which a smart C shouldn't do... and then the batter has to come back to the plate, so all it's doing is slowing down the pace of the game.
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:51 pm to LSUBoo
quote:
Except if they are smart the runner on third doesn't go anywhere unless the C throws to first, which a smart C shouldn't do... and then the batter has to come back to the plate, so all it's doing is slowing down the pace of the game.
Exactly
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:51 pm to Coon
I think it was handled correctly, it's the catcher's fault for not knowing the count.
Wouldn't be a dead ball since the Catcher dropped it. If he caught it clean and the batter tried that, I could see that argument; but it's still the player's responsibility to know the situation.
I don't see that as interfering with the play. He did not cause the catcher to drop the ball and it isn't his fault that the catcher did not have the awareness to know the count. How often does the ump typically announce the call in this league, assuming you don't have an accurate scoreboard?
FYI, I think it's BS in little league. HS and up, I think it's fair game.
quote:
Some sort of batter interference due to leaving the batter’s box area/dead ball?
Wouldn't be a dead ball since the Catcher dropped it. If he caught it clean and the batter tried that, I could see that argument; but it's still the player's responsibility to know the situation.
quote:
A batter/runner definitely isn't allowed to intentionally interfere with a play in progress outside of their attempt to legally advance bases.
I don't see that as interfering with the play. He did not cause the catcher to drop the ball and it isn't his fault that the catcher did not have the awareness to know the count. How often does the ump typically announce the call in this league, assuming you don't have an accurate scoreboard?
FYI, I think it's BS in little league. HS and up, I think it's fair game.
Posted on 4/25/16 at 4:54 pm to LSUBoo
quote:
Except if they are smart the runner on third doesn't go anywhere unless the C throws to first, which a smart C shouldn't do
Somewhat similar to the 3rd baseman fielding a routine grounder with a runner on 3rd and 0 outs. Close game you may not want to throw to 1st and allow the runner to score easily. If I'm playing 3rd, I field it as I'm moving right and throw it hard to the pitcher as if I'm going to 1st (It's worked 2 of 4 times and have never given up a score doing this).
Posted on 4/25/16 at 5:13 pm to Weekend Warrior79
what i'm trying to figure out is why is the catcher penalized for making a mistake and not having awareness while the batter is pretty much getting off with no penalty. shouldn't both know what's going on? if a runner doesn't tag on a 1 out fly ball thinking there's two outs and gets called out for not tagging, he doesn't get the benefit of the doubt for making a mistake and a retry. maybe that's not a good example but i don't understand why the batter gets an "oops, let's try that again".
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