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Message
re: Military not permitted to accept VBS invitation
Posted on 7/26/14 at 11:27 am to Sal Minella
Posted on 7/26/14 at 11:27 am to Sal Minella
quote:It is also a straight pride parade. It is also a bisexual pride parade. It is also a nerd pride parade. It is a pride parade. Doesn't really matter, though. More on this in a second.
Bottom line, the Capital Pride Parade is a gay pride parade.
quote:And that's where you're wrong, say I unto thee, my friend. A sect is, by its own definition, a separatist group to some extent. I can't seem to qualify LGBT... (the fastest-growing acronym in the history of human communication, which lends itself to my argument here, actually) as a "sect." As far as they're concerned, we're all invited. That's very non-"sect." The movement promotes equality over everything else, doesn't it? You're going to call that a sect?
according to it's own website it is open to members and supporters of the LBGT community. [quote] The military said participation in that was OK and sending a HMMWV to a VBS so that 6 year olds could thank them for their service was not. In my partisan view, that's the military saying endorsement of one sectarian group is OK and another is not, that's just wrong.
Also, I find the "why this and not that?" argument to be humongously flawed since one group is a church and the other, secular. The church pays no taxes in America, meaning it gets protection from the most expensive military in world history free of charge. When you add to this already sweet deal that the government keeps a respectable distance (ie, not sending their military to civilian churches), not only is that not wrong, but that is GOOD and AMERICAN, and I, a Christian man, love it. We aren't perfect by any measure, but no country in world history has treated religion more fairly and wisely than have these great United States. Not gonna lie--typing that gives me a star-spangled boner.
quote:Ahh. Well, don't judge a book by its avatar. That's just a picture. I despise Socialism and am blessed to have heard the stories of many a Soviet-born American citizen whose mouth stands agape when he sees the leftward shift toward which this country is currently being steered.
I don't know what your party is. I'm guessing Socialist. The word "partisan" has multiple meanings.
quote:Me, too. Too bad it isn't in person over a couple IPA's.
Just blasting out my anonymous opinions on a message board.
This post was edited on 7/26/14 at 11:31 am
1
Posted on 7/26/14 at 11:30 am to Jbird
quote:Well, I think it's great, and it's one of the many reasons that you and I may so freely practice our religious beliefs in this country. I'm surprised that so many here are perturbed when the government keeps its distance from the Church. I think you should be relieved, comrade.
I agree with the gay pride stuff on base, but also think it's fricking retarded to ban some Guardsmen from going to VBS.
Seriously, take a second and take this at face value: The United States Military, led by Commander-in-Chief Barack Obama, refrains from sending troops to civilian churches.
You think that's a bad thing?
This post was edited on 7/26/14 at 11:33 am
Posted on 7/26/14 at 11:32 am to ballscaster
quote:How can it, I know you don't want to talk about it no mo.
I'm surprised that so many here are perturbed when the government keeps its distance from the Church.
Should I be allowed to attend a civilian church in my dress uniform?
Posted on 7/26/14 at 11:40 am to Sal Minella
quote:Not a bad point, actually, though I argue that this situation means that the church is afforded more protection. Whenever the government takes a hard line stance against holding any type of official business on church grounds, PRAISE THE LORD.
And neither does Capital Pride, getting the same "protection" for the same price. The difference is Capital Pride was allowed to include the military, this church, more specifically a group of 6 year olds at a church, was not.
I really think this thing is an apples/oranges thing. Religion is involved with one and not with another. That's a big factor in this, is it not?
Posted on 7/26/14 at 12:07 pm to ballscaster
I think that was the reason the decision not to attend was made. Inject a little rational thought and it was a chance for kids to hang outweigh "Army men" in a "cool Army truck". I don't think that the church was coming up with a way for the Army to endorse their religion. Don't let the point be lost that this was a National Guard unit which implies the soldiers are members of that community anyway.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 12:10 pm to Sal Minella
quote:I totally see this but am happy to see the government following the letter of the law when it comes to religion.
I think that was the reason the decision not to attend was made. Inject a little rational thought and it was a chance for kids to hang outweigh "Army men" in a "cool Army truck". I don't think that the church was coming up with a way for the Army to endorse their religion. Don't let the point be lost that this was a National Guard unit which implies the soldiers are members of that community anyway.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 12:12 pm to ballscaster
too bad the government can't follow the letter of the law regarding IMMIGRATION. But THIS LAW of course it follows...wouldn't want to offend any non-Christians. Perfectly ok to offend the Christians who extended the invitation though.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 12:19 pm to skeeter531
They properly followed Army Regulation 360-1 (The Army Public Affairs Program). Current version was published in May 2011.
Non issue.
Non issue.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 12:24 pm to skeeter531
quote:Yes, yes, but immigration is a different conversation, of course.
too bad the government can't follow the letter of the law regarding IMMIGRATION. But THIS LAW of course it follows...
quote:I think this benefits not only Christians, but all religious people in this country. I seriously think that this issue has been spun in a misguided way. No government business on church grounds? LOVE IT.
wouldn't want to offend any non-Christians. Perfectly ok to offend the Christians who extended the invitation though.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 12:56 pm to ballscaster
It ISN"T government/military BUSINESS, it's public relations/outreach.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 12:59 pm to skeeter531
Furthermore, why is it ok for the federal government to give millions to religious groups to house and care for the ILLEGAL immigrants. You seem to cheer the following the letter of the law in one case. Do you support it for the immigration issue? You brought up "the letter of the law" so I'm just following that thread....
Posted on 7/26/14 at 1:16 pm to Wolfhound45
Regulation says it must be non-denominational as in nonsectarian. It is not stated as being religious in nature would make it not permissible. I would think this is making rules and regulation for government entities against a religion and thereby being unconstitutional.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 1:23 pm to themunch
quote:
themunch
It says "Army participation must not selectively benefit (or appear to benefit) any person, group, or corporation (whether profit or nonprofit); religion, sect, religious or sectarian group, or quasi-religious or ideological movement."
I am an evangelical Christian. As conservative as it gets. I am also in the military. I would be in favor of this activity. However, the unit commander made a judgement call (more than likely based upon advice from his/her JAG).
Non issue.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 1:29 pm to skeeter531
quote:Whatever makes you feel most offended and, therefore, most comfortable.
It ISN"T government/military BUSINESS, it's public relations/outreach.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 1:31 pm to themunch
quote:Please spread the word so people can feel offended.
I would think this is making rules and regulation for government entities against a religion and thereby being unconstitutional.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 1:36 pm to ballscaster
quote:
Whatever makes you feel most offended and, therefore, most comfortable.
I'm not at all comfortable being offended but I am offended. I'm much more offended by the fact that illegal immigrants get better care than some of our veterans.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 1:51 pm to skeeter531
quote:The only people who ever say "I'm offended" are people who want to be offended. Exhibit A: You. You're in front of a computer telling people how offended you are. You love it. You even changed the subject so that you could tell us what makes you feel offended. I hope a part of you is nurtured by this, but you're fooling no one.
I'm not at all comfortable being offended but I am offended. I'm much more offended by the fact that illegal immigrants get better care than some of our veterans.
This post was edited on 7/26/14 at 1:52 pm
Posted on 7/26/14 at 1:54 pm to Wolfhound45
quote:Fact.
I would be in favor of this activity. However, the unit commander made a judgement call (more than likely based upon advice from his/her JAG).
Sad as it is this shouldn't be an issue.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 2:16 pm to skeeter531
quote:
The theme was “God’s Rescue Squad.”
Ummmmm......yeah.
Posted on 7/26/14 at 2:22 pm to ballscaster
quote:
The only people who ever say "I'm offended" are people who want to be offended. Exhibit A: You. You're in front of a computer telling people how offended you are. You love it. You even changed the subject so that you could tell us what makes you feel offended. I hope a part of you is nurtured by this, but you're fooling no one.
and the only people who resort to personal attacks are those without the intellectual capacity to say something meaningful. I'm sure there's NOTHING in the world that offends you, right? I'm sure you post on a message board purely to mock other people for being offended.
You're funny. I'm sorry if my being offended offends you. :lol: It must--otherwise you wouldn't respond. I wonder how many people (likely none) would have been offended if the guard unit visited the VBS. 
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