We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam - Page 15 - TigerDroppings.com

Posted byMessage
Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
13834 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

I'm referring to you.



Well I'm neither scared, uneducated or, is my opinion about Islam based on hate. The Koran is very clear about what Islam is and how it should treat non believers. It's the ones that don't practice bombings and beheadings that are not following its teachings. You can go on denying that Islam is the problem and continue ignoring their destructive goals, but there will come a day when you will no longer be able if they achieve their desires. They are very clear about their objectives for world domination and, simply studying the culture of Saudi Arabia or any other country were Islam has an iron rule one can see how much tolerance is given to non believers. You are just deceiving yourself.






Back to top
Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
13834 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

what does that seem like to you?



How can one work hand in hand with people who observe Islam as their religion and the Koran as their guide when it is Islam and the Koran that's the problem?






Back to top
Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
13834 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


Nm


This post was edited on 5/26 at 11:38 pm


Back to top
LSUconvert
LSU Fan
Clackamas, Or
Member since Aug 2007
498 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

How can one work hand in hand with people who observe Islam as their religion and the Koran as their guide when it is Islam and the Koran that's the problem?



I mean, people around the world do it every day. How would you do it? I have no idea.








Back to top
SammyTiger
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Feb 2009
9252 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

How can one work hand in hand with people who observe Islam as their religion and the Koran as their guide when it is Islam and the Koran that's the problem?


Obviously he did, so you can. You're using circular logic. we can't have peace with islam because islam is why we can't have peace.






Back to top
Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
13834 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

Obviously he did, so you can. You're using circular logic. we can't have peace with islam because islam is why we can't have peace.



It's not circular logic. You believe that Islam isn't the problem and its just the way that a few of its followers chose to observe their faith as the issue. I don't agree. I think it's the majority that you claim who are peaceful that aren't really true followers of what the Koran teaches. It's just like America. A majority of Americans call themselves Christians, yet every vice known to man is practiced and flourishes. Surely there is a disconnect somewhere. The same is true with Islam. If true Islam is practiced and spreads, you end up with countries like Saudi Arabia where women have no rights and infidels are killed.






Back to top
SammyTiger
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Feb 2009
9252 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

It's not circular logic. You believe that Islam isn't the problem and its just the way that a few of its followers chose to observe their faith as the issue. I don't agree. I think it's the majority that you claim who are peaceful that aren't really true followers of what the Koran teaches. It's just like America. A majority of Americans call themselves Christians, yet every vice known to man is practiced and flourishes. Surely there is a disconnect somewhere. The same is true with Islam. If true Islam is practiced and spreads, you end up with countries like Saudi Arabia where women have no rights and infidels are killed.



Do you think Judaism is inherently violent?






Back to top
Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
13834 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

Do you think Judaism is inherently violent?



Well they participated in violent acts in the past, but no I don't think they are inherently violent.






Back to top
LSUconvert
LSU Fan
Clackamas, Or
Member since Aug 2007
498 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

I think it's the majority that you claim who are peaceful that aren't really true followers of what the Koran teaches.


How do you know what the koran teaches? Do you speak arabic?






Back to top
Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
13834 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

How do you know what the koran teaches? Do you speak arabic?



No an neither can I read Hebrew or Greek the two languages of the bible but it doesn't deter me from understanding its text. Are you saying there are no English equivalents for Arabic words? The Koran has been translated into over 100 languages. If it were impossible to translate Arabic into anything else, this would be impossible.






Back to top
MrCarton
UNO Fan
Paradise Valley, MT
Member since Dec 2009
2191 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

Are you saying there are no English equivalents for Arabic words?


Well there usually are direct translations when you go "word for word"

The problem is in translating metaphor, analogies, figures of speech, implied and contextual meaning from a language nobody even speaks that was written hundreds of years ago. In this regard the text of the q'ran is no different than that of any other ancient religious text. It is not a simple as translating a recipe.

The truth is that what the quran says and how it is translated will change as the political and cultural environment changes, just like with Christianity, and probably Judaism as well. It is all very subjective IMO.







Back to top
carbola
Michigan Fan
Middle East
Member since Aug 2010
3728 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

simply studying the culture of Saudi Arabia or any other country were Islam has an iron rule one can see how much tolerance is given to non believers. You are just deceiving yourself.


You mean like in Kuwait where they have churches and synagogues? And, yes, Kuwait is a country where Islam is law. If I am outside during Ramadan am seen smoking, drinking or eating I would go to jail.

ETA: And if Kuwait doesn't pass your test, what about Iran: (from wiki)
The government guarantees the recognized Christian minorities a number of rights (production and sale of non-halal foods),[citation needed] representation in parliament, special family law etc.,[citation needed]. According to US-based Barnabas Fund, government intrusion, expropriation of property, forced closure and persecution, particularly in the initial years after the Iranian Revolution, have all been documented[citation needed]. Youcef Nadarkhani is an Jammiat-e Rabbani pastor allegedly "sentenced to death for refusing to recant his faith".[11] However, Iranian official sources has described such claims as "propaganda".[12]
Iranian Christians tend to be urban, with 50% living in Tehran.[13] There are Satellite networks like Mohabbat TV and Sat7Pars that distribute educational and encouraging programs for Christians, especially targeting Persian speakers. Some Christian ex-Muslims emigrate from Iran for educational, political, security or economic reasons



This post was edited on 5/27 at 4:01 am


Back to top
Five0
USA Fan
Member since Dec 2009
4989 posts
 Online 

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

You mean like in Kuwait where they have churches and synagogues? And, yes, Kuwait is a country where Islam is law. If I am outside during Ramadan am seen smoking, drinking or eating I would go to jail.


Name me one Christian nation, where you could do anything against the teachings of the Bible and face any kind of real sanction. TIA.






Back to top
carbola
Michigan Fan
Middle East
Member since Aug 2010
3728 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

Name me one Christian nation, where you could do anything against the teachings of the Bible and face any kind of real sanction. TIA.



Vatican City.

2x ETA:
1) I was also talking in response to him saying that all Islamic countries give no tolerance to other faiths and it is simply not true.

2) Good little read on State Religion ( LINK) and which countries still have them. Granted a lot of those laws have been relaxed over the centuries, but there are still some "Christian" countries that have blasphemy laws LINK



This post was edited on 5/27 at 4:16 am


Back to top
Beer Bryant
Alabama Fan
In a Hidden Bunker
Member since Jan 2012
8792 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


Islam is diametrically opposed to the religions of the Bible, Judaism and Christianity. No, they won't peacefully coexist, especially at this period of time.





Back to top
dontreup0321
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2012
128 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


This isn't true. THe Qu'ran refers to the "people of book" extensibly. During the second phase of the Islamic Jihad that extended out of Arabia, the Muslim armies refrained from launching offensive jihad against Christians, and Jews for 10 centuries. Muslims and Jews coexisted in Iraq peacefully up until 1948 when the Arab-Israli war caused a dramatic shift in the sentiment on both sides naturally. I'm a strict adherer to Protestant Christianity, yet I have many many Muslim friends in both Iraq and the United States. Not only can we coexist, but we do.

As far as an answer to the question of "why don't the majority of peaceful Muslims rise up against the extremists," the answer is that a large portion of them do. Here is one example of Libyan Muslims protesting against the actions of extremists in Benghazi.
LINK

This is a common response to Muslim backed terrorism, yet many Americans fail to realize these protests even occur, where in reality they are frequent and large.

Anti-Muslim Brotherhood protests are occurring all the time in Egypt. The teachings of Sayyid Qutb of the MB spawned Al-Q and the Islamic Jihad movement, yet they were able to gain power as a result of the Egyptian electoral system post Mubark.

They're election system is like Louisiana's where a majority is required. If no majority exists then the top two have a run off. The Mubarak regime's candidate and the MB's candidate received around 20% of the vote each with the other 60% being split amongst 3 moderate candidates. The majority moderate Egyptian population wasn't about the elect a Mubarak replacement so they were forced to support the MB.

The reason the Majority of Muslims haven't violently risen up against these few Islamic extremists is because Islam is a peaceful religion the forbids the killing of other "Muslims." The Islamic extremists evoke the principle of Takfir against moderate Muslims who speak out.






Back to top
SavageOrangeJug
Tennessee Fan
Member since Oct 2005
1817 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

Like i said they do speak out. I linked an article to the Boston Muslim Community speaking out. Also the Muhammed being a pedophile thing is a little overplayed. I don't think you can really translate our idea of an adult to the 500's. It was pretty much if you bleed you breed back then.

bullshite! They offer up some token statement then try to claim they working against terrorism.

Muhammad married Aisha when she was 6 and consumated the marriage when she was 9. The false prophet of Islam was a pedophile. FACT!






Back to top
dontreup0321
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2012
128 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


Here is a great site that the Muslims have to organize the fight against extremism LINK

Here are additional links documenting Muslim protests against extremism
LINK
LINK
LINK
LINK

As a nation we cannot continue to perpetuate this ignorance towards Islam. All this does is give the extremists fuel to continue their fundamental ambitions. I argue that the world should invoke Takfir should against the extremists, which empirical evidence suggests would curb some of the extremists recruiting abilities.






Back to top
SavageOrangeJug
Tennessee Fan
Member since Oct 2005
1817 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


quote:

As a nation we cannot continue to perpetuate this ignorance towards Islam. All this does is give the extremists fuel to continue their fundamental ambitions. I argue that the world should invoke Takfir should against the extremists, which empirical evidence suggests would curb some of the extremists recruiting abilities.

The only ignorance towards Islam is from those that somehow think we can change their religion of intolerance, violence and death.

Their holy book, the Koran, calls for them to kill "infidels".

quote:

Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98

On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161

Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191

Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39

Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216
(different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you.

..... martyrs.... Enter heaven - Surah 3:140-43

If you should die or be killed in the cause of Allah, His mercy and forgiveness would surely be better than all they riches they amass. If you should die or be killed, before Him you shall all be gathered. - 3:157-8

You must not think that those who were slain in the cause of Allah are dead. They are alive, and well-provided for by their Lord. - Surah 3:169-71

Let those fight in the cause of God who sell the life of this world for the hereafter. To him who fights in the cause of God, whether he is slain or victorious, soon we shall give him a great reward. - Surah 4:74

Those who believe fight in the cause of God, and those who reject faith fight in the cause of evil. - 4:76

But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever you find them. - 4:89

Therefore, we stirred among them enmity and hatred, which shall endure till the Day of Resurrection, when Allah will declare to them all that they have done. - 5:14

O believers, take not Jews and Christians as friends; they are friends of each other. Those of you who make them his friends is one of them. God does not guide an unjust people. - 5:54

Make war on them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme - 8:39

O Prophet! Exhort the believers to fight. If there are 20 steadfast men among you, they shall vanquish 200; and if there are a hundred, they shall rout a thousand unbelievers, for they are devoid of understanding. - 8:65

It is not for any Prophet to have captives until he has made slaughter in the land. - 8:67

Allah will humble the unbelievers. Allah and His apostle are free from obligations to idol-worshipers. Proclaim a woeful punishment to the unbelievers. - 9:2-3

When the sacred months are over, slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them. - 9:5

Believers! Know that idolators are unclean. - 9:28

Fight those who believe neither in God nor the Last Day, nor what has been forbidden by God and his messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, even if they are People of the Book, until they pay the tribute and have been humbled. - 9:29 (another source: ) The unbelievers are impure and their abode is hell. (another source: ) Humiliate the non-Muslims to such an extent that they surrender and pay tribute.

Whether unarmed or well-equipped, march on and fight for the cause of Allah, with your wealth and your persons. - 9:41

O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73

Allah has purchased of their faithful lives and worldly goods, and in return has promised them the Garden. They will fight for His cause, kill and be killed. - 9:111

Fight unbelievers who are near to you. 9:123 (different translation:
Believers! Make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Let them find harshness in you. (another source: ) Ye who believe! Murder those of the disbelievers....

As for those who are slain in the cause of Allah, He will not allow their works to perish. He will vouchsafe them guidance and ennoble their state; He will admit them to the Paradise He has made known to them. - 10:4-15

Allah has cursed the unbelievers and proposed for them a blazing hell. - 33:60

Unbelievers are enemies of Allah and they will roast in hell. - 41:14

When you meet the unbelievers, smite their necks, then when you have made wide slaughter among them, tie fast the bonds, then set them free, either by grace or ransom, until the war lays down its burdens. - 47:4
(different translation: ) When you meet the unbelievers in the battlefield, strike off their heads, and when you have laid them low, bind your captives firmly.

Those who are slain in the way of Allah - he will never let their deeds be lost. Soon will he guide them and improve their condition, and admit them to the Garden, which he has announced for them. - 47:5

Muslims are harsh against the unbelievers, merciful to one another. - 48:25

Muhammad is Allah's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful to one another. Through them, Allah seeks to enrage the unbelievers. - 48:29

Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal sternly with them. Hell shall be their home, evil their fate. - 66:9

The unbelievers among the People of the Book and the pagans shall burn forever in the fire of hell. They are the vilest of all creatures. - 98:51

Fight them so that Allah may punish them at your hands, and put them to shame. (verse cited in Newsweek 2/11/02)


Koran commands to kill infidels






Back to top
Beer Bryant
Alabama Fan
In a Hidden Bunker
Member since Jan 2012
8792 posts

re: We can all Agree we will never be able to coexist with Islam


And the weak lefties give into these violent extremists:

THE Australian National University has cited international violence in the wake of the Danish cartoon and Innocence of Muslims controversies in justifying its decision to force student newspaper Woroni to pulp a satirical infographic which described a passage from the Koran as a “rape fantasy”.
The piece was the fifth in a satirical series entitled “Advice from Religion” which had previously discussed Catholicism, Scientology, Mormonism and Judaism.

No complaints were received about any of the earlier installments.
“In a world of social media, (there is) potential for material such as the article in question to gain attention and traction in the broader world and potentially harm the interests of the university and the university community,” the statement said.

“This was most clearly demonstrated by the Jyllands-Posten cartoon controversy ... and violent protests in Sydney on September 15 last year.”

Surrendering freedom to the violent: ANU censors student paper for mocking Islam






Back to top


Back to top




//