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buddhavista
Member since Jul 2012
3543 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


No, this won't happen. Why, churches are already allowed discretion on who they marry.

Now if they rent out the facilities to the public at large, they will be stuck doing gay marriages. But that isn't a gay marriage thing, its an EEOC thing.






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thetempleowl
Temple Fan
dallas, tx
Member since Jul 2008
10370 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Not being allowed on the campuses of public universities like Cal.


I find some things very interesting.

Many here support the right of democratic rule even to the point of inhibiting freedoms. What I mean by this is that if california chooses to outlaw gay marriage via prop 8, they think there is no way the courts should override this.

However, if a similar democratic process occurs on cals campus, the republicans here would be up in arms.

Look, my rules hold true. I have no problems with a student religious group being on campus. Young catholics or whatever they want to be. However, in return for that gift being given to the group, the group has to follow cals rules.

Now I don't know what cals rules are. But no doubt they are there. Now if you think those rules are wrong, then we could examine the whole rule and look at it.

But either follow the rules, don't get the benefit, or get the rule legally changed.

What group do you want on cals campus, what do they stand for, and what are the rules of cal on these issues?






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thetempleowl
Temple Fan
dallas, tx
Member since Jul 2008
10370 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Now if they rent out the facilities to the public at large, they will be stuck doing gay marriages. But that isn't a gay marriage thing, its an EEOC thing.


Not true. They will still have to rent the facilities to gays, but they will not have to perform gay marriage themselves.

That would be an important difference.






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darkhorse
Member since Aug 2012
4819 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


Arrest have been made already, and it's becoming more and more clear that yes, in America, Christians will not be able to speak out about their beliefs.

Arrested in Houston

They obtain the proper documents and their sign was approved. Yet they were handcuffed then ticketed for this:

quote:

Technically, they were ticketed for having signs thicker than one-quarter inch (they say they were 3/16ths and that they’d been approved beforehand), and for having a sign not made out of wood (their shofar is a ram’s horn style).










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los angeles tiger
LSU Fan
1,601 miles from Tiger Stadium
Member since Oct 2003
55976 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

I've no doubt that within a couple of decades most branches of Christianity will support gay marriage if they want to remain relevant. Several already do and many are in the process of "evolving".


Oh, yes, you know everything you've been told but do not know or accept the truth.
In the PCUSA, where congregation after congregation has voted to leave the denomination, are taken to court and forced to either pay or completely give up their property because your friends in the "More Light Presbyterians" claim the PCUSA owns the property. Forget the fact that the PCUSA came about in 1983 in a reunion of two presbyterian denominations, they claim they own the property of churches that are over 100 years old. The congregation, not the denomination, bought the property and maintained it, not the tyrannical LGBT and lib friends that have political power in the PCUSA.







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los angeles tiger
LSU Fan
1,601 miles from Tiger Stadium
Member since Oct 2003
55976 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Look, my rules hold true. I have no problems with a student religious group being on campus. Young catholics or whatever they want to be. However, in return for that gift being given to the group, the group has to follow cals rules.


What you are saying is you hate freedom and you support the abolishment of the first amendment.






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buddhavista
Member since Jul 2012
3543 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Not true. They will still have to rent the facilities to gays, but they will not have to perform gay marriage themselves.

That would be an important difference.

sorry, you wrote what I meant to write. They will have to rent it out for gay marriages if they rent it out to the public.






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los angeles tiger
LSU Fan
1,601 miles from Tiger Stadium
Member since Oct 2003
55976 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

sorry, you wrote what I meant to write. They will have to rent it out for gay marriages if they rent it out to the public.


But that's not "force" from government in which government has completely violated the first amendment and freedom to choose is abolished?






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DeltaDoc
LSU Fan
The Delta
Member since Jan 2008
8262 posts
 Online 

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Oh, yes, you know everything you've been told but do not know or accept the truth. In the PCUSA, where congregation after congregation has voted to leave the denomination, are taken to court and forced to either pay or completely give up their property because your friends in the "More Light Presbyterians" claim the PCUSA owns the property. Forget the fact that the PCUSA came about in 1983 in a reunion of two presbyterian denominations, they claim they own the property of churches that are over 100 years old. The congregation, not the denomination, bought the property and maintained it, not the tyrannical LGBT and lib friends that have political power in the PCUSA.


Yep. This is also relevant relative to the PCA, which is one of, if not the, fastest growing prodestant denominations in the US. The PCA does not recognize or perform gay marriages nor do they ordain openly gay ministers.







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buddhavista
Member since Jul 2012
3543 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

But that's not "force" from government in which government has completely violated the first amendment and freedom to choose is abolished?


if a business rents out an establishment to whites, should they be forced to rent to blacks? what about muslim facility renting out to muslims, should they have to be able to rent it to jews? What about an atheist, should he have to serve christians?

Its the same category of problem.

I would be happy to get rid of that law, as I think businesses should be able to discriminate on who their customers are. However, its pretty well established by the SCOTUS, there are limits on who and how businesses can discriminate. I don't believe LGBT are a protected class but that is just a function of time IMHO.

And the churches will always have the option of stopping renting out their facility, if they don't want to service gays. But I don't think you can engage in a commercial activity, and say you shouldn't have to play by the same rules as other businesses due to your religious beliefs. Its got to be one set of rules for everyone. Again, i would be fine with getting rid of any law and protected class but that isn't the way it is right now.






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darkhorse
Member since Aug 2012
4819 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

OMG! Thats it. You are right. A 2000 year old book that an extremely corrupt institution put together from hundreds of different sources while they were busy being one of the most corrupt institutions in history?


Totally not going to high jack this thread, but there is an OT forum. I will openly debate the validity of the Bible with you at any point in time!

All you have to do is start the thread and to let me know!







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los angeles tiger
LSU Fan
1,601 miles from Tiger Stadium
Member since Oct 2003
55976 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Yep. This is also relevant relative to the PCA, which is one of, if not the, fastest growing prodestant denominations in the US. The PCA does not recognize or perform gay marriages nor do they ordain openly gay ministers.


The newer Fellowship of Presbyterians as well as the Evangelical Presbyterians are the two where many of the PCUSA congregations are voting to go to.

The LGBT group "More Light Presbyterians" claim that they are bigots because they claim LGBT people have "rights of ordination." I never saw anything about any rights in the church since we are supposed to be followers of Christ and He is our King. He said "If you love me, obey my commandments" and that we must die to self, pick up our cross and follow Him. That meant to follow Christ means you are going to be put to death as has been the case in the history of Christianity.

What Temple easily proposes is that if you don't obey the government, the government has the right to put you to death. He prefers that "utopia" because he hates the church.






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GeauxTigerTM
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2006
10902 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Well, if you don't have sex with both men and women, also trannies pre-op and post-op, you are an intolerant neck.


What?

Unlike you, I've never been confused about my sexuality. For better or worse, it's always been women. While I may find the thought of you being buggered by some guy distasteful, I feel you have the right to be married if you want. And if I was a part of some religion that said homosexuality was wrong, I personally would not do it (harder said than done, am I right?) and I wouldn't try and get married...but I'd NEVER tell someone else they could not.

I don't need to take part in an activity in order to feel others have the right to do so.






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buddhavista
Member since Jul 2012
3543 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

What Temple easily proposes is that if you don't obey the government, the government has the right to put you to death.

err, that is pretty much exactly the case, and across a wide variety of areas. This is why i am for the absolution of the US govt.






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los angeles tiger
LSU Fan
1,601 miles from Tiger Stadium
Member since Oct 2003
55976 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

What?

Unlike you, I've never been confused about my sexuality. For better or worse, it's always been women


I'm not confused but I dare say you are intolerant of having sex with men since you will not do it. You are just trying to hide your bigotry.






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GeauxTigerTM
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2006
10902 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Toddy loves to be the expert about the Bible until it is pointed out that he doesn't know. He's just bigoted because a lot of people don't applaud him for being a cocksucker.

He hasn't read Acts 10 where St. Peter had the dream to reveal to him about the various animals that had been unclean were now not unclean. There was not mention of a bowl of dicks or men's a-holes being on the list of foods that are now clean.


Does anyone else find this type of ad hom attack from lat as tiresome and ironic as I do?






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GeauxTigerTM
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2006
10902 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

I'm not confused but I dare say you are intolerant of having sex with men since you will not do it.


Just so those who may not be following at home...you are either currently or WERE a gay man, that's correct, yes? I'm fine with that. I just find your incessant need to name call Toddy for being gay (you may as well call him a faig) kind of, um...funny.

You may want to look up the word intolerant. I'm fine with others taking part in homosexual acts. More power to them! It's just not for me. I also don;t smoke pot, but I think it ought to be legal, because I tend to like freedom.

quote:

You are just trying to hide your bigotry.


This is almost as stupid as when you claimed mean ole atheists were going to round up the religious and put them into camps.






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los angeles tiger
LSU Fan
1,601 miles from Tiger Stadium
Member since Oct 2003
55976 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

Does anyone else find this type of ad hom attack from lat as tiresome and ironic as I do


But it is okay for Toddy to call others "bigots" and for you to say that I am confused about my sexuality because your ad hom attacks on me are from you and that's not tiresome?






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los angeles tiger
LSU Fan
1,601 miles from Tiger Stadium
Member since Oct 2003
55976 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

This is almost as stupid as when you claimed mean ole atheists were going to round up the religious and put them into camps.


You mean Mao and Stalin didn't do that? You mean they never hurt anyone and everyone had freedom?






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GeauxTigerTM
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2006
10902 posts

re: Will Christian Churches Be Forced to Accept Gay Marriage/Rights as Normal?


quote:

But it is okay for Toddy to call others "bigots"


I think there's a huge difference between calling someone a bigot, and calling them out the way you do. You're so far over the line on this issue you can;t even fricking see it any more.

quote:

you to say that I am confused about my sexuality


I find it ironic that you feel the need to call out Toddy in such a manner when it's been established in the past that you too enjoy/ed cock. The fact that you continually do this to him and others and then hide when this topic comes up is quite illustrative. I'm sure there are some on here that are ready to give you an "Atta boy!" when you rip Toddy. You think they still would if they knew?

Of course, you're shown your arse (I know, right?) on this board before, and your classlessness got you banned when for felt the need to rip on BAMA about their tornados there. This level of debate from you isn't really surprising, but if the admins were consistent it ought not be tolerated.






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