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Rex 
LSU Fan
Here, there, and nowhere
Member since Sep 2004
47507 posts
 Online
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 10:25 am to AlaTiger)
Savage was 100% correct. Why did you feel the need to extract only those parts of what Savage said against which you thought you could mount some defense of the Bible?
Let's cut to the chase here... Savage was 100% correct about the presence of perverse bull shite in the Bible. You were so quick to point out that Jesus admonished sinners from casting the first stone, but where did Jesus specifically condemn Moses and Moses's God from slaughtering entire countries of all men, women, children, and farm animals, except the virgins who were to be kept to satisfy the lusts of the Israelis?
Your assertion that the Bible was a blueprint against slavery is laughable in the extreme. There is no specific prohibition against the institution, even though it was a social matter of extreme consequence. Why didn't you resort to Jesus quotes in THIS matter, as you were so eager in the stoning case? Could it be that, if anything, Jesus's words give consent to the practice? Savage is correct... if Christians had the good sense to discard the slavery acceptance bull shite that is in the Bible they can employ that same good sense to ignore bull shite admonitions against homosexuality.
Here's a link, by the way, to Savage's speech. Here you can clearly see high school students walking out. Are they pansie asses as Savage states? Maybe. But one thing's for certain... their Christianity hardens them against free thought and discussion. Get them early and the chances are good that they'll never have the strength to sit through legitimate examinations of their dogma.
LINK
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secfan123
beverly hills
Member since Jan 2010
9646 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 10:38 am to Rex)
Rex, dammit, you try dont you 
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CITWTT
LSU Fan
baton rouge
Member since Sep 2005
25171 posts
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| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 10:50 am to DCRebel)
They could have Googled his column titled "Savage love" to know exactly what he was about in a few seconds. The man makes deviants seem oh so normal.
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AlaTiger
LSU Fan
Alabama
Member since Aug 2006
9993 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 11:06 am to Rex)
Rex,
You are the one who is hardened against free thought and discussion.
Jesus said:
Love your neighbor as yourself
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you
My Kingdom is not of this world
I came not to be served but to serve
Philippians 2:5-8 says that Jesus took on the form of a servant. The word there is doulos, which means slave.
If you follow any of that at all, you cannot own another person.
So, Jesus became a slave to set captives free (Luke 4:18-19). He became a slave for us. The entire New Testament undermines slavery completely if you have even a basic understanding of the person and work of Jesus. The fact that Christians twisted and ignored the Bible to defend the practice of slavery speaks of cultural accommodation and our proclivity to want to dominate others - which is sin.
Just because people twist the Bible does not make it "bull shite."
No, Rex, Savage was 100% wrong in how he dealt with the Bible and what it says.
This post was edited on 5/1 at 11:07 am
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Doctor Radical
LSU Fan
Austin
Member since Feb 2008
10258 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 11:12 am to AlaTiger)
quote:
Just because people twist the Bible does not make it "bull shite."
So what you're saying is that people can use the Bible to justify oppressing other people, but that's not what the Bible is really about. It's about compassion, forgiveness, and love for your fellow person.
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AlaTiger
LSU Fan
Alabama
Member since Aug 2006
9993 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 11:44 am to Doctor Radical)
quote:
So what you're saying is that people can use the Bible to justify oppressing other people, but that's not what the Bible is really about. It's about compassion, forgiveness, and love for your fellow person
What I am saying is that the Bible is ultimately about Jesus. The Old Testament prepares the way for Jesus and the New Testament testifies to Him directly as the fulfillment of God's Law and salvation. People can use it wrongly, sure. But, they are sinning when they do so. If you use Scripture to justify oppressing others, you are completely wrong. Jesus Himself said that Scripture testified to Him (John 5:39-40).
Jesus comes to set captives free. He came as a slave to take on Himself the oppression of sin in all forms. He actually became sin so that in Him, we might become the righteousness of God. And yes, as we are reconnected to God, we are love all people and live at peace with them. This was all fulfilled in Jesus and it is the way that we are to go forward. Jesus even told us not to resist and evil person, but to turn the other cheek and go the extra mile. We are able to do this because we have entrusted ourselves to God and not to other people.
The Old Testament is full of typology, examples, warnings, prophetic utterances, and symbols - all preparing the way for Christ who would fulfill everything. Israel was put where it was and given the commands that it was given so that we would know what God's character was, the purpose of holiness, and how without holiness, no one would see God. That is why we have the temple sacrifices for sin and all of the prophetic injunctions.
Dan Savage, in trying to lift passages out of context out of the Bible to justify dismissing other passages that he does not like, is completely wrong. Plus, if we lift out the passages saying that homosexuality is a sin (which is both affirmed in the Old and New Testaments as part of God's moral law), then why not get rid of the parts on nonviolence, loving your enemy, etc? If so, then Christians are really warranted in persecuting those they disagree with for whatever reason however they wish.
If you throw out the parts that you don't agree with, then you are left with nothing and anything goes - which is exactly what Savage wants until it hinders him in anyway or perhaps causes someone to disapprove of HIS actions. For Savage, it really is all about HIM and what HE wants and how HE wants everyone to love everything that HE does. Savage would have the entire country and everyone in it reconstruct our sense of right and wrong to fit his tastes and desires.
He thinks a lot of himself.
This post was edited on 5/1 at 11:46 am
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Python
Prairieville, La.
Member since May 2008
3837 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 11:59 am to DCRebel)
quote:
To be fair, they probably didn't think he'd call people "pansy asses" or whatever it was he said.
They didn't think that a man who has defended pedophiles wouldn't do something like that? Really?
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AlaTiger
LSU Fan
Alabama
Member since Aug 2006
9993 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 12:08 pm to Python)
quote:
They didn't think that a man who has defended pedophiles wouldn't do something like that? Really?
And that is the other issue. The organization that invited him really is responsible. This is how he is and always has been. The fact that Obama invites him to the White House is also interesting as this guy's body of work is out there for all to see.
I laud his work against bullying of gay teens. No one should do that. It is cruel and I would step in if I ever saw it happening or knew about it and try and put a stop to it. No one deserves that. But, the rest of Savage's work is pretty deplorable.
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DCRebel
Northwestern Fan
Dan's Cafe
Member since Aug 2009
13249 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 1:47 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
Yeah, pretty much. Those books talk about how Christ is the fulfillment of the Law, that man cannot keep it because we are inherently sinful and even our best efforts fall short, and that Jesus and His New Covenant supersede the Old and is better. Nothing about the character of God or His moral law are changed, but all of the sacrifices, regulations, and punishments are met and fulfilled in Christ. All penalty for sin has been taken care of by Jesus. This is why His death on the Cross is a big deal - He died the death that we all deserve for our sins. And, He rose from the dead to give us a new life and set us on His path that we walk by faith if we will believe and accept what He did for us. This is what Easter is about.
I don't really have time for this, nor do I want to venture off on such a tangent, but it is amazing to me that grown, rational, thinking adults can a) believe this and b) think this is some sort of virtuous or moral system.
I'm tired. Maybe later.
quote:
This is why Savage was so wrong.
Who are you to say this? Who are you to tell ANYBODY that their interpretation of the Bible is incorrect?
It's just so convenient how the religious today love to paint themselves as super awesome and nice and moral and shit, and do so by cherrypicking and contextualizing the shite out of their holy books in order to fit that narrative. It really is stunning. In a sense, it's no logically better than Fred Phelps twisting the words of the Bible to proclaim that "God hates Fags."
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DCRebel
Northwestern Fan
Dan's Cafe
Member since Aug 2009
13249 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 1:49 pm to Rex)
quote:
Your assertion that the Bible was a blueprint against slavery is laughable in the extreme.
I mean, come on, slavery still exists across the globe today. Slavery existed in the US until the 1860's. If Christianity's stance on slavery were so damned cut and dry, neither would be the case.
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DCRebel
Northwestern Fan
Dan's Cafe
Member since Aug 2009
13249 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 1:50 pm to CITWTT)
quote:
They could have Googled his column titled "Savage love" to know exactly what he was about in a few seconds. The man makes deviants seem oh so normal.
Explain, in this sense, deviancy. Thanks.
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DCRebel
Northwestern Fan
Dan's Cafe
Member since Aug 2009
13249 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 1:52 pm to Python)
quote:
They didn't think that a man who has defended pedophiles wouldn't do something like that? Really?
shite man I don't read his columns. I don't know his style. I'm just assuming that, when they hired him or asked him to speak or whatever, that they didn't expect him to call somebody a "pansy ass" on stage. That's all.
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Python
Prairieville, La.
Member since May 2008
3837 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 1:56 pm to DCRebel)
quote:
I'm just assuming
Obviously, you should probably stop doing that.
This guy is a demented, perverted freak. End of story.
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Draconian Sanctions
LSU Fan
San Francisco 49ers Fan
Member since Oct 2008
28269 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 1:57 pm to AlaTiger)
Fighting for laws that will disenfranchise homosexuals of equal protection qualifies as persecution IMO
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baytiger 
New Orleans Saints Fan
Houston
Member since Dec 2007
40594 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 2:00 pm to Python)
quote:
This guy is a demented, perverted freak. End of story.
quote:
Jesus said:
Love your neighbor as yourself
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you
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RCDfan1950
LSU Fan
United States
Member since Feb 2007
6623 posts
Online
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 2:02 pm to Doctor Radical)
quote:
Doctor Radical
Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant
quote:
Just because people twist the Bible does not make it "bull shite."
So what you're saying is that people can use the Bible to justify oppressing other people, but that's not what the Bible is really about. It's about compassion, forgiveness, and love for your fellow person.
Hey DR..."many are called, but few are chosen" (Biblical). Hell dude, if everybody got it right, there would be no need for salvation.
You can justify anything you desire in that Bible; but what such justification can not do...if bear good spiritual fruit. People only fool themselves; Savage et al. The Bible possesses the knowledge, in parable form, and just like with the Second Coming...will only be seen "by them that look for His coming".
IMHO
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Doctor Radical
LSU Fan
Austin
Member since Feb 2008
10258 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 2:02 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
What I am saying is that the Bible is ultimately about Jesus.
True, but I think we both would agree that it is more than simply a biography.
quote:
If you use Scripture to justify oppressing others, you are completely wrong.
I'm not sure this point has been made clear enough. Using the Bible to justify oppression is wrong. I'm trying to figure out how that works with using the Bible to create laws oppressing people or to prohibit policies meant to stop oppression.
Obviously there is a legitimate debate concerning whether being gay is tenable within scripture, with some churches saying yes, some saying no, and other still on the fence.
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Python
Prairieville, La.
Member since May 2008
3837 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 2:06 pm to baytiger)
quote:
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you
If I ever defend pedophiles, you can call me a perverted freak too. No problem.
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L.A.
New Orleans Saints Fan
Los Angeles
Member since Aug 2003
34684 posts
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| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 2:13 pm to Python)
Dan Savage boasted of licking the doorknobs of another man in order to infect him with the flu.
quote:
I went from doorknob to doorknob. They were filthy, no doubt, but there wasn't time to find a rag to spit on. My immune system wasn't all it should be -- I was in the grip of the worst flu I had ever had -- but I was on a mission. If for some reason I didn't manage to get a pen from my mouth to Gary's hands, I wanted to seed his office with germs, get as many of his people sick as I could, and hopefully one of them would infect the candidate.
LINK
What a guy. Whoever invited him to speak to a bunch of high school students should be fired.
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BeeFense5 
Notre Dame Fan
New Orleans
Member since Jul 2010
15804 posts
| re: Why Dan Savage Was 1000% WRONG in His Pro-Gay, Anti-Christian Rant (Posted on 5/1/12 at 2:20 pm to L.A.)
quote:
I went from doorknob to doorknob. They were filthy, no doubt, but there wasn't time to find a rag to spit on. My immune system wasn't all it should be -- I was in the grip of the worst flu I had ever had -- but I was on a mission. If for some reason I didn't manage to get a pen from my mouth to Gary's hands, I wanted to seed his office with germs, get as many of his people sick as I could, and hopefully one of them would infect the candidate.
And toddy kept defending this guy. Wow. 
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