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Started By
Message
re: Infield fly rule
Posted on 2/18/24 at 3:41 pm to Bengal Sporto
Posted on 2/18/24 at 3:41 pm to Bengal Sporto
quote:
Why protect runners on a pop up but not a ground ball? I
Because the rules governing both situations are different.
1
Posted on 2/18/24 at 3:49 pm to Wayne Campbell
I think everyone here knows that. He is just wondering why
Posted on 2/18/24 at 3:51 pm to Wayne Campbell
quote:
An argument would be, “the infield fly rule should be eliminated because . . .”
Ok, the infield fly rule should be eliminated because it would potentially penalize a team for hitting into a pop-up and reward the team that induced it and it would provide excitement to the game without drastically changing the fabric of the game, such as lowering the mound and introducing the DH did. It would also take the onus off the umpire to make an often subjective decision on when to apply the rule.
quote:
an argument would be the infield fly rule protects the baserunners because otherwise they would have no chance at either advancing or returning to base safely.
They would have a chance though. The defense still has to let the ball drop, cover a base, and make two decent throws. Much like they are required to do on a normal double play ball. In fact, one could argue that a team that laces a hard hit ball at the SS with a runner on first is more often penalized by the outcome than the team that hits a weak pop-up to the shortstop in the same situation.
I am not saying its a valid enough argument to make the rule change, and honestly, it isn't broke so why fix it probably makes the most sense here, but lets not pretend there isn't at least some validity to eliminating the rule.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 4:04 pm to Basura Blanco
Without the infield fly rule it would be chaos.
You could even see triple play when the bases are loaded. The rule is as common sense rule and it would be crazy to change it up.
You could even see triple play when the bases are loaded. The rule is as common sense rule and it would be crazy to change it up.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 4:06 pm to Basura Blanco
quote:
My argument is, why protect them?
So you can’t get a cheap double play
Posted on 2/18/24 at 4:17 pm to kengel2
quote:
But I don't know the whole rule inside and out.
the rule is actually quite simple.
A. there has to be a force play available at 3B with fewer than 2 outs in the inning.
B. the fly ball has to be one that an infielder can catch with “reasonable effort”.
part 1 is non negotiable.
part 2 is umpire’s discretion.
the umpire should make the call well before an actual play is made.
he’ll point straight up i. sky and call the batter out on infield fly rule.
If the ball could potentially land in foul territory. he’ll still call it with the caveat of “if it stays fair”.
the one today was obvious.
2 players could have easily caught the ball without even sprinting anywhere just drifting under a high pop.
no brainer Infield Fly.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 4:56 pm to saint tiger225
quote:
It's also a dumbass rule, regardless.
The dumbass would be someone saying a rule is a dumbass rule without even understanding it in the first place.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 5:38 pm to Basura Blanco
quote:
I am not saying its a valid enough argument to make the rule change, and honestly, it isn't broke so why fix it probably makes the most sense here, but lets not pretend there isn't at least some validity to eliminating the rule.
Except the rule was specifically implemented because defenders were deliberately not making a play on the ball to force runners to advance, generating an easy double play.
Why would we assume that players 100 years ago were more capable of making the throw than modern players.
Arguing to remove a rule that was put in place to prevent an obvious issue makes no sense. Let’s eliminate the infield fly and also eliminate the tag up requirement.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 6:12 pm to Basura Blanco
quote:
If a player wants to drop a ball on purpose they should be able too. Make it interesting.
Some of you have never played more than little league baseball, and it shows.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 6:17 pm to doubleb
quote:
Without the infield fly rule it would be chaos.
You could even see triple play when the bases are loaded. The rule is as common sense rule and it would be crazy to change it up.
Isn't it very difficult to buy into the "most knowledgeable fans in college baseball" mantra when you read some of the crap being said in this thread?
Posted on 2/18/24 at 7:43 pm to Lester Earl
I’m always a phone call away Lester. You can call anytime if you are in need of help.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 7:46 pm to ProjectP2294
quote:
Ask Braves fans about this,
The one that happened today was A LOT different than the Braves/Cardinals one.
The one that was called today was a perfect implementation of the rule, while not on the infield, it was like 2-3 steps out of the dirt and it looked like a routine play if not for the wind.
The 2012 one was more in no-man's land, while it still should've been caught by the Cardinals, it was a much tougher play and further out to the outfield. An egregious call.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 8:04 pm to Hold That Tiger 10
quote:
most knowledgeable fans in college baseball
who says that? I don't think that's true at all
Posted on 2/18/24 at 8:19 pm to Nutriaitch
And the first base umpire made the call as designed.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 8:40 pm to Nutriaitch
quote:
the one today was obvious. 2 players could have easily caught the ball without even sprinting anywhere just drifting under a high pop. no brainer Infield Fly.
The first baseman making a play 3 steps into the grass is not reasonable effort being he was right behind first base runner. The second baseman was shading to second and had a long run. He actually got to it just in time to put a glove it. Although the rule states the ball does not have to be in the infield, umpires are taught to judge on caution any ball into outfield.
With the way the wind was blowing, the ball was probably 10-12 steps into the grass.
But let’s debate the rule!
Posted on 2/19/24 at 9:47 am to BallChamp00
quote:
The first baseman making a play 3 steps into the grass is not reasonable effort being he was right behind first base runner.
YouTube Highlights
around the 1:00 mark.
1st baseman is on the grass at 1:05 staring straight up and just positioning himself.
Ball hits ground at 1:09.
4 full seconds of camping out in the area is the very definition of reasonable effort.
quote:
But let’s debate the rule!
ok.
it's a good rule.
on a fly ball in a non IFR situation, the infielder catches the fly ball, and many runners stay put.
after play is over, there is one more out than before, and the runners are all exactly where they were before the play. There is no real advantage gained by catching or not catching.
so the IFR basically ensures the same thing happens on those fly balls too. now just like every other pop up, there is no real advantage in catching it or not catching it.
Posted on 2/19/24 at 10:07 am to BallChamp00
I agree, nobody was camped under the ball(key component of the rule). The infield fly rule on Saturday was properly called even though is was much farther into the outfield than the pop up yesterday where their player was camped under the ball before it was called.
Posted on 2/19/24 at 11:51 am to TigerDM
quote:
I agree, nobody was camped under the ball(key component of the rule).
I posted the video in the post above yours.
he's camped out on the outfield grass drifting around to position himself for 4 seconds (on the video timer) before the ball hits the ground.
that's plenty enough time to call infield fly.
Edit to Add: took about 4 seconds from ball hitting bat to 1B being camped under it. So roughly half the hang time of a high pop up was 1B camped out under a big pop up.
This post was edited on 2/19/24 at 11:58 am
Posted on 2/19/24 at 11:59 am to Bengal Sporto
quote:
Why should a pop up in the infield be a double play?
Why should it be an automatic out?
Posted on 2/19/24 at 12:08 pm to Ellis_Hugh
quote:
Why should it be an automatic out?
it makes it just like a pop-up in non infield fly situations.
you CAN advance at your own risk if you want, but you don't have to.
you offset taking away the cheap double play by giving the defense 1 out.
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