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Message
There is a ton of intellectual dishonesty regarding O
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:04 pm
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:04 pm
Even if you don't realize it. Let me preface this by admitting a few things:
1) I did not want Coach O
2) I REALLY wanted Tom Herman
3) Though not in love with Jimbo, I got excited about his ability to develop QBs and being 11-12 years younger than Miles.
4) I don't understand why we were in such a rush. That was inexcusable, even if we had eventually determined that O was the best man for the job. There was no advantage to hurry the process.
5) I have (half-heartedly) defended Alleva, mainly because I think he made really good hires--at the time--with Trent and Nikki. They were both way more qualified than I thought we could get. Their failure is on them, rather than Alleva. But he should definitely shut-can both this year if they don't make the tourney. But more importantly, he guided the AD in raising a ton of money, upgrading Tiger Stadium, and either replacing or upgrading a ton of other athletic facilities. People typically judge an AD by the hires he makes(mainly football), but the reality is that the biggest part of their job is probably generating revenue. I would imagine that we have generated more revenue and are more profitable under his watch than just about anybody. BUT...
He fricked this hiring process up just about as bad as you can. Even if the hire winds up working out. Yadda yadda yadda, he can carry his arse now as far as I'm concerned. tl;dr
BUT....
1) I did not want Coach O
2) I REALLY wanted Tom Herman
3) Though not in love with Jimbo, I got excited about his ability to develop QBs and being 11-12 years younger than Miles.
4) I don't understand why we were in such a rush. That was inexcusable, even if we had eventually determined that O was the best man for the job. There was no advantage to hurry the process.
5) I have (half-heartedly) defended Alleva, mainly because I think he made really good hires--at the time--with Trent and Nikki. They were both way more qualified than I thought we could get. Their failure is on them, rather than Alleva. But he should definitely shut-can both this year if they don't make the tourney. But more importantly, he guided the AD in raising a ton of money, upgrading Tiger Stadium, and either replacing or upgrading a ton of other athletic facilities. People typically judge an AD by the hires he makes(mainly football), but the reality is that the biggest part of their job is probably generating revenue. I would imagine that we have generated more revenue and are more profitable under his watch than just about anybody. BUT...
He fricked this hiring process up just about as bad as you can. Even if the hire winds up working out. Yadda yadda yadda, he can carry his arse now as far as I'm concerned. tl;dr
BUT....
15
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:04 pm to Hot Carl
I think a lot of us are being intellectually dishonest regarding O. If I may:
1) Concluding that O was a terrible hire because no other schools wanted him.
No school may have come after him, but the fact is that the Orgeron that interimly lead BOTH USC to a 6-2 record AND LSU to a 5-2 record never hit the open market. Just because he wasn't a hot commodity after the USC gig doesn't mean he wouldn't have been thought of much more highly and considered for other HC jobs if we hadn't hired him. We'll never know.
2) O was an unemployed DL coach when we hired him
While technically true, he was obviously not working by his own free will. He was still getting paid by USC and stayed home to major his family and watch his son play high school football(I think). And maybe waiting for the LSU DL job to open up. Regardless, it's not like we picked him up off the street like some imply.
3) The binder
While it has become a pretty hilarious meme, you have to give O credit for forging a masterful campaign to get the job. People seem to think he stupidly stumble his way into the gig. Not true. He obviously had his eyes on the job from the get-go. Hell, you could tell in his 1st coaches show he was in an all-out battle to retain Aranda 2 months in the future. Every time they asked about the defense, he went out of his way to fellate Dave. He had a plan to get the job and he killed it. You have to tip your cap for that level of ambition. Hell, he may have even contributed to Miles' firing
tbc. .
1) Concluding that O was a terrible hire because no other schools wanted him.
No school may have come after him, but the fact is that the Orgeron that interimly lead BOTH USC to a 6-2 record AND LSU to a 5-2 record never hit the open market. Just because he wasn't a hot commodity after the USC gig doesn't mean he wouldn't have been thought of much more highly and considered for other HC jobs if we hadn't hired him. We'll never know.
2) O was an unemployed DL coach when we hired him
While technically true, he was obviously not working by his own free will. He was still getting paid by USC and stayed home to major his family and watch his son play high school football(I think). And maybe waiting for the LSU DL job to open up. Regardless, it's not like we picked him up off the street like some imply.
3) The binder
While it has become a pretty hilarious meme, you have to give O credit for forging a masterful campaign to get the job. People seem to think he stupidly stumble his way into the gig. Not true. He obviously had his eyes on the job from the get-go. Hell, you could tell in his 1st coaches show he was in an all-out battle to retain Aranda 2 months in the future. Every time they asked about the defense, he went out of his way to fellate Dave. He had a plan to get the job and he killed it. You have to tip your cap for that level of ambition. Hell, he may have even contributed to Miles' firing
tbc. .
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 8:21 pm
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:08 pm to Hot Carl
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 8:09 pm
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:10 pm to Hot Carl
quote:
5) I have (half-heartedly) defended Alleva, mainly because I think he made really good hires--at the time--with Trent and Nikki. They were both way more qualified than I thought we could get. Their failure is on them, rather than Alleva. But he should definitely shut-can both this year if they don't make the tourney.
Trent?
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:11 pm to Clockwatcher68
Richardson.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:12 pm to Hot Carl
Got the popkern ready for part 2
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:20 pm to LesGeaux45
usually people have these kinda threads planned out better
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:21 pm to Hot Carl
quote:
4) I don't understand why we were in such a rush. That was inexcusable, even if we had eventually determined that O was the best man for the job. There was no advantage to hurry the process.
Upvote x 1,000
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:24 pm to Hot Carl
quote:
While it has become a pretty hilarious meme, you have to give O credit for forging a masterful campaign to get the job. People seem to think he stupidly stumble his way into the gig. Not true. He obviously had his eyes on the job from the get-go. Hell, you could tell in his 1st coaches show he was in an all-out battle to retain Aranda 2 months in the future. Every time they asked about the defense, he went out of his way to fellate Dave. He had a plan to get the job and he killed it. You have to tip your cap for that level of ambition. Hell, he may have even contributed to Miles' firing
Explain to me how this is a good thing
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:27 pm to wildtigercat93
The suspense is so fun....
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:27 pm to Hot Carl
quote:
think he made really good hires--at the time--with Trent and Nikki.
Looking at it objectively, without the benefit of hindsight, Trent Johnson was a good hire on paper. Anyone would have a tough time proving otherwise.
Caldwell is a different story. Her success at UCLA was nothing to get overly excited about. In fact I'm pretty sure in her last year there, she lost to van chancellor's worst Lsu team, at home. But above anything else, alleva damn near tripled her salary when you factor in the huge break in cost of living expenses she got in moving from Los Angeles to Baton Rouge in addition to already more doubling it from 300 to 700. All in a non-revenue producing sport. For a coach that never advanced past the 2nd round of the tournament.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:28 pm to wildtigercat93
Well, he is a great politician and it also kind of goes to his purported recruiting prowess. It doesn't hurt that he knows the local audience. Just pray he can become some version of Dabo. The talent will almost always be there.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:28 pm to Hot Carl
In regards to the binder or presentation....If one was able to wow Alleva like that, how about try bringing in a few other coaches and see what kind of plan they have. Alleva should be fired for not doing that alone.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:33 pm to Hot Carl
We joke about the binder because it's probably the same 10 pages he brought to the ole miss interview in which he was hired because of!
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:34 pm to Hot Carl
How are you distinguishing between people who say things you don't agree with and people who are being intentionally dishonest?
Most of the things that seem to annoy you are things that people will think, without trying to be unfair.
Most of the things that seem to annoy you are things that people will think, without trying to be unfair.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:38 pm to Hot Carl
quote:
People seem to think he stupidly stumble his way into the gig.
Ole Miss, like LSU fell for his master plan for how he was gonna run things. Take a closer look at what the Meat Market said about the time when Ole Miss hired him.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:39 pm to molsusports
I was on the Alleva bandwagon until the Orgeron hire. He panicked like a bitch and hired coach O in a rush. He got played by a binder.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:40 pm to BilJ
O toppled the previous dictator in order to install his regime by using the power of the airwaves. he enlisted ponamsky to spread his name and begin his rise in popularity when he gave interviews while unemployed.
all the while they were plotting, they sensed that brick's time was winding down. miles was tired of second place finishes on dl recruiting and O's popularity was spreading like wildfire. he was often asked on the air if he'd take the job if offered, emphatically yes he always said.
ffw to when miles was canned, it all worked according to plan. his first duty was to reward his pal for the help on the airwaves by actually letting him into the program, unprecedented access never before seen for a media member turned glorified admin assistant.
and what happens now? all media, sub sites, everything is controlled by the regime. media sites will be granted more access than ever in favor of glowing positive articles written about the regime.
or yeah, something like that.
all the while they were plotting, they sensed that brick's time was winding down. miles was tired of second place finishes on dl recruiting and O's popularity was spreading like wildfire. he was often asked on the air if he'd take the job if offered, emphatically yes he always said.
ffw to when miles was canned, it all worked according to plan. his first duty was to reward his pal for the help on the airwaves by actually letting him into the program, unprecedented access never before seen for a media member turned glorified admin assistant.
and what happens now? all media, sub sites, everything is controlled by the regime. media sites will be granted more access than ever in favor of glowing positive articles written about the regime.
or yeah, something like that.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:40 pm to Hot Carl
I get why the binder is humorous, but he came prepared with plan and a vision and I think that's a positive.
I wanted Herman as well, and what I've come to terms with is you aren't hiring O because of resume or accomplishments, which, I think, is what drives people crazy.
O's hire is all about the plan for the future. Joe hired O because he thinks he will stick to what he does well (milking big money donors and recruiting high schoolers) and get out of the way and let his coaches do a lot of the game planning, etc.
All in all, Joe's hope is that O is Dabo Swinney, a hire that was also universally mocked as stupid and underwhelming.
I wanted Herman as well, and what I've come to terms with is you aren't hiring O because of resume or accomplishments, which, I think, is what drives people crazy.
O's hire is all about the plan for the future. Joe hired O because he thinks he will stick to what he does well (milking big money donors and recruiting high schoolers) and get out of the way and let his coaches do a lot of the game planning, etc.
All in all, Joe's hope is that O is Dabo Swinney, a hire that was also universally mocked as stupid and underwhelming.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 8:44 pm to OBUDan
Joe must have the same sensibilities as the 18 year olds that Orgeron is recruiting
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