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Good piece in The Athletic on Tab Ramos and the U-20s
Posted on 1/17/19 at 10:59 am
Posted on 1/17/19 at 10:59 am
quote:
Ramos pointed to Paul Pogba, who was released by Juventus to be able to play in the 2013 U-20 World Cup for France. Pogba was a regular starter in Serie A at the time. Similarly, Mexican stars Chucky Lozano and Erick Gutierrez were released by Pachuca during the Liga MX playoffs in order to prepare for the U-20 World Cup with Mexico. “Yet, I’ve already received a letter from an MLS club this year saying if their player is playing (in MLS) he’s not going to the World Cup,” Ramos said. “That’s already happened and we’re six months away. So I have to hope this player is doing terrible in the next six months in order to go to a World Cup? This is ludicrous. It’s ridiculous.”
quote:
One of the top U-20 players in this cycle, Alex Mendez, was never signed by the LA Galaxy out of its academy and signed with SC Freiburg in Germany. Ramos believes Mendez compares with most any top young player signed in MLS in the last few years. “When I watch him play, I’m thinking, wow, this kid is American? How is that possible? This is Riquelme.” Ramos said. “I see some of the signings in MLS that come from South America, $10-15 million, and I’m thinking let’s turn around and say Alex was born in Buenos Aires and let’s put a price tag on Alex. He’s worth every bit of $15 million. That’s how I see it.”
LINK /
2
Posted on 1/17/19 at 11:18 am to Stewie Griffin
Nice knowing you, Tab.
USSF/MLS finna eat.
You gon' get shitcanned, bruh.
USSF/MLS finna eat.
You gon' get shitcanned, bruh.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 11:31 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
So I have to hope this player is doing terrible in the next six months in order to go to a World Cup?
Or move on to your next option at that position and give a lesser known player a chance to shine.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 12:43 pm to pvilleguru
Obviously that's what he'll end up having to do. I don't think he was asking what his next move would be.
It is absolutely heinous that MLS sides do not un-arse their players in order to further develop them and provide new opportunities. There seems to be a culture of "now, now, now" in American sports, and that is beyond detrimental to the development of the USMNT.
The MLS sides are refusing to invest in their own future (not to mention the future of their sidekick, the USSF). That investment could reap monetary rewards for both sides, as well as talent rewards on the international stage as well.
It is mind-numbing to me that the people in charge of soccer in the United States in general/as a whole seem to be so sshort-sighted.
It is absolutely heinous that MLS sides do not un-arse their players in order to further develop them and provide new opportunities. There seems to be a culture of "now, now, now" in American sports, and that is beyond detrimental to the development of the USMNT.
The MLS sides are refusing to invest in their own future (not to mention the future of their sidekick, the USSF). That investment could reap monetary rewards for both sides, as well as talent rewards on the international stage as well.
It is mind-numbing to me that the people in charge of soccer in the United States in general/as a whole seem to be so sshort-sighted.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 1:34 pm to DByrd2
quote:
It is absolutely heinous that MLS sides do not un-arse their players in order to further develop them and provide new opportunities. There seems to be a culture of "now, now, now" in American sports, and that is beyond detrimental to the development of the USMNT.
Do you think it would be more beneficial for a guy like Mark McKenzie to start against Toronto, Seattle, Portland, Colorado, Minnesota, and NYRB or to get 4-6 games against U20 teams? If Bello has become a fairly regular starter, I don't know if I'd want to take him away from de Boer for 6 weeks in the middle of the season for a U17 or U20 tournament.
quote:
The MLS sides are refusing to invest in their own future (not to mention the future of their sidekick, the USSF). That investment could reap monetary rewards for both sides, as well as talent rewards on the international stage as well.
There's 2 sides to this. The MLS teams should start offering a bit more to the homegrown players (I think we are seeing that trend), but the kids also have accept the contract offer. I think we've seen a few guys already turn down MLS offers because they were already 16 or 17 and close enough to being able to sign with a European club on their own.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 1:44 pm to pvilleguru
And doesn't the influx of MLS 2 (is that we're calling them?) Show that MLS teams are investing in the kids? Sure doesn't look like they are doing it for the profit of strictly owning a USL team.
And the Galaxy just brought in te Kloese largely to help integrate younger players into the first team.
And the Galaxy just brought in te Kloese largely to help integrate younger players into the first team.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 3:03 pm to pvilleguru
quote:
Do you think it would be more beneficial for a guy like Mark McKenzie to start against Toronto, Seattle, Portland, Colorado, Minnesota, and NYRB or to get 4-6 games against U20 teams?
For MLS, the kid, or US Soccer?
Also in response to this question: By your logic here, frick the USMNT, right? As Tab referenced, even Pogba played in his U-20 WC squad. The talent needs those reps to be accumstomed to the different stage and pressures. It's another bullet on a resume both stateside and abroad.
quote:
If Bello has become a fairly regular starter, I don't know if I'd want to take him away from de Boer for 6 weeks in the middle of the season for a U17 or U20 tournament.
Then maybe US Soccer should swap to match the international schedule and have a break for international play. It really is not that hard to figure out, so why don't they do it? Money.
quote:
I think we've seen a few guys already turn down MLS offers because they were already 16 or 17 and close enough to being able to sign with a European club on their own.
That's because they can see at an EARLY age that the US does things bass-ackwards when it comes to both league/youth development and the international team, as a whole. The better option, almost regardless of if you have the talent to sign with a top flight league overseas, is to take the shot and go somewhere that will focus on your development.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 3:17 pm to DByrd2
The issue for MLS coaches is the tournament being held in the middle of the season. The more apt comparison wouldn’t be Pogba but rather a player from a Danish or Swedish team that follows a summer schedule.
I see the pros and cons to both sides. I do think the tournaments are important for the exposure these guys get to international competition and to international club teams.
I see the pros and cons to both sides. I do think the tournaments are important for the exposure these guys get to international competition and to international club teams.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 3:27 pm to cwil177
quote:
Then maybe US Soccer should swap to match the international schedule and have a break for international play.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 3:36 pm to DByrd2
quote:
For MLS, the kid, or US Soccer?
If playing the MLS games is what's best for the player's development, isn't the answer all 3?
quote:
By your logic here, frick the USMNT, right?
If it's the best thing for the player's development, isn't it the best thing for the USMNT?
quote:
Then maybe US Soccer should swap to match the international schedule and have a break for international play. It really is not that hard to figure out, so why don't they do it? Money.
I don't think US Soccer sets the MLS schedule, although MLS is taking about a 3 week break this summer for the Gold Cup. No league takes a break for youth tournaments. Who is making money because of the current schedule?
quote:
That's because they can see at an EARLY age that the US does things bass-ackwards when it comes to both league/youth development and the international team, as a whole. The better option, almost regardless of if you have the talent to sign with a top flight league overseas, is to take the shot and go somewhere that will focus on your development.
Also because, at least until recently, MLS teams have been reluctant to sell young players so there was a possibility they there wouldn't be an easy way out.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 3:47 pm to pvilleguru
It's not really some closely guarded secret that the USSF and MLS are monetary partners.
If they wanted to get on the level of the big name teams internationally, they would not have been forcing the MLS square peg into the round hole that excludes the international breaks.
Their actions in working together against the established grain are detrimental to the developmet of the sport in the US. It goes from the youth levels all the way to the top.
If they wanted to get on the level of the big name teams internationally, they would not have been forcing the MLS square peg into the round hole that excludes the international breaks.
Their actions in working together against the established grain are detrimental to the developmet of the sport in the US. It goes from the youth levels all the way to the top.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 4:08 pm to DByrd2
quote:
If they wanted to get on the level of the big name teams internationally, they would not have been forcing the MLS square peg into the round hole that excludes the international breaks.
I actually think MLS does have a break for every international window in 2019, at least looking at Atlanta's schedule they have a break during every window, excluding the knockout rounds of the Gold Cup.
MLS doesn't really need to be thinking of the big European teams right now.
This post was edited on 1/17/19 at 4:10 pm
Posted on 1/17/19 at 5:46 pm to pvilleguru
So you are totally happy with how the USSF and MLS cometely ignore the rest of the world in terms of the ways that youth development and league management are concerned?
Posted on 1/17/19 at 5:59 pm to DByrd2
I'm not completely happy with how it's run, but I really don't care too much about how the rest of the world is run.
I'm not saying don't look around to see what others are doing, but just because others are doing things a certain way, it doesn't mean we have to do the same.
I'm not saying don't look around to see what others are doing, but just because others are doing things a certain way, it doesn't mean we have to do the same.
This post was edited on 1/17/19 at 6:11 pm
Posted on 1/17/19 at 6:13 pm to pvilleguru
Those other leagues/teams are 100+ years old, more compact population/country, a massive built in fanbase, and not competing with 4 other major sports.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 6:15 pm to pvilleguru
Just keep working, tweaking, and improving to be the best league on the continent, then hemisphere, etc.
Posted on 1/17/19 at 11:27 pm to pvilleguru
I feel like pro/rep would help accelerate that.
Posted on 1/18/19 at 6:00 am to DByrd2
I really don't, and if anything, it could be damaging.
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