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re: Israel is commencing a Passover Assault on Iran right now
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:09 am to RogerTheShrubber
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:09 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
If all is fair in war, then so be it. Lets stop complaining and let one side take the other out.
Thats whats best for the long run. End aid and influence, take gloves off, let this be settled.
The difference between myself and the brainwashed leftist simpletons that are currently “protesting” these days is that I am totally fine with what you said and I don’t care if Israel kills every single one of them. But I just and sick of repeating their lies for them, and I’m sick of the United States rubber stamping everything they do and funding them no matter what.
If they kill everyone in Gaza and get into a major war with their neighbors you and I both know the US will get involved whether we like it or not, and that is fricking bullshite. So until that changes, then the Israelis need to quit crying and being hypocrites
1
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:12 am to OBReb6
quote:
The difference between myself and the brainwashed leftist simpletons that are currently “protesting” these days is that I am totally fine with what you said
This has gone on waaay too long, its time to settle it.
Let them fight, one side prevails.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:12 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
This is all well and good, but this was also 80 years ago. The current reality is finding a two state solution, which neither side seems to really want.
Neither side is interested because Israel doesn’t feel like Palestine would be anything other than a terrorist state. And frankly Palestinians don’t want to be a state because it would keep them from being anything but a terrorist state.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:14 am to RogerTheShrubber
Again, it’s different tactics that the superior power uses to make an enemy that refuses to surrender submit. It’s not the smaller and more personal tactics of terrorists.
Wait a minute, are you sensing a double standard I may have? Nope. Again, I don’t actually have a problem with Israel’s conduct in Gaza. They can bomb and bomb until they are all dead. The problem is that I’m not going to repeat their perpetual victimhood narratives. They created this situation.
Also, the aforementioned countries we bombed were at one time legitimate powers and militaries, and Hamas is not that. But even then I’m still granting that I don’t care what the Israelis are doing there.
I don’t want the US automatically involved every time they get themselves into trouble. Period. And being honest about what they do and who they are is the only way public opinion will ever shift on this.
Wait a minute, are you sensing a double standard I may have? Nope. Again, I don’t actually have a problem with Israel’s conduct in Gaza. They can bomb and bomb until they are all dead. The problem is that I’m not going to repeat their perpetual victimhood narratives. They created this situation.
Also, the aforementioned countries we bombed were at one time legitimate powers and militaries, and Hamas is not that. But even then I’m still granting that I don’t care what the Israelis are doing there.
I don’t want the US automatically involved every time they get themselves into trouble. Period. And being honest about what they do and who they are is the only way public opinion will ever shift on this.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:15 am to OBReb6
quote:
There is a story that happened between the two sentences
Do you mean in 1947 when the Brits terminated Mandatory Palestine and then the following day the Palestinian Arabs, backed by the Arab Liberation Army, began attacking and killing Jews?
For those curious, here is the flag of the Arab Liberation Army:
While it's good to understand history and how it's influenced current events, people can choose whether or not to be slaves to it. Muslims in the region who hate Israel enough to teach their kids to kill Jews simply for the sake of being Jews is a choice they make every morning when they wake up.
This post was edited on 4/19/24 at 9:17 am
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:17 am to Bard
quote:
Do you mean in 1947 when the Brits terminated Mandatory Palestine and then the following day the Palestinian Arabs, backed by the Arab Liberation Army, began attacking and killing Jews?
Did you read nothing I wrote?
This post was edited on 4/19/24 at 9:21 am
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:20 am to OBReb6
quote:
Did you read nothing I wrote?
Not really. I was busy responding (and doing my job).
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:22 am to Bard
What I said is there were a ton of events that happened between the “Israel got sick of waiting and said they were incorporating the country”, and “the Arab countries invaded”
And it’s incredibly relevant
And it’s incredibly relevant
This post was edited on 4/19/24 at 9:24 am
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:34 am to Bard
I want to address your other point with a thought experiment.
Ok let’s take United States. This isn’t a perfect example but it’s about as close as we have here.
What are southerners attitudes towards northerners these days? Maybe here and there is some half hearted animosity (though some of my relatives who have now passed away loathed them, as my family has been on the same block of land in Mississippi since around 1800). Overall though it’s just well meaning ribbing back and forth for the most part.
This is because the US went to great lengths to promote reconciliation and healing. Something lost with the current controversy over confederate monuments is that I would argue back when they were erected they provided a lot of power in restoring the southern people’s sense of honor and allowed them to heal rather than be resentful.
Moving on. Imagine that after the war had ended, the northern troops continued their occupation indefinitely. All southerners had no citizenship or other rights, were unable to leave the country or even travel freely in the south. Periodically the northern troops kill people you know who are dissenters, and by their own rhetoric you know that the north is never going to grant you your rights back, ever.
In that situation, how do you think the populace here would react? You think we would just give up? That we would accept we should accept our position and not be “slaves to history”?
I want you to think about this honestly
quote:
While it's good to understand history and how it's influenced current events, people can choose whether or not to be slaves to it. Muslims in the region who hate Israel enough to teach their kids to kill Jews simply for the sake of being Jews is a choice they make every morning when they wake up.
Ok let’s take United States. This isn’t a perfect example but it’s about as close as we have here.
What are southerners attitudes towards northerners these days? Maybe here and there is some half hearted animosity (though some of my relatives who have now passed away loathed them, as my family has been on the same block of land in Mississippi since around 1800). Overall though it’s just well meaning ribbing back and forth for the most part.
This is because the US went to great lengths to promote reconciliation and healing. Something lost with the current controversy over confederate monuments is that I would argue back when they were erected they provided a lot of power in restoring the southern people’s sense of honor and allowed them to heal rather than be resentful.
Moving on. Imagine that after the war had ended, the northern troops continued their occupation indefinitely. All southerners had no citizenship or other rights, were unable to leave the country or even travel freely in the south. Periodically the northern troops kill people you know who are dissenters, and by their own rhetoric you know that the north is never going to grant you your rights back, ever.
In that situation, how do you think the populace here would react? You think we would just give up? That we would accept we should accept our position and not be “slaves to history”?
I want you to think about this honestly
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:42 am to OBReb6
quote:
What are southerners attitudes towards northerners these days?
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:43 am to RogerTheShrubber
What are you trying to say?
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:45 am to OBReb6
Youre trying to relate unrelatable things.
Most modern people dont have North vs South animosity.
Most modern people dont have North vs South animosity.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:48 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
The current reality is finding a two state solution, which neither side seems to really want.
Israel has agreed to a two state solution several times. Each time it has been met with bombs and terrorism from Palestine.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:49 am to troyt37
Pretty much.
Israel has given up on the two state solution from what I have seen for that very reason.
Israel has given up on the two state solution from what I have seen for that very reason.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:50 am to RogerTheShrubber
Ok first of all, I stressed that it’s not a good example but it’s the closest thing we have in this country.
Secondly you live in Alaska so I know you don’t give a shite. Most people on this message board live in the south, and a lot of those have at least some perspective of what I’m talking about. And the point is that relations are good, but they are only good because the government went to extreme lengths to make them good, and even then there are still some who have some form of animosity.
But the animosity is mostly underlying and not something that is frequently in one’s conscious. It’s mostly underneath at a deeper level, northerners and southerners still have reflexive thoughts of one another to this day.
Secondly you live in Alaska so I know you don’t give a shite. Most people on this message board live in the south, and a lot of those have at least some perspective of what I’m talking about. And the point is that relations are good, but they are only good because the government went to extreme lengths to make them good, and even then there are still some who have some form of animosity.
But the animosity is mostly underlying and not something that is frequently in one’s conscious. It’s mostly underneath at a deeper level, northerners and southerners still have reflexive thoughts of one another to this day.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:51 am to troyt37
quote:
Israel has agreed to a two state solution several times. Each time it has been met with bombs and terrorism from Palestine.
Yep. But its not something the Palestinians are willing to work with.
It will end in their scattering, and it will be their own choice.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:52 am to OBReb6
quote:
It’s mostly underneath at a deeper level, northerners and southerners still have reflexive thoughts of one another to this day.
A lot of it comes down to “don’t waltz into my area and tell me how wrong I am.”
Ask California transplants how welcomed they are in Montana, Idaho, and other areas. People with rental cars will put signs up saying “I’m from here, this is just a rental!” on it to prevent vandalism.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:52 am to troyt37
quote:
Israel has agreed to a two state solution several times. Each time it has been met with bombs and terrorism from Palestine.
Each time this has happened it’s been baked with poison pills.
But even ignoring that, you have to understand the attitude of the Palestinians and the entirety of how many times they were lied to and then stripped of everything, and then it makes sense that they see negotiating in one of these agreements seems insane to them. Negotiating with terrorists, if you will.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:54 am to OBReb6
Define “poison pills”.
Both sides have to give in order for there to be a deal and by most accounts, Palestinians were offered 90% or more of what they requested.
Hard lines tend to be on things like “right of return”, which are never fricking happening and exist mainly as a bargaining position to come back from.
Both sides have to give in order for there to be a deal and by most accounts, Palestinians were offered 90% or more of what they requested.
Hard lines tend to be on things like “right of return”, which are never fricking happening and exist mainly as a bargaining position to come back from.
Posted on 4/19/24 at 9:56 am to OBReb6
quote:
What I said is there were a ton of events that happened between the “Israel got sick of waiting and said they were incorporating the country”, and “the Arab countries invaded”
Oh, that. Yes. My response included the immediate aftermath of the Brits pulling out, when the Arabs responded to the pullout by indiscriminately killing Jews as it's also an incredibly relevant event (underscoring why the Jews felt the need to establish their own country on their ancestral lands).
I thought you meant you had included some of those missed events you mentioned.
This post was edited on 4/19/24 at 9:57 am
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