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Started By
Message
Is health care, by nature, a sham?
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:46 am
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:46 am
Full disclosure trying to understand insurance is nearly impossible for my brain and I'm definitely not an economist.
However, simple logic tells me that health care companies make an insane amount of money. Also, doctors make a lot of money. So in our current system we, the people/patients, are paying enough money to make multiple entities rich. Thus, does it not make simple sense that by cutting out one of those entities everyone would pay less overall?
Someone smarter in this area than me explain how that doesn't make sense...
However, simple logic tells me that health care companies make an insane amount of money. Also, doctors make a lot of money. So in our current system we, the people/patients, are paying enough money to make multiple entities rich. Thus, does it not make simple sense that by cutting out one of those entities everyone would pay less overall?
Someone smarter in this area than me explain how that doesn't make sense...
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:49 am to RandySavage
insurance is scam
most people will pay way more in insurance than they would ever pay for actual services
most people will pay way more in insurance than they would ever pay for actual services
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:50 am to RandySavage
My opinions on the person who does this show are mixed, but he does a pretty good one on Healthcare:
Adam Ruins Everything - Why hospitals are so expensive
Adding the name of the show so that anyone who does not want to give views to him will not be sucker punched by the link.
Adam Ruins Everything - Why hospitals are so expensive
Adding the name of the show so that anyone who does not want to give views to him will not be sucker punched by the link.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:51 am to RandySavage
quote:
health care companies make an insane amount of money.
Since your entire argument hinges on this easily investigated premise, you might want to verify this statement instead of making an assumption.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:51 am to RandySavage
quote:
Full disclosure trying to understand insurance is nearly impossible for my brain and I'm definitely not an economist.
After reading the rest of your post, the disclaimer was unnecessary.
quote:
However, simple logic tells me that health care companies make an insane amount of money. Also, doctors make a lot of money. So in our current system we, the people/patients, are paying enough money to make multiple entities rich. Thus, does it not make simple sense that by cutting out one of those entities everyone would pay less overall?
Cutting doctors out of the healthcare seems like a pretty bad idea. Maybe I'm wrong.
I think you might be getting close to a point that is legit though. Overall medical costs (like doctors salaries) are unsustainable and no one is trying to do anything about it.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:52 am to Salmon
quote:
most people will pay way more in insurance than they would ever pay for actual services
And most people will pay more flood insurance than they will ever pay to repair flood damage. But should we worry about most people or all people?
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:53 am to RandySavage
Insurance by its nature is a pool of like-minded individuals paying premiums into a fund to help offset any unforeseen costs to indemnify (make whole) an individual for their expenses for, in this case, medical costs.
It's only when greed and society - building get in the way that problems are created. Where there is money, there's always a target.
It's only when greed and society - building get in the way that problems are created. Where there is money, there's always a target.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:55 am to RandySavage
The current healthcare 'system' is practically the opposite of a free market.
It's basic structure, in terms of supply, cost, pricing, financing, or efficiency is in no way representative of reality...
Edited to include:
I was born in 1960 and the cost of my hospital natural birth with 2 nights in the hospital was $182.45 . Average cost of the same today is in the low-end neighborhood of $5,500.00 (depending on the hospital, it could be much more) - change/increase of nearly 3000%.
Sure, that's nearly 60 years ago which is pre-history to some of you amoebas. But to put it in perspective, average costs of homes and cars haven't moved even close that much during the same period.
It's basic structure, in terms of supply, cost, pricing, financing, or efficiency is in no way representative of reality...
Edited to include:
I was born in 1960 and the cost of my hospital natural birth with 2 nights in the hospital was $182.45 . Average cost of the same today is in the low-end neighborhood of $5,500.00 (depending on the hospital, it could be much more) - change/increase of nearly 3000%.
Sure, that's nearly 60 years ago which is pre-history to some of you amoebas. But to put it in perspective, average costs of homes and cars haven't moved even close that much during the same period.
This post was edited on 7/28/17 at 8:16 am
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:58 am to RandySavage
I could be wrong but I believe insurers have razor thin margins. They make money because they insure a ton of people.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 7:58 am to RandySavage
quote:
However, simple logic tells me that health care companies make an insane amount of money. Also, doctors make a lot of money. So in our current system we, the people/patients, are paying enough money to make multiple entities rich. Thus, does it not make simple sense that by cutting out one of those entities everyone would pay less overall?
We're trying to operate both a capitalist healthcare system, which drives innovation by attracting investor money, in conjunction with a welfare-based healthcare system in which the poor have the same access to care as those who can afford private HC.
This clearly isn't working and the 2 need to be separated.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:01 am to RandySavage
I know one thing, healthcare is a golden political talking point that has the highest potential to gain votes. Healthcare can be used to hold people politically hostage.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:10 am to Roll Tide Ravens
$8294 premium, family of 4, on a group plan. And my boss catches some additional cost on top of that.
Next state of union address should start like this,
American people you are looking at 535 of the worlds biggest thieves. Along with any of their predecessors they have taken your money and lined their pockets with it.
I have a feeling that insurance companies razor thin margins are wider than my ex wives arse.
Next state of union address should start like this,
American people you are looking at 535 of the worlds biggest thieves. Along with any of their predecessors they have taken your money and lined their pockets with it.
I have a feeling that insurance companies razor thin margins are wider than my ex wives arse.
This post was edited on 7/28/17 at 12:11 pm
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:12 am to RandySavage
quote:
Someone smarter in this area than me explain how that doesn't make sense...
How are you going to cut out providers?
How are you going to cut out insurance? You going to pay $100,000 out of pocket for that surgery?
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:17 am to Pfft
quote:
$8294 premium, family of 4, on a group plan. And my boss catches some additional cost on top of that.
Next year it will probably be close to $9000. If the Skinny Repeal would have become law it would be over $10,000. This was an attempt to score political points while making the situation worse for you and almost every other person living in this country.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:18 am to rintintin
quote:Wrong.
I could be wrong but I believe insurers have razor thin margins.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:31 am to Haughton99
quote:
Cutting doctors out of the healthcare seems like a pretty bad idea. Maybe I'm wrong.
I thought it was pretty clear which one I was talking about cutting out.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:35 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
How are you going to cut out insurance? You going to pay $100,000 out of pocket for that surgery?
I guess what I'm saying is cut out insurance and make prices reasonable again like what they were basically saying in that video somebody posted. No surgery truly costs $100,000.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:41 am to RandySavage
quote:
I guess what I'm saying is cut out insurance and make prices reasonable again like what they were basically saying in that video somebody posted. No surgery truly costs $100,000.
It's not really insurance that drives up the cost of surgery. Most Americans could probably afford most routine, preventative care from their primary doc absent insurance. Those private practices really aren't making much money.
Hospitals are a different animal. What they charge sometimes just doesn't make any sense. For example, a year or so ago I woke up in extreme pain. Knew immediately it was a kidney stone. Went to one of those new free standing ER's affiliated with a local hospital system. I was in there 3 hours, tops. Had a CT scan, they shot me up with demoral(sp?) and gave me a prescription for pain pills. Looked at the claim a week later and the bill was $12,000. That makes absolutely no sense that such a short visit cost so much. And I don't think there's an easy fix for that, unfortunately.
Posted on 7/28/17 at 8:42 am to The Spleen
quote:
Looked at the claim a week later and the bill was $12,000. That makes absolutely no sense that such a short visit cost so much. And I don't think there's an easy fix for that, unfortunately.
Why not? I don't think there is anyone in their right mind that thinks this is necessary or acceptable so why is there not more, if any, of an effort to change it.
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