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re: Iraq's Fallujah falls to Qaeda-linked militants
Posted on 1/5/14 at 6:44 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
Posted on 1/5/14 at 6:44 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
Bush deserves blame for gong in the first place.
Obama deserves blame for leaving prematurely.
A total cluster frick in American foreign policy all the way around. Split it up and play them against each other.
The Great Game part 2.
Obama deserves blame for leaving prematurely.
A total cluster frick in American foreign policy all the way around. Split it up and play them against each other.
The Great Game part 2.
This post was edited on 1/5/14 at 6:45 pm
1
Posted on 1/5/14 at 7:30 pm to blowmeauburn
quote:
Obama deserves blame for leaving prematurely.
We could have stayed there another decade and the end result would have been the same. they are going to do it the Iraqi way which is civil war, or a strong man like Saddam that uses enough force and fear to keep everyone together.
Posted on 1/5/14 at 7:33 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Cause you were told to. Just like the rest of us. Don't try to make it more than it is. It's depressing when you do that.
I've already come to terms with the fact that the mission was of marginal worth at best. But I actually still feel good about my role though in taking care of my marines and sailors.
Posted on 1/5/14 at 7:40 pm to Qwerty
quote:
We could have stayed there another decade and the end result would have been the same.
Absolutely agreed. The religious and tribal cleavages are insurmountable, at least in the short term. Hell, we could have stayed for 50 years and we'd still be dealing with these issues.
quote:
But I actually still feel good about my role though in taking care of my marines and sailors.
quote:
The West goes to Saudi Arabia, or forms their own country.
The East goes to Iran, or forms their own country.
The North can have their own country.
I suspect the Iraqi's (Shiite, Sunni, and Kurd) would prefer to have their own countries. I can't imagine they'd want to answer to Riyadh or Tehran for example. I suspect actually dividing the country would be impossible, the backlash would be insurmountable.
My solution would be this, divide the country into three largely sufficient states within a greater federal structure. If the division works - then fantastic. If the Iraqi's prove unable to govern together then the division would simplify secession. The breakup would result in conflict and ethnic cleansing - but it should also bring peace and stability over the long haul.
This post was edited on 1/5/14 at 7:49 pm
Posted on 1/5/14 at 8:20 pm to Alahunter
quote:
So much for Al Qaeda being on the run.
Every time you fight "not to win" - you succeed.
Posted on 1/5/14 at 8:31 pm to Ace Midnight
Make glass.
Posted on 1/5/14 at 8:46 pm to Qwerty
quote:
I've already come to terms with the fact that the mission was of marginal worth at best. But I actually still feel good about my role though in taking care of my marines and sailors.
Semper Fidelis
When were you there if you don't mind me asking?
Posted on 1/5/14 at 8:54 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
I have said, about a million times. Our involvement in Iraq was not worth the blood of a single American soldier, sailor, marine or airman.
This is playing out exactly how I thought it would.
This is playing out exactly how I thought it would.
Posted on 1/5/14 at 9:01 pm to asurob1
quote:
This is playing out exactly how I thought it would.
As Fallujah goes, so goes Anbar. As Anbar goes, so goes Iraq.
This could very well turn out to make the Syrian civil war or the American occupation look like a playground tussle.
Posted on 1/5/14 at 11:47 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
I'm letting this story affect me more than I probably should. I left quite a few friends on the streets of Fallujah and Ramadi.
I imagine your reactions are exactly appropriate. Hang in there.
Posted on 1/5/14 at 11:51 pm to Alahunter
It was until we quit and went home. We won the closest thing to peace Iraq will see in 2008. And Iraq was even making progress on the political benchmarks. They were just a few months from a full oil revenue sharing deal. Barack Obama gets into office with his 2006 Lions for Lambs Pre Surge Iraq Strategy and took his ball and went home. Well I should say he followed Bush's status of forces agreement but did nothing to secure permanent bases or link the drawdown to security assessments.
Way to go dumbass
Way to go dumbass
Posted on 1/5/14 at 11:57 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
divide the country into three largely sufficient states within a greater federal structure. If the division works - then fantastic. If the Iraqi's prove unable to govern together then the division would simplify secession. The breakup would result in conflict and ethnic cleansing - but it should also bring peace and stability over the long haul.
Basically what they have now with the Iraqi Constitution, just no American backup for security purposes.
Once we won the peace with the Surge we should have made long term plans to stay on the bases, in Baghdad, the Kurdish areas, and any potential powder kegs.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:07 am to TejasPete
quote:
I did three tours in Iraq (2 in Baghdad)
Thanks for your service
quote:
at least under Saddam you could walk down the street and go to a cafe and not risk dying.
Unfortunately when you have highly limited freedom, when walking down the street you weren't necessarily at risk of dying but by the same token are you really living?
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:07 am to Libertyabides71
quote:
Well I should say he followed Bush's status of forces agreement but did nothing to secure permanent bases or link the drawdown to security assessments.
Baghdad was never going to sign a SOFA. Kabul wont either, and for largely the same reasons.
As painful as it is - cutting bait was the right decision.
quote:
Unfortunately when you have highly limited freedom, when walking down the street you weren't necessarily at risk of dying but by the same token are you really living?
Liberty doesn't mean a thing without personal security.
This post was edited on 1/6/14 at 12:10 am
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:13 am to Qwerty
quote:To keep Saddam from creating his oil bourse that threatened to sell oil in currency other than the dollar.
So why did I go to fallujah?
Was it worth it?
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:14 am to asurob1
quote:
This is playing out exactly how I thought it would.
Well damn Nostradumbass you should have phoned in your perfect foreknowledge to The White House, Congress, and The Pentagon...tool!
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:17 am to TejasPete
quote:Those ungrateful bastards!
the overwhelming majority of Iraqis I met said they missed Saddam because under Saddam everyone was afraid of him while now everyone was afraid of everyone and at least under Saddam you could walk down the street and go to a cafe and not risk dying.
How dare they not accept death in exchange for our freedoms.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:19 am to Lima Whiskey
quote:
Liberty doesn't mean a thing without personal security.
Well I beg to differ because without liberty, what do you have to live for in the first place?
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:23 am to FT
quote:They're determined by whatever helps put out propaganda such as this story.
What I'm curious about is how they determine what groups are "linked" to what other groups.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:23 am to Crimson1st
quote:
Well damn Nostradumbass you should have phoned in your perfect foreknowledge to The White House, Congress, and The Pentagon...tool!
Washington has been living in a cool-aid fueled fantasy land for a decade now. There were plenty of people who predicted this - unfortunately it wasn't the right prediction, so it was largely ignored.
quote:
Well I beg to differ because without liberty, what do you have to live for in the first place?
The right to life is our foremost liberty.
quote:
How dare they not accept death in exchange for our freedoms.
This post was edited on 1/6/14 at 12:27 am
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